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Original poster

How would you handle this? Large dog and teen interaction

130 replies

MirrorBack · 09/12/2023 19:44

Firstly I don’t dislike dogs… but some owners I do. My kids like dogs, we walk a few occasionally or dog sit for friends. This isn’t an anti-dog thread before someone goes down that road…

My young teen was at the bus stop, looking for his bus that was approaching. A woman with a very large breed was next to him and the dog jumped up at my son. The dog was muzzled but the muzzle caused some minor scrapes and a mark to my sons hand. More worryingly the dog, a Belgian Malinois was large enough to knock him back. Especially as he was looking in the other direction, and hadn’t noticed she’d moved closer to him. He stumbled into the bus that was pulling away, today he has bruising to his shoulder and lower back from where the bus clipped him. It could have been worse.

She apparently asked if he was ok, he was abrupt and told her to train her dog. He was pretty shocked. She was then scowling at him and when the bus came she followed him upstairs with the dog and sat next to him. He told her to fuck off with the dog, which wasn’t being still, and went downstairs. She didn’t follow.

The dog is distinctive and so is she, a young slight woman with dyed hair. I’ve seen previous interactions. From the description I’m pretty sure I’ve seen her around. The dog is big enough to pull her around. Last time I saw them it struck me as a large untrained dog, maybe a big puppy, with limited training. I’ve seen it dragging her to chase after other dogs or into streams or to greet children. It wasn’t aggressive, but due to the size it’s a problem. She’ll be shouting at others like it’s their fault. I’ve never seen it muzzled before though.

My son is ok around dogs, not scared of dogs by the incident but he was upset by it and his bruised back from the bus is uncomfortable.

How would you follow this up? There won’t be CCTV or anything, or witnesses I believe. Son only told me when he was home around twenty minutes later. He’s an honest kid, admitted to swearing and bruising is what you’d expect from the bus. I don’t know how, but it annoys me as well as being dangerous. How would you follow up:

OP posts:
jannier · 10/12/2023 08:34

MirrorBack · 09/12/2023 21:19

To be fair I don’t think she’s threatening. I’m trying to explain nicely but she’s a young short slim woman with heavy make up and a fair few facial cosmetic enhancements who doesn’t really seem the type to move fast at all. I think it was more in a getting him back to be annoying way because he’d put her mood out. She’s aggravating in her manner, but I don’t think she was out to intimidate. Just pissing him off as she was annoyed in a pretty childish way. He hadn’t really said much so I guess she thought she could.
Last time I saw her she was shouting at an owner who’d made her dog drag her into a stream and she’d got her white leggings dirty. She doesn’t come across as calculating. I’m trying to not be rude

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She sounds threatening to me, her looks are irrelevant its her mental state that's worrying she could do this to anyone. If it happened to my nephew who is over 6ft and wide shouldered he would be back to not leaving the house again ...he's has ASD

SwishSwashSwooshSwersh · 10/12/2023 08:34

Your son reacted badly but it’s not surprising given what happened

MelsMoneyTree · 10/12/2023 08:47

Your DS should go to the GP to get his back checked too. Sometimes even small back injuries can cause ongoing issues if they're not treated appropriately at the beginning.

SoftandQuiet · 10/12/2023 08:54

You’re poor son, frightening for him, not surprising he reacted as he did.
Young dogs can be unpredictable and sounds like this owner shouldn’t be walking him anywhere near others until he’s properly trained (but tricky in London if you’re needing to use public transport!).

margotrose · 10/12/2023 09:01

Some of these responses are bonkers.

If this was a six foot bloke in charge of an out of control dog, everyone would be baying for blood - but because the handler was female and the victim male, everyone has decided he's at fault for not de-escalating the situation Hmm

I work with dogs and if a random dog in the street jumped at me so strongly that it pushed me backwards into traffic, I would be reporting the owner to the police.

If you're going to own a dog then you need to have it under your control at all times - in public and in private. That's the law. Sticking a muzzle on doesn't mean the dog is safe nor does it mean you have any kind of control over your dog.

SutWytTi · 10/12/2023 09:19

margotrose · 10/12/2023 09:01

Some of these responses are bonkers.

If this was a six foot bloke in charge of an out of control dog, everyone would be baying for blood - but because the handler was female and the victim male, everyone has decided he's at fault for not de-escalating the situation Hmm

I work with dogs and if a random dog in the street jumped at me so strongly that it pushed me backwards into traffic, I would be reporting the owner to the police.

If you're going to own a dog then you need to have it under your control at all times - in public and in private. That's the law. Sticking a muzzle on doesn't mean the dog is safe nor does it mean you have any kind of control over your dog.

If the owner was a 6-ft guy, I think de-escalation would be even more important. But I think it's important with everyone as you don't know who they know.

margotrose · 10/12/2023 09:23

@SutWytTi I just think it's a bonkers thing to focus on.

If a large, powerful dog had just leapt at me and pushed me into moving traffic, the last thing I would be thinking about is how to "de escalate the situation".

WillowTit · 10/12/2023 09:52

she shouldnt have sat next to him!

SgtBilko · 10/12/2023 09:56

SutWytTi · 09/12/2023 19:49

You can either leave it or report the dog as out of control.

However you need teach you son how to de-escalate not escalate situations. I understand why he told her to fuck off, but it's wiser to just remove yourself from idiots like this.

Don’t be ridiculous. Her dog caused an injury to the boy and he was probably scared after being clipped by the bus. He is a child and him swearing at her is not the problem here, the problem is someone not in control of her dog. I’d probably swear if I’d been knocked into an oncoming bus.

SgtBilko · 10/12/2023 09:59

OP I would report this to 101.

SutWytTi · 10/12/2023 10:07

SgtBilko · 10/12/2023 09:56

Don’t be ridiculous. Her dog caused an injury to the boy and he was probably scared after being clipped by the bus. He is a child and him swearing at her is not the problem here, the problem is someone not in control of her dog. I’d probably swear if I’d been knocked into an oncoming bus.

Edited
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I don't think swearing was offensive and you quoted me saying I understand why he did it - but de-escalation is about self-preservation.

SutWytTi · 10/12/2023 10:09

margotrose · 10/12/2023 09:23

@SutWytTi I just think it's a bonkers thing to focus on.

If a large, powerful dog had just leapt at me and pushed me into moving traffic, the last thing I would be thinking about is how to "de escalate the situation".

It was the bit where she followed him. She escalated it, and that's very odd. When someone does that, it can be wise to de-escalate.

Mwnci123 · 10/12/2023 10:29

hattie43 · 09/12/2023 20:16

It's a bad situation but your son sounds horrible . She asks if he's ok he tells her to train the dog abruptly, tells her to fuck off , charming individual isn't he .
She needs to train her dog like you need to train your son .

This is a ridiculous comment. The kid has just been pushed in to a moving bus and it's her fault! He did well to walk away from her in the end, and I doubt very much I would have shown that restraint as a young teen.

Sorry op, I don't have any practical advice. Some of these comments, as always, are mad as pants. I'm glad your son, though bruised, is ok.

LuvSmallDogs · 10/12/2023 10:39

Some women on here are so eager to defend against misogyny that they pick apart the reactions of a male teenager who was no doubt flooded with "fight or flight" instincts after a) being attacked by a dog and b) being followed into an enclosed space by the owner and the vicious dog.

The lad might well have sworn at a grown male owner - a female teenager might have sworn at a grown male owner if the sexes were reversed - because when adrenaline starts making decisions for you they're not always logical.

I don't care that the stupid (at best) woman was sworn at, for the record. I don't care if she cried about it when she got home - I hope she did, in fact, if it makes her think twice about exposing members of the public to that dog again.

Thenewmags · 10/12/2023 10:46

Mwnci123 · 10/12/2023 10:29

This is a ridiculous comment. The kid has just been pushed in to a moving bus and it's her fault! He did well to walk away from her in the end, and I doubt very much I would have shown that restraint as a young teen.

Sorry op, I don't have any practical advice. Some of these comments, as always, are mad as pants. I'm glad your son, though bruised, is ok.

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Agreed with the pp that some of the responses are bizarre. And can I add it’s possible her son’s reaction was because he was frightened - although he might not admit fear as teenage boys often don’t like to share their vulnerability.

I’ve definitely had to be very assertive or even aggressive to people at times when I was shaking with fear inside due to their intimidation /attempted violence towards me.

The fact is yes he said F off but then he was the one responsible enough to remove himself from the situation. I think he struck a good balance.

I’ve lived in certain cities such as Glasgow and Liverpool where saying F off in certain situations can in a way be a de-escalation, because the person who is harassing you needs to know you’re not a walkover or they will keep getting more aggressive.

This guy started harassing me in a bus once mocking my hair style, and the older woman next to me more or less told him to shut the F up and that was the end of that! 😂

Stuckstuckstuckk · 10/12/2023 10:47

The dog won’t be put down unless she signs him over to the police so don’t worry about that unless they thought he posed a serious risk n seized and even then she’d have the chance to have someone go to court to rehome the dog with them, and unlikely to even be assessed for such an incident as a one off report just warned to keep the dog under control or it’ll be seized. I’d report as it’ll build a clear picture if the behaviour escalates and the dog ends up hurting someone. Belgian malinois aren’t for inexperienced owners and the vast majority are not fit for pet homes due to the amount of stimulation they need and drive they have, this is a disaster waiting to happen

SutWytTi · 10/12/2023 11:07

And can I add it’s possible her son’s reaction was because he was frightened - although he might not admit fear as teenage boys often don’t like to share their vulnerability. Yes of course - this is why learning to de-escalate is vital, as young men are most at risk of violence and are most likely to find themselves in a difficult situation. Being able to hold the adrenaline and still make choices is extremely difficult but we can all try to help them with it.

randomusername2020 · 10/12/2023 11:12

This reply has been withdrawn

Removed at poster's request due to privacy concerns.

margotrose · 10/12/2023 11:17

Yes of course - this is why learning to de-escalate is vital, as young men are most at risk of violence and are most likely to find themselves in a difficult situation.

Telling her to train her dog isn't "escalating the situation" though. It's a perfectly valid comment - one that I've made plenty of times to owners who refuse to control their dogs.

She's the one who escalated the situation by followed him upstairs and choosing to sit near him even though her dog had just pushed him into a moving bus Confused

Telling her to fuck off in that scenario is more than reasonable imo.

WiddlinDiddlin · 10/12/2023 17:58

Desupi · 09/12/2023 20:45

Owner of a mastiff here and I will be honest that when my dog was young she could be jumpy too. The difficulty is it takes it happening followed by the appropriate owner response to curb the behaviour. It is not helpful for people to say "you should control your dog". Young dogs are much like toddlers and are very unpredictable. It would be similar to trying to control a toddler having a tantrum and someone gives you some unsolicited advice, it can really irk you. I think she was very wrong to follow your son on the bus though. I think reporting it to the police would be quite extreme.

Seriously, no.

Setting the dog up to make a mistake so you can punish or 'correct' (another word for punishment) is inefficient and risky training practice.

Teach your dog the behaviour you want, set them up so it is easy to offer that behaviour when asked. Reward them for it when they get it right and ensure if they fluff it, you have space to turn and walk away.

You do not need to let your dog make mistakes or set them up to make mistakes, or use members of the public and put them at risk, to train your dog!

Andr0meda · 11/12/2023 00:55

Your son reacted fine. Whoever says the opposite, they are probably the kind of people who would turn their heads on the other side when they would see someone being beaten or abused so they don't get in trouble. Nobody here is in the position to educate you on what to 'teach your son', as you didn't describe anything out of the norm as a behaviour. Report to the police as others said, and tell him to be vigilant in case he encounters that reckless (or purposefully malicious) idiot again.

Crystalballplease · 11/12/2023 01:00

SutWytTi · 09/12/2023 20:09

I can't understand your lack of interest in helping your kid learn to extricate himself more safely in future, but I'll bow out now.

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Because she’s recognised he is upset and in shock! Her having a go at him about not swearing isn’t going to help. He did escalate he walked away and removed himself!

Alargeoneplease89 · 11/12/2023 01:33

hattie43 · 09/12/2023 20:16

It's a bad situation but your son sounds horrible . She asks if he's ok he tells her to train the dog abruptly, tells her to fuck off , charming individual isn't he .
She needs to train her dog like you need to train your son .

You wouldn't be angry if a dog caused you injury and then had the cheek to sit next to you?

Honestly OP you should have put DD...soon as an MN sees a male it's instantly the man's fault.

KillerTomato7 · 11/12/2023 09:58

So let’s say some moron’s out of control dog pushes your elderly mother into a moving bus. Then followed her upstairs with the dog to make some kind of sick point. You’d be perfectly polite in that scenario? There’s no chance you’d use any mean words?

In the world most of us live in, if you behave like that much of an arse to someone, you can expect to be put in your place.

KillerTomato7 · 11/12/2023 09:59

KillerTomato7 · 11/12/2023 09:58

So let’s say some moron’s out of control dog pushes your elderly mother into a moving bus. Then followed her upstairs with the dog to make some kind of sick point. You’d be perfectly polite in that scenario? There’s no chance you’d use any mean words?

In the world most of us live in, if you behave like that much of an arse to someone, you can expect to be put in your place.

Sorry meant to quote whoever was clutching pearls about profanity.