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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Struggling to make ends meet as a junior doctor. AIBU?

999 replies

HK3444 · 03/01/2024 22:39

Struggling to make ends meet. Rent has gone up, food bills are going up and struggling to support my kids.

I’m someone worked really hard through medical school, it felt like endless exams and accumulated student debt with the hope that I’d be able to support my family comfortably at the end of the degree and but also feel job satisfaction bettering the health of others.

Not sure what this was all for… can’t believe I’m in this situation as a doctor

OP posts:

Thread gallery

greensleevez · 04/01/2024 17:26

ReallyAgainReally · 04/01/2024 17:06

@HK3444 Where is (are) the dad/dads? Or was it a sperm doner situation? CHILDREN ARE EXPENSIVE- look right there and no further!

Solicitors also can struggle and don't start threads on MN. Stop wanting to put the country's inflation back up with all 35% pay rise demands, no matter how you feel you got there. Do you not also care about those at risk of losing their homes or small businesses aka their livelihood the longer interest rates stays high due to 'junior doctors' inflationary demands.

I say go Rishi, and Victoria go.

All other sectors of the society are struggling. Solicitors also spend many years at law school and then pray to get a training contract which is never guaranteed.

Of course, when the economy improves, do approach the new Gov with whatever % increase you want.

There endth the lesson.

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I thought I was too old to be shocked but this post really takes the biscuit.

Freysimo · 04/01/2024 17:28

Boomer55 · 04/01/2024 17:16

But Labour have said they won’t be looking at agreeing to anywhere near a 35% increase…they want root and branch reform of the NHS.

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I'd seriously think about voting Labour if they promised reform of the NHS, but it's such a sacred cow in the UK I doubt they'd do it.

digitupgoahead · 04/01/2024 17:28

Outthedoor24 · 04/01/2024 17:07

How many hours is part-time?

Do you have other options like Pharmacy? That's more likely to be regular hours?

The OP isn't a pharmacist though, she's a doctor.

jamsandwich1 · 04/01/2024 17:28

I can’t read through all the replies but anyone who is saying YABU because you earn an above average wage… WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? Of course doctors bloody should! Is it an average job?
I despair.
Strike hard 🦀🦀🦀

mumsneedwine · 04/01/2024 17:28

@ReallyAgainReally doctors have to pay for further exams, indemnity insurance and parking at the hospital. Out of their own pocket. Exams can cost £000s a year. And are hard.
I'm sure they'd love £30 an hour !

IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos · 04/01/2024 17:28

@EasternStandard 12% would be a good start for them.

Personally, I think the whole country needs overhauling. I don't see how it could be done, but I can't believe we're in a position where newly qualified doctors earn almost a third of an MP who is just starting out too.

We need to place value on the right things.

jasflowers · 04/01/2024 17:28

Newchapterbeckons · 04/01/2024 17:21

I am sorry about your mum, but we can’t service 70 million users on a free health service from birth to a 100 years old. Statistically it’s impossible.
At some point someone is going to have to be honest with the public.

The nhs was not designed to do what is now expected of it. I don’t know how we have staggered on for as long as we have.

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Thankyou, appreciated.

My point is that these JDs are not just striking for pay now but for the future of the NHS, they will eventually become tomo's consultants, consultants needed to save people like my mum.

NHS really does need reform, but fundamentally without staff, no reform will ever work.

Like i said upthread, if £20bn can be found for tax cuts, why can't some of this money go to paying its staff?

EasternStandard · 04/01/2024 17:28

@greensleevez also same q to you. Do you think 12% in one year is reasonable?

EasternStandard · 04/01/2024 17:30

IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos · 04/01/2024 17:28

@EasternStandard 12% would be a good start for them.

We need to place value on the right things.

But that’s what they have already this year with the 9% plus 3%?

So why strike if it’s reasonable?

jasflowers · 04/01/2024 17:31

Freysimo · 04/01/2024 17:28

I'd seriously think about voting Labour if they promised reform of the NHS, but it's such a sacred cow in the UK I doubt they'd do it.

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They have promised it, Wes Streeting has been to Europe and Australia to see how health is done there.

He wants some very un Labour reforms and good on him.

greensleevez · 04/01/2024 17:32

EasternStandard · 04/01/2024 17:28

@greensleevez also same q to you. Do you think 12% in one year is reasonable?

I think listening to the junior doctors' concerns and taking them seriously would be reasonable.

Narratoritis · 04/01/2024 17:33

I know it's a completely different system, but when my husband, an American doctor, was told about a health professionals salary in the UK, he assumed that was their monthly amount and was absolutely staggered to find that was in fact an annual salary.
All healthcare workers are much better paid here. The average Nurse in the USA will make more than a British doctor with the same years of experience.

jasflowers · 04/01/2024 17:33

JDs want a deal done on pay restoration too, as has been agreed in Scotland.

Govt has refused point blank.

ParisParody · 04/01/2024 17:33

Mumaway · 04/01/2024 17:16

No, they probably didn't. You don't even know how much you'll be earning in the next six months, or where you'll be working, due to the rotational nature of training.

When the poster chose their career at age 16-18, I suspect they weren't financially savvy, nor understood how years of below inflation pay progression would impact on their finances many years later. They possibly also didn't anticipate the rises in uni fees and cost of living, because they were for all intents and purposes children when making those life-changing decisions.

And while their salary may be higher than many, it also is for more hours, and much more responsibility than almost any other sector with the same level of qualification. Those longer hours also mean that 'standard' childcare like childminders and nurseries don't work, because they're simply not available at the right time, meaning nannies, and more cost.

The poster also rightly points out that costs are ongoing. Postgraduate exams are hugely expensive and mandatory to progress. You require certain courses which are not fully funded to progress. You require indemnity despite working for the NHS, just in case something goes wrong and you are sold up the river by the least supportive employers around.

I fully support all NHS staff to strike, as the entire system has been run on goodwill for too long.

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Exactly.

It’s ridiculous people berating 17/18y olds for not predicting the future. However bright they are, at that age, they cannot fully understand about the implications of mortgages, cost of living, family life, changing interest rates etc. The future seems very far away when you are still a teenager. And they are surrounded by adults telling them what a great career it is and how fabulous and clever they are.

How long should their decision to study Medicine be held against them? Are they never allowed to complain?

jamsandwich1 · 04/01/2024 17:33

thegruffalosmaw · 04/01/2024 17:16

some of these problems are of your own doing OP.
You chose to have a child - did you not consider things like childcare costs / provision / stable relationship / family support etc beforehand?
You chose to live where you live - I don't believe its impossible to relocate.

You can believe what you like but once you’re in a training programme it is impossible to relocate unless you give up your number and start again with no guarantee you’ll get in again.

EasternStandard · 04/01/2024 17:34

greensleevez · 04/01/2024 17:32

I think listening to the junior doctors' concerns and taking them seriously would be reasonable.

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Ok so no answer on 12%?

It’s like getting an answer from a Labour politician

Newchapterbeckons · 04/01/2024 17:34

It’s a shame at the centre of this Tory kicking exercise is the patients life hanging in the balance.

avocadotofu · 04/01/2024 17:35

I absolutely agree OP, it's truly awful how little doctors are paid for such a crazy workload/responsibility. You all have my support.

Clavinova · 04/01/2024 17:36

The BMA is a highly politicised activist movement now and a world away from putting patient safety at the forefront of anything!

I've just had a quick look at the Twitter/X feed for the current Chair of the BMA
(Phillip Banfield @ DrPhilBanfield).
There's a clip of an interview he gave to Robert Peston on 20 December - Banfield says;

"I work in Wales, where there is no strike action" -

not on that day, but only two days before (18 Dec) junior doctors in Wales voted overwhelmingly for strike action;

https://www.bma.org.uk/bma-media-centre/junior-doctors-in-wales-vote-overwhelmingly-for-strike-action

No mention of the vote in Wales on Banfield's Twitter/X feed for 18/19 Dec either - although he did repost the mandate for strike action for SAS members in England.

Newchapterbeckons · 04/01/2024 17:37

GE half way through the year. Just announced! So this might well be a Labour problem soon. And given they have no intention of meeting a 35% pay rise either this strike action is a total waste of time.

Narratoritis · 04/01/2024 17:37

Average nurse salary in our state, obviously those with further training such as Nurse Practitioners make significantly more.

$101.67k = Sterling: 80.18k

Outthedoor24 · 04/01/2024 17:38

digitupgoahead · 04/01/2024 17:28

The OP isn't a pharmacist though, she's a doctor.

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They share much of the same training. It might be worth the Op reviewing her options and career choices.

Newchapterbeckons · 04/01/2024 17:38

What a low bar this is for the country.

Newchapterbeckons · 04/01/2024 17:39

Good luck op.

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