Are you seeing much poverty and despair where you are at the minute?

[whereisitgoing]

I'm not sure if I can face doing my volunteering shift this weekend at a street soup kitchen (still have time to cancel) as not sure I can be tough enough and keep my mask in place. It is the first Christmas since my mum died and I'm crumbling.

Usually I love my volunteer shift, it's really brutal though to see the dire straits people are in. So much despair. The numbers needing help have exploded since covid and this winter are considerably higher again. At the moment I just don't think I can do it, everything seems quite bleak.

Sometimes people are at the end of their tether when they get to us and they are understandably and justifiably stressed and irritated - normally I can handle this without any bother, but not sure I can do it this weekend.

The kitchen will have loads of volunteers so it won't matter if I'm not there anyway. But it has me wondering, are you seeing more people needing help where you are this winter? Is there more palpable despair and anger out there, or am I just projecting my own shit year?

However, as an example of difference, I was in Hexham at 8am last Saturday and saw none- but Hexham is a small market town, quite wealthy, serves a rural population, so perhaps not surprising. Later on there was a young man (early 20s) begging in Fore Street- the main shopping street.

My two closest cites are Guildford and Winchester.

Fairly rare to see anyone homeless there...you occasionally get one person and also rare to see anyone obviously on drugs (as in, I've never seen it in 20 years).

I go into London once a week and don't see any homeless people but that's because I do a quick rat run from Waterloo -> tube -> office at St Katherine's Dock and then back again.

I'm originally from Stoke so completely aware that this is a Home Counties bubble.

I live in a very villagy middle class area but im the povvo single parent of the bunch that just lucked out on a property purchase right place right time. So my immediate neighbours, school yummy mummys.... no.
Me .... yes... my work collegues.... yes... the clients we work with hell yes... its fucking disgusting.

The stats tell me it's on the rise, but not seeing it with my own eyes.

Look after yourself OP like a pp you can do your bit next year or the year after.

I’ve seen it first hand this year as I’ve been volunteering with a charity for the last few months. This year the charity’s supported three times as many families as last year. Whilst you know things are very difficult for many families, seeing in black and white the struggles some are facing is very sobering. There’s been a big increase in the working poor who need help and people in poverty due to illness, disability and poor mental health plus women being sex trafficked, refugees, women fleeing domestic violence.

Definitely an increase in inequality I think. Plenty of people are doing very well. Huge numbers of people are below the breadline.

It seems to me the issue is how quickly people can spiral down at the moment. A friend of a friend just moved in to social housing - great! But they ripped out all the floorings, so she’s instantly had to buy some carpets on credit to keep her kids warm. Then there was a benefit mix up which meant she missed a payment. Suddenly she’s in dire straits.

No visible homelessness in our small market town. But the food bank has doubled in size recently, and the Christmas toy bank had a record number of referrals. They also both get huge amounts of donations.

If you don't have much money, you don't go out to M&S or restaurants.
You stay at home and worry about the bills.

It's a bit like "survivor bias". People are saying they are seeing people in packed M&S. You are just seeing those who have money.

What do people who haven't experienced poverty and despair thinks it looks like? It's not just homelessness.

I know from my role that it is very much out there at the moment. In my area.

Personal debt is increasing.
There are people who are doing very well - and have a lot of disposable income.

The bottom 40% of households have negative discretionary income - money available to spend after essentials have been paid for.

The bottom 20% of households have a negative discretionary income of £75 per week. The top 20% of households have a positive discretionary income of £800 per week according to the Asda Income Tracker

PowerPoint Presentation (scene7.com)

@3luckystars I agree and said so on an earlier post. There are lots of people with plenty and lots with not nearly enough- you aren't seeing those people on M&S or restaurants and cafes because they keep spending to a minimum- they aren't necessarily homeless but may well be behind on lots of bills , behind on rent/mortgage etc. 'struggling badly' doesn't tend to be loitering around cafes/bars/airports//high end supermarkets- although I do think many people are happy to rack up plenty of debt too. I have noticed far less people walking round with bags and bags of stuff that doesn't appear to be 'food' -

Yes, spot on. I live in one of the Charnwood villages.

Average town near Birmingham. No evidence of COL crisis at all. Would be easy to think it was all made up tbh
Suburb of Birmingham quite different - the poverty here is visible including someone sleeping in a bus shelter along the road where I live. My local shopping areas all have rough sleepers, something that wouldn't have been seen a few years ago; there are soup kitchens and more food banks than ever. Last time I was in the city centre I was shocked how many more homeless people there were compared when I worked there.

The carpet thing is deranged. I don't know why some social housing providers do this.

It's worth people knowing that some charities might give grants for carpets though. I know the one I volunteer for does. We're v locally specific but are on turn2us along with lots of other similar charities grants-search.turn2us.org.uk/-

More businesses being built and created locally than ever before. Queues at every coffee shop and millions of delivery people on the road.
Houses been built on every scrap of land so no brown land left.

I can only assume everyone else is much richer than us to be drinking coffee and having takeaways so much.

A lot of empty barber shops though. That perhaps relates to a different thread.

It is one thing that really pisses me off, totally unnecessary and downright cruel. Private landlords don’t remove floorings, house sellers don’t remove floorings. Good to know that there are some sources of grants, thank you for letting everyone know

They do it because they don't want to be responsible for the upkeep of the flooring so don't want it to be part of the let (as it is in a private rental).

And yes it's crazy. They should ask the new tenant whether they want the existing flooring on the understanding that, if they say yes, it becomes theirs not the HA's/council's.

@cakeorwine

What does essentials include?
Mortgage/rent?
Energy bills?
Food?
Travel/petrol?
Insurance?
Servicing debts?
Clothing?

If that was to me, the Asda definition is:

"The Asda Income Tracker is a measure of ‘discretionary income’, reflecting the amount remaining after the average UK household has had taxes subtracted from their income and bought essential items such as: groceries, electricity, gas, transport costs and mortgage interest payments or rent. The Income Tracker measures the amount left over to spend on discretionary purchases such as leisure and recreational goods and services. "

I wouldn't say this includes debts. And personal debt levels are increasing.

My local town centre is certainly very busy - but our shops are things like B&M, Heron foods, Asda, Lidl and charity shops. Cheap ish cafes, Greggs and Witherspoons. So even though people are out spending - they aren't exactly high end .

I live not far from a large city where there have always been a lot of people living rough and am aware from my work of the number of families living in unsuitable B&B accommodation. I am also aware that in suburbs of that city there are people with a whole lot of money. Neither of these are my home town though .

They are, and as I said in an earlier post you could look around town and say the same about where I live. However, due to the place I work, I see people coming in looking for help, they can't find a home, they need help with food, clothes for their kids etc. I imagine these people exist in most towns, you can't just look at crowded shops and restaurants and say, "No, there's no poverty in my town". In most cases it is hidden - people don't walk around the streets advertising the fact that they need help, but it won't be them you see out spending up large. There are many more struggling behind closed doors than there are sleeping on the streets.

Yes they are just answering the question, but it is the unshakeable faith that there is no poverty in their area which I find quite concerning. The idea that as long as they can't see it, it doesn't exist. I don't imagine many of these posters actually take a lot of notice of people who aren't in their social circle.

How anyone can think that because the shops are full they can make a statement that there is no poverty in their town is beyond belief to me.

We were talking about this the other day - we're aware that our lives are quite insular and we're sheltered from the poverty around us. We both work from home and talk to workmates via Teams who are in a similar financial situation to us. Our friends and family are doing ok. We live in a small, bustling town with no visible homelessness, and when we need to shop outside town we usually go to Tesco or big shopping centres where everyone is there to spend (nearest city centre is pretty dead so little point in ever going there). There are food bank donation points in the supermarkets which we usually buy a few extras for, but in our day to day life that's the only sign that all is not well.

However I have friends who work in primary schools and they say that there are a lot of families who are really struggling and you wouldn't guess. Children are coming to school hungry with no packed lunch or money to buy lunch and teachers often feed them from their own pockets. A facebook search found a number of local organisations doing a lot of good work for struggling families and homeless people in the city a few miles away. I'm going to look at how we can get involved with one of these in the NY.

I haven't seen anyone saying there is no poverty in their area. The question was what signs of poverty can you see. People often aren't seeing many signs. I personally dont see much and answered the question as such. I'm deeply aware however that there IS poverty and much of it will be hidden. I'm also aware that as an affluent person I'm less likely to encounter it. It doesn't change the fact that binding see many signs.

The Foodbank where I volunteer has extended shifts this past week because of demand. And parcels are being pared back with fewer treats than in previous years because demand is up and supply is down. And the streets (inner London, very socially mixed postcodes) have far more rough sleepers and people begging than I've seen in 20 years of living here.

Yes, its making everyone crabby at eachother 😅. Food banks are full, heard a few people are using credit cards for groceries and basics now :( Its very stressful when each month your in deficit just for bills before you even get to food.

Although i have seen higher earners struggle too, not obviously if you look at them, but because i know them i hear it. Lost thousands on investments, were all ready living to the top of their income so since everything went up on mortgage ect they are downsizing ect. Well i say they i only know 2 people in that situation.