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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Angry and demanding a refund !

302 replies

LolaRosieBoo · 14/12/2023 11:00

I am a self-employed PT, very well known in my area, have been doing so for 10 years and as such I am expensive (£60 per session). A few years ago, I had to change my T&Cs so that sessions were paid for monthly in advance and sessions cancelled on the day would still be charged.

Before I implemented this policy, people would cancel their sessions with extremely short notice - on the day of - and sometimes only an hour beforehand. I’d also had people just not turn up! This was costing me both time and money, and this income supports my family.

Last month a new client started, she paid upfront and I sent the T&Cs. She cancelled her session yesterday (6 hours before it was due to start), saying her child was sick so she couldn’t make it. I wished her child to feel better and said I would see her next week. This morning, I’ve had a message saying ‘please deduct yesterdays session from next months invoice’. I replied saying that as per the T&Cs, I cannot give her a refund as she cancelled with less than a days notice, making it very difficult for me to recoup that money by finding someone else to fill her space.

She has now sent me a very angry text message demanding a refund or she will post about me on our local Facebook community board. She has accused me of being unethical, as people (especially those with children) will sometimes need to cancel at short notice and she cannot afford to spend £60 for nothing. I replied that this is my income and how I support my family, and I equally cannot afford to not be paid when it’s very short notice with no possibility of me finding someone else.

AIBU?

OP posts:
Snugglemonkey · 14/12/2023 15:23

I am self employed and have a 48 hour cancellation clause in my t and Cs. To be honest though, I would not have given one chance as I feel it leads to goodwill. Her messaging would be v off putting though and now that she has essentially threatened you, I would refund the rest of the block and cancel her.

Deborah54 · 14/12/2023 15:26

My first thought would have been to offer another session but as she’s being mouthy I’d cancel her sessions, refund her minus the missed session. Not worth the hassle. My daughter has a beauty salon and has also implemented a cancellation policy due to the same thing happening. One client wanted to cancel an hour before her appointment (she couldn’t leave her new puppy). When reminded of the cancellation policy, pay the whole price, she suddenly found she could make the appointment after all.

CaroleSinger · 14/12/2023 15:26

Sounds like she's going to slate you anyway but I would just point out you gave her the terms and conditions to read for a reason and these clearly set out your cancellation policy. That was her opportunity to terminate the contract if she wasn't happy. It's not your problem she couldn't be bothered to read what she was agreeing to. Brave the storm when she does bad mouth you or just reply to her posts on local groups with the relevant part if the terms and conditions she seems to think don't apply to her.

User1775 · 14/12/2023 15:26

@HaPPy8 is right

beanontoast · 14/12/2023 15:27

People are SO weird about agreeing to terms and conditions THEY CHOSE NOT TO READ then get aggy about them being enforced...all this 'you should've told her verbally' no you shouldn't. She should read the T&C she agreed to. Stop shifting the blame for your lack of responsibility in finding out what you're signing up to onto the person you're signing up to it with! You don't even know if her child actually was sick...loads of parents use that old chestnut all the time.
I'd not even engage with it. Drop her as a client. If she posts on social media then good, you don't want more clients put off by a fair policy. This is your job, you're busy and have a waiting list - you don't need clients like her.

Chuckiee · 14/12/2023 15:28

People pay £60 an hour to have someone show them how to exercise every week?

Mumof2teens79 · 14/12/2023 15:28

Don't give in to bullying and threats
However- going forward as a gesture/halfway house you could apply a discretionary policy of refunding the first time (along with pointing out the T&Cs) or a % refund.

I pay up front for kids group classes and often miss classes do to sickness with no refund. But I also have a tutor for DD and the first time I cancelled because she was ill (with just 45min notice!) she didn't charge me (but pointed out she normally did)

SlightlygrumpyBettyswaitress · 14/12/2023 15:30

Yanbu. Just yesterday I couldn't make a counselling session with only a few hours to go. I asked for bank details to transfer over (usually pat cash) cos I'm not a flaky person.

ATerrorofLeftovers · 14/12/2023 15:31

HaPPy8 · 14/12/2023 11:10

I think I would have given an option to reschedule or allowed one cancellation before charging as it is more likely to result in good will on both sides and client retention however you are obviously doing well without needing to do this abd technically you are correct. I think most similar businesses have a bit of leeway with this kind of thing in my experience.

Edited

I’m self employed and I take this approach generally. I’d rather keep the sequence of future sessions and not get bad-mouthed. Plus I think life is sweeter if we all offer a little give and take. But only if the client is reasonable and decent. Piss-takers get charged and dropped as a client if they don’t pay.

penjil · 14/12/2023 15:58

Tell her you won't be bullied by her threatening you with social media blabbing.

She signed up to the T&C's. Remind her of that.

And also, just drop her as a client. Anyone that threatens you is not a nice person and you don't want their business. She's ruined the relationship.

Refund her and bin her off.

FKATondelayo · 14/12/2023 16:01

It really doesn't matter what other self-employed people's cancellation policies are. The OP is clear on hers and has laid it out in writing in her contract. She is 'well known' locally, fully booked, with a waiting list. She does not need to make goodwill gestures and has found they negatively impact her income.

Also as a PP pointed out, breaking her own Ts and Cs and making "one-off" exceptions could cause issues later down the line if it comes to the small claims court or Trading Standards.

Some people treat the self-employed like we are hobbyists doing things for our own pleasure and have all the time in the world to accommodate changes of schedule and cancellations.

midtownmum · 14/12/2023 16:05

You're obviously in the right here, so just going to leave that aspect of it alone. I have previously cancelled appointments last minute and paid for them, and it's not great for me, but why should the business absorb the cost? The only time I think this kind of thing is not OK is popular restaurants where you KNOW they are going to have no trouble filling the table charging for a cancelled reservation. That's done in NY and I HATE it, I now won't book somewhere that has that in their terms. Although obviously they're within their rights.

But is £60 not very cheap for a PT session?

Roselilly36 · 14/12/2023 16:06

Sounds a CF, you have your T&C’s, almost like blackmail if she has threatened SM posts etc. Reasonable people would offer to pay, should they cancel at short notice. Under these circumstances, I would refund the balance of the sessions remaining and tell her to find a new PT. But of course keep the money for the cancelled session. Clients like these aren’t worth the hassle.

Diggerdriverless · 14/12/2023 16:35

PinkDeer · 14/12/2023 11:25

I would offer her another session if I was able to. Obviously depending on how busy and in demand you are, and whether you can afford to lose her as a client. What happens if you have to cancel at short notice, if you are ill or one of your children?
I’ve had a hairdresser cancel on me several times due to illness or plumbing issues and I’ve also been understanding but if I cancel even as a longstanding customer, they say they charge a cancellation fee. I think there should be a bit of give and take.

It's nice if both business and client are respectful to each other but in the event of a cancellation the customer has not lost out financially usually but the business has.

Iwasafool · 14/12/2023 16:37

LolaRosieBoo · 14/12/2023 11:53

Sorry - I did send the T&Cs before payment was made and the sessions were booked - realise my OP was open to misunderstanding.

If I could afford it I'd refund her and take her off the list of clients. I'd let someone else deal with her dramas.

Simpleblessingsxx · 14/12/2023 16:53

OnAPostItNote · 14/12/2023 11:06

I don’t think you are being unreasonable. It’s your income. Hairdressers take deposits. I think you are expensive and you must be super at your job. Well done - you have built a reputation for yourself and you must deserve it. Otherwise you would have no clients… Remind her of libel and slander laws. She has no right to defame you. You can sue.

This

Daphnis156 · 14/12/2023 16:58

She should not have her money back.

I am pleased to hear you are well known and expensive.

Hesma · 14/12/2023 17:18

She’s a CF. I have a PT and book in 12 session blocks. She allows me one cancellation in a block but any more and I pay. It’s your business, why should you lose out?

Rochyella84 · 14/12/2023 17:40

I have the same policy. Stand firm. It’s so hard as a Mum myself I feel guilty when someone’s child is ill. I used to let it go then calculated I was £370 down in a month for being too nice.

wronginalltherightways · 14/12/2023 17:41

Tell her this is 100% standard business practice, it's your livelihood, and you look forward to posting a copy of the clearly stated terms and conditions under her posts.

Rochyella84 · 14/12/2023 17:44

Oh also, something I’ve started doing is verbally reiterating this policy at the first session. People sometimes don’t even read the t&cs! So I’ll say something like, “I just want to make sure you’ve read the cancellation policy and understand I’ll have to charge if you cancel on the day. It doesn’t leave me with any time to book someone else in, and I hope you understand that I have to protect my income”. Most people make an understanding comment and It makes me feel more secure knowing they definitely know about it!

melj1213 · 14/12/2023 18:05

YANBU - T&C's are given for a reason, if people don't want to abide by them then they need to find another PT.

If she was a well established client who had been with you for years since you started as a PT, had never cancelled or been late, always paid on time and was apologetic about their late notice cancellation and/or did not even mention anything about not paying etc then I would say YABU to not even consider a compromise for the sake of goodwill but that is not the case.

An established, loyal client would have built up enough "goodwill credit" to justify the loss caused by a one off cancellation as a gesture of goodwill (or at least earn them the opportunity to try and negotiate a reduced fee) but in the case of a new client who has not built up any "goodwill credit" then they really should not be making ultimatums as you have nothing to lose by calling their bluff (especially as you have a waiting list and are clearly in demand).

A new client threatening to smear you on social media because they think the t&cs they agreed to don't apply to them would be an ex-client of mine. I would not refund the missed session but I would refund any payments made towards further sessions along with a message to say that due to the threats made when you enforced the T&C's regarding cancellation fees, that they agreed to when they signed up, you no longer feel able to continue working with them.

I might even be on the client's side if they had got in contact and asked if there was any way that they could rearrange rather than cancel so that they don't lose out due to something out of everyone's control (bc it's not like you get to choose if/when you get ill), accepted that you didn't have availability this week but enquired if the £60 fee could be used as part credit towards a future session instead, but again that was not the case. You still wouldn't have been unreasonable to say no but there's nothing wrong with a polite enquiry - as long as you're willing to accept a "No, that's not possible" answer - so I would also have said that they were not unreasonable to ask.

rookiemere · 14/12/2023 18:10

If she has already paid for a block of sessions, I'd be tempted to refund the unused ones and stop the contract. I'd probably also just give her back the £60 for the unused session on the basis it's not worth the aggravation at this time of year.

surreygirl1987 · 14/12/2023 18:24

Stick to your guns. 'I'm sorry you feel that way and if you wish to cancel our contract I understand. Additionally if you feel the need to post that my terms and conditions are unreasonable on Facebook, as long as your post isn't libellous, that is entirely your choice. Regards.'

This is ideal. Although I would cha gd it to 'I assume you would like to cancel your contract' - surely you don't want to keep her as a client!

littlefireseverywhere · 14/12/2023 18:27

I’d refund her & not take her on as a client. If you’ve a waiting list, it’s not worth the hassle. She’s shown you her true colours, she’ll be a nightmare client.