To disagree with the MN classic ‘it’s only a joke if everyone is laughing’

[Planeflames]

I see this posted a lot and I am confused as to why people think this is even remotely accurate.

It’s a basic fact people have different senses of humour. Just because you don’t find something funny doesn’t mean it’s not a joke, or that the person delivering the comment wasn’t joking. Same applies with banter usually on this site.

Wanted to see if I was missing anything so a poll might help.

YABU - of course unless everyone is laughing something isn’t a joke

YANBU - it’s a stupid saying

So there's two or more of you poking fun and making jokes about someone else.
They're not laughing

But it's still funny, yes?

None of the things those blokes said to the OP on the other thread were funny though. Dark or cutting humour can be really funny in the right context and to the right audience. That doesn't mean humour has to be dark or cutting to be funny, and it certainly doesn't mean all dark or cutting attempts at humour are actually funny. The messages the other OP had received sounded like they were from 12 year-old boys dicking around. If you thought they sounded funny, I think the one with the poor sense of humour here is you, OP.

You've tried the skew the results of the poll by misrepresenting what it means, so you get proven right on the other thread. It hasn't worked

You've tried the skew the results of the poll by misrepresenting what it means, so you get proven right on the other thread. It hasn't worked

Yes. At first I thought the OP had just misunderstood the expression, but that's clearly not the case.

Surely anyone who disagrees with the principle that it's not funny to make offensive or hurtful jokes at someone else's expense when they are not laughing along, or unless it's in retaliation, is simply not a very pleasant person?

One way of clarifying matters can be asking to have the joke explained.....if the joker has to tie themselves in knots to explain the humour, this will probably make intentions clear.
I have often found that merry quippers become rather defensive if paid back in their own coin, but if you don't have a comeback ready, this can be enlightening.

I guess I'm flattered by how invested in my thread you are.

In response to your question here, you are right that intent matters. I was just reading another thread about the curly girl method and someone said it went wrong for her and her husband called her Hagrid. I too have curly/crazy hair, and if one of my close friends had made that observation, I would have found it funny because I would have known that their intent would have been to make me laugh. Even if I was feeling a bit sensitive that day and didn't find it funny, it would still be a joke, just a poorly delivered one. However if someone walking past me on the street had seen my hair failure and shouted Hagrid at me or if someone who didn't like me had made that observation, then I wouldn't have found it funny. Because in those cases the intent would have been to insult me. Even if they then followed it up with "it's just a joke". Insulting someone and then claiming it was a joke, doesn't make it a joke. It's the same comment and the same recipient, but the intent is so different.

So no, not everyone has to be laughing, but the joke has to actually be a joke, not a poorly desguised insult.

And going back to my original thread, my problem is that I can't tell if he has weird humour, in which case it's fine, albeit a bit boring or if he actually is being unkind and disguising his comments as jokes so he (and his friends?) can laugh at me.

My brother will quite often "joke" that if I lost weight/ shaved my legs more often/ was less of a feminist/ whatever then maybe I wouldn't be single

Aside from the fact I'm single because I want to be how the fuck is that a joke?

It doesn't apply to general comedy, obviously. Only when it's being used as an excuse for being hurtful.
I say it to my son when he's upsetting his sister. "It was just a joke" is used too often as an excuse to be cruel or wind the other person up. So I'll say it then.

Maybe MN could do one of those discussions where they ask a comedian to come on and answer questions. (MN, don’t invite Cleverly, he thinks he made a joke, but it was disgusting and not a joke.)

you seem totally devoid of humour or personality

You seem totally unable to recognise that you're a bully rather than a comedian.

Well they should because joking is a natural part of human interaction. If you don’t want jokes, don’t interact with people?

Agree. OP your response showed neither 'humour' (other than of a rather juvenile nature) not 'personality'. You seem on the defensive now because people aren't amused. Maybe just accept you're not as funny as you think you are?

This. 👆

I've not seen the claim that EVERYONE/most people must agree that something's a joke or not. What I have seen is the observation that if someone is typically making jokes that no one in the audience/social group that's hearing them finds funny, and/or that people are generally experiencing as something other than a joke (an insult, an inconvenience, etc.) then perhaps it's worth rethinking whether "joke" really describes these comments accurately.

There was a post recently from someone whose partner keeps commenting cryptically but critically about her level of fitness, a subject she's sensitive about and he knows she is. When she tells him she's uncomfortable with the comments/experiences them as confusing and sometimes hurtful, he insists that they are "jokes", as if that somehow preempts any criticism she might have of his words or interactions. That kind of thing gets tiresome quickly.

Having thought about this @Planeflames I think that you are right because humour is nuanced, But then I also think that if your humour is mean, belittling or bullying to another person then they should be able to punch you in the mouth without any repercussions, but then you wouldn't like that.

There was a post recently from someone whose partner keeps commenting cryptically but critically about her level of fitness, a subject she's sensitive about and he knows she is. When she tells him she's uncomfortable with the comments/experiences them as confusing and sometimes hurtful, he insists that they are "jokes", as if that somehow preempts any criticism she might have of his words or interactions. That kind of thing gets tiresome quickly.
I told a friend's DP to stop it with the "jokes" like that about something my friend was sensitive about and working on.
What was more annoying is that he subsequently made similar "jokes" around me and my DH, presumably because he thought he'd get man points for it. DH also told him to stop it because it wasn't funny.
The DP has been better since, but it shouldn't have taken another man to tell him his so called jokes weren't funny to make a small change.

@CheekyHobson burned! Now that's funny!

Burned! Now that's funny!!