AIBU to worry about the hold alcohol has on the UK?

[whyhere]

Prompted by a thread about an alcohol-free wedding, and some of the comments therein ('boring.... wouldn't go.... take a hip-flask....'), it seems to me that the need for/expectation of alcohol has really taken a grip in this country. Can people really not enjoy anything without alcohol? Is it really impossible to create a soap scene without alcohol being involved (yes, EE, I'm looking at you!)?

Anyone doing dry January? (Full disclosure - come from a family of alcoholics and have been sober for around fifteen years.)

Agreed. It’s odd that people can’t enjoy things without alcohol.

How do they think millions of people enjoy weddings round the globe without alcohol? Lots of fun can be had without alcohol at a wedding.

It kind of feeds into the ‘uptight Brit’ stereotype. Whereby alcohol is needed before they can venture on to the dance floor etc.

I voted yabu because I don't think it's grip is very strong at the moment.

The young are turning their back on alcohol and it is only the over 40s where it has a vice-like grip on social occasions.

In 20 years all the boozers will be dead or suffering from alcohol induced dementia and the grip will be gone.

Plenty of cultures take the art of tea ceremony very seriously, with differently grown and matured varieties of tea for different occasions and utensils and consumption with different traditional foods. People train for years to perform the art.You might not happen to appreciate it, but it would rude and uninformed to call it snobbish, and the same goes for saying so of the culture behind wine and wine pairing.

I've dabbled in wine pretentiousness myself and look back on it with amusement tbh. I am now intolerant to red wine, know what types of white I like, and find that I can happily drink them whatever I'm eating. I'd love to go to a tea ceremony.

You are not wrong. It's sad imo.

I'm sober 5 years, alcoholic. My bf is teetotal for health reasons and we were discussing the other day how people just don't invite you out because they seem to presume we're fun suckers. 🤔 I'm literally no different, bar retaining my dignity and mental health.

There's many things I can enjoy without alcohol

1. Walks/hikes

2 day trips with friends and family

1. Coffee / lunch with friends

4 . Games nights

1. Social gatherings with good friends.
2. Sports
3. Lazy nights infront of TV with partner /friends

Plenty of activities.

A wedding or dry party sounds dull however. At my wedding the ones who couldn't or don't drink called it a day by 9pm and didn't do much mingling.

At my wedding the ones who couldn't or don't drink called it a day by 9pm and didn't do much mingling.

I wonder if they would have stayed longer and mingled more if no one had been drinking? Drunk conversation and sober conversation doesn’t tend to mix well.

Exactly this.

plus youre clearly exaggersting, it's not a case of not enjoying anything without alcohol is it? The vast majority of things I enjoy are either deliberately done without alcohol or can take or leave.

But a wedding is supposed to be a big celebration so it's not unreasonable for people to want to do whatever they can (within reason) to maximise their enjoyment particularly if they've spent a significant amount of time and money (and often annual leave) to attend.

If the couple don't want to have alcohol that's up to them but (similar to the recent post about vegetarian takeaway) they can't be surprised if people think the outlay isn't worth the enjoyment and decline the invitation.

Do you not think that your background has an effect on the way you perceived alcohol - most people are neither alcoholics nor teetotal but can manage their intake appropriately. And as for the idea that soaps in any way accurately reflect real life?!?!?

On Mumsnet it always feels like there are a lot of people who think having more than a drink a week means you have a drink problem. I never experience such extreme views in real life.

I have a drink or two most days. Not every day and if I go to a social occasion where there is no alcohol it wouldn't bother me at all. I went to a 50th birthday last year which was alcohol free and it was a great evening.

I'm in good health and exercise every day. I have never smoked and eat healthily. I'm quite happy to enjoy a drink.

I get you! I was told about 6 times once, at a pub, by a person who was getting more and more pissed as the evening went on how 'boring' I was. It made me laugh as the only dull ones there were the ones getting more and more drunk repeating themselves and this one person in particular who felt it was Extremely Important to remind me how much fun they were compared to me!

Yes, the binge drinking is worse, but it's really wrong to say that Spanish people don't get drunk at all. They can drink a lot, but often over a longer time because clubbing happens much later at night/morning. You even have a problem with people tipsy - that's completely different to the drunken behaviour you saw in Leeds.

Possibly, but no one was rat arsed by 9. And the majority of non drinkers were on the same table.

Thanks for the very interesting views.

Ha! Yes, that probably has more of a 'hold' on most of the world!
(And is not a bad thing either).

I can go weeks without a drink, without noticing that I have done so. However, I like a glass of wine with a nice meal. I enjoy certain cocktails (not keen on fruity ones) and at a party/wedding enjoy a spirit and mixer.

Day to day I drink water or tea. However, sitting down to a meal at a wedding with a tap water would feel boring. That doesn't make alcohol a problem. Just because some people can't control themselves doesn't mean there is an issue.

Let's get rid of music at parties, everyone has to shout at it. Let's get rid of phones at parties (that is actually a good idea). Ban all junk food while your at it because of obese people.

You're getting a bit of a hard time here OP but I think you're basically right on all except one point: the point about Britain being worse than other countries.

I do think in countries where there is no taboo about alcohol alcohol is very central to people's social lives and I do think it's often quite unhealthy.

I read the dry weddings thread and I was struck by how many people felt they couldn't countenance the idea of going to a celebration without alcohol. The whole "wine o'clock" phenomenon and the idea that it's impossible to get people together without booze is unhealthy. As others have said, you don't really realise how normalised it is until you stop or drastically reduce drinking.

But it's not true to say it's worse in Britain. We're always being told Southern European and Latin countries have a healthier relationship with alcohol than Brits and but as someone who was married to an alcoholic from one of these countries they really don't. Alcohol plays as much of a central role in their lives as it does here: the difference is the way it manifests.

There's less antisocial behaviour related to alcohol in, say, Spain or Latin America than here. You won't see a bunch of people fighting or vomiting into bins in the town centres of Madrid, Toulouse, Sao Paolo or Mexico City as you might in Cleethorpes or Cardiff or Lincoln. But that's in large part because these are more religious, more traditional and less tolerant societies where antisocial behaviour is more frowned upon and cracked down on harder within families. You can have a debate about whether that's healthier or not but it doesn't mean people aren't drinking as much: they are but in less obvious ways.

And don't let's start on Northern Europeans and Russians/Slavs/Baltics. The alcohol abuse there makes the UK look teetotal.

Yes, but another poster pointed out that we feel the same about there being a lot of good food at a wedding (more than just the food we need to live).
Should we be worried about using food to socialise too?

I enjoy alcohol and nicotine (via vapes) the same as others enjoy caffeine (which doesn’t interest me)

Some of us are shy and talking to strangers does not come naturally. This is not something you can change by clicking your fingers.

Note that in some countries that are very convivial and where people socialise a lot more from childhood, alcohol is still used quite a lot for fun!

Dry weddings I've been to have been much less miserable than the typical UK wedding! One of them (no music or dancing either due to religion) they played that game with a spoon on a string where you put it down your dress and then pass to the next person in your team etc. Another one (Muslim) everyone did karaoke. It seemed that guests at those weddings didn't need alcohol to lose their inhibitions

"and far from what I'd describe as sensibly enjoying 😂"

What was non-sensible about them? Did they slur their words a bit or sway a bit when they walked? If they were not extremely drunk or violent, I don't really see what your problem was with them?

I can go to social occasions and enjoy myself without alcohol. It's really not that hard.

The attitude to alcohol in the UK is bizarre - you have to have a drink to have fun, people expect to drink to excess, not drinking is boring. Never noticed it until I lived overseas for a while and moved back, when it was really striking.

Nah alcohol is over priced and causes violence in a lot of people. Can't be doing with it. Tbh I'm seen as boring
However I do enjoy vaping thc in vape juice but that makes me chilled.

In an ideal world I think people would be capable of relaxing, conversing, having fun, laughing, and generally enjoying the company or event to the full without the need to alter their brain chemistry to improve the experience. However, most people are not. Had they never experienced the effects of alcohol I suppose they would be, but once out, most people can't (and wouldn't want to) put the genie back in the bottle.

@CantDealwithChristmas and all, Drinking songs have been popular. I have been thinking about Folk Songs in my parents vinyl collection. One or two drinking songs. On YouTube I just found "Whose the Fool Now" and a mamoth pub crawl "Doing the Manch" the names of the pubs used to make me laugh.