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Original poster

Teens alone overnight instead of at dads

101 replies

PurpleReindeer1 · 04/12/2023 13:05

long story short, my husband and I split up in September. I had previously been a SAHM but cant afford to anymore. He agreed to have them (dd15, dd14 and ds9) overnight 3 nights a week so I have thankfully found a great job working those 3 night shifts. I started this week (only done 1 shift but love it)

a couple of days ago, dds and their dad had an argument, they said he locked them out, he swears he didnt, whatever, they came home (lives a few minites away walking)

However, the next day they got in his car with him and his mum and he started having a go at them saying they called him a liar and petty and they need to grow up (i believed them for what its worth, he has form for being petty)
his mum (kids nanna) said calm down, mistakes happen
and he said yeah fucking three of them.

so obviously dds were upset by this ( though it isnt the first thing hes said similar to this when hes in a mood - hence splitting up) and really dont want to go round there any more. Ive always encouraged a relationship and was always the mediator when he lived with us. but I feel at their age they should be able to have a say, and quite frankly, the way he spoke about them (and their brother who had nothing to do with this!) is disgusting.

Problem is, if they dont go to his there is no one else for them to stay with overnight, and i cant change to days on this new job, so my options are

a) insist they stay at their dads (i would rather avoid this, i dont think this will benefit them or their relationship in the long run)
b) find another job (easier said than done i was looking for 2 months for this and as well as leting them down, it really is a lovely job and the pay is decent for the industry)
c) let the girls stay home alone while im out (7.30pm-8.30am) there are no laws I can find that say they arent allowed however lots of guidance to suggest they should not be left overnight under 16.

DD15 is 16 in 5 months, dd14 has only just turned 14.
They have phones, ring doorbell, comfortable with being home alone in the day / evening and we have a (very barky) dog, I just feel its irresponsible.
Their dad is also, as said above, a few minutes away on foot in an emergency and I am working 5-10 minutes drive away

Any thoughts greatly appreciated

OP posts:
curaçao · 05/12/2023 02:44

Boomboom22 · 04/12/2023 16:18

Yes notouch has it. As much as they will be fine as soon as the whole school knows they won't be able to stop it going on fb and everyone will descend on your house. A party is the least of your worries. So I would discuss with them and I'm sure they'll say this is a potential problem and decide to stay at dads.

When rhe school knows they will flag it as a safeguarding concern and you will have SS on ypur back.An ocasional night is one thing but 3/7 nighrs is very different

LaurieStrode · 05/12/2023 03:42

PurpleReindeer1 · 04/12/2023 13:20

hmm im not sure. I think if it was the older one i would be ok on her own but if she wanted to go to dads then i wouldnt be happy dd14 staying on her own (but of the two it would be the eldest saying she didnt want to go as she has always had a rocky relationship with her dad)

At some point they have to cooperate with the needs of the family rather than what they "want."

I'd be ok with both girls being home but not one.

Is your ex a bad influence on your son?

LaurieStrode · 05/12/2023 03:43

curaçao · 04/12/2023 13:22

you cannotlbe leaving under 16s alone overnight three nights a week, every week!

Oh please. People used to get married at 16.

LaurieStrode · 05/12/2023 03:44

Zanatdy · 04/12/2023 13:26

I don’t know. My dd is 16 in March and I’m reluctant to leave her yet, but nothing will magically change when she’s 16 (age my DS was when I left him). So maybe, as there’s 2 of them. I wouldn’t force them to go, but I’d hope Dad would step up. What about the Nanna?

At 16 i was staying alone at our family cottage in the lakes. No phone, no car, no neighbours. In the 70s. It was fine.

user1492757084 · 05/12/2023 03:52

I would ask the kids to continue staying at their Dad's for another six months.
It might turn out okay but if not, once the oldest is 16, the girls could choose to stay at home. I would be encouraging them to still stay at their father's one or two nights per week.

It is beneficial to not lose contact with a parent. (unless abuse is happening)

crimsonleaves · 05/12/2023 04:02

I was 15 and left with my teen sibling overnight, other teens found out and I was sexually assaulted whilst my parents were away. I was a sensible child. I'm more protective of my own now as I'm aware of how quickly terrible things can happen and the long term consequences.

crimsonleaves · 05/12/2023 04:04

I should add, I was 16 shortly after. Not only was I attacked, but valuables were also stolen at the time and I was completely unaware.

Pepperama · 05/12/2023 04:06

It’s fine. I’d leave my much younger kid with a 16 year old babysitter overnight, so can’t see why you wouldn’t leave a 14 and almost 16 year old. Unless they’re exceptionally immature or untrustworthy. I think we’re babying teens nowadays. At 16 I travelled abroad on my own with a friend and my mum had a full time job from when she left school at 14.

Frozensun · 05/12/2023 04:07

You know your children and their personalities. IMO, if they’re responsible, get on with each other, want to do it and do not want to go, then I’d trial it. Set the ground rules. Give it a week and sit down with them to do an active review to work out if it’s ok. You’ve got a number of fallback safety approaches.

AngelAurora · 05/12/2023 04:20

Your ex needs to look after his kids, he is doing this on purpose to mess you about.

NumberTheory · 05/12/2023 04:43

As a one off this would probably be fine. However as an ongoing arrangement, 3 nights a week, it’s not appropriate to leave even a mature 14 year old in the care of another child, especially not her sister. and while the 15 year old might be okay on her own, it’s not a given.

The potential for something to go wrong as a one off is low. But if this is how things are you don’t just have the issue of an unusual event, you have the issue of them slowly pushing boundaries and you having no idea it’s even happening. Unsupervised overnights aren’t riskier because more dangerous things are likely to happen to them, they’re risky because there is more potential for things to be missed, there’s space that can be filled without anyone seeing anything. And because it’s transition time - between evening and night and then night and day; between home and school - which is harder for kids to manage on their own.

If you don’t think their dad can care for them (and given what you’ve said about his behaviour, I can see why this might be in question), I don’t think you can’t work nights. If you do think he can care for them you need to insist the 14 year old at least stays with him.

Reugny · 05/12/2023 04:47

titchy · 04/12/2023 13:24

But you won't know till hours afterwards!

Show quote history

It's instant if you set it up to be.

Heyhoherewegoagain · 05/12/2023 05:07

Frozensun · 05/12/2023 04:07

You know your children and their personalities. IMO, if they’re responsible, get on with each other, want to do it and do not want to go, then I’d trial it. Set the ground rules. Give it a week and sit down with them to do an active review to work out if it’s ok. You’ve got a number of fallback safety approaches.

These are my thoughts too. Yes there are risks, but there are also risks to them going to their dad’s, and FWIW I also believe he’s trying to sabotage your new job

Random30 · 05/12/2023 05:14

PurpleReindeer1 · 04/12/2023 13:05

long story short, my husband and I split up in September. I had previously been a SAHM but cant afford to anymore. He agreed to have them (dd15, dd14 and ds9) overnight 3 nights a week so I have thankfully found a great job working those 3 night shifts. I started this week (only done 1 shift but love it)

a couple of days ago, dds and their dad had an argument, they said he locked them out, he swears he didnt, whatever, they came home (lives a few minites away walking)

However, the next day they got in his car with him and his mum and he started having a go at them saying they called him a liar and petty and they need to grow up (i believed them for what its worth, he has form for being petty)
his mum (kids nanna) said calm down, mistakes happen
and he said yeah fucking three of them.

so obviously dds were upset by this ( though it isnt the first thing hes said similar to this when hes in a mood - hence splitting up) and really dont want to go round there any more. Ive always encouraged a relationship and was always the mediator when he lived with us. but I feel at their age they should be able to have a say, and quite frankly, the way he spoke about them (and their brother who had nothing to do with this!) is disgusting.

Problem is, if they dont go to his there is no one else for them to stay with overnight, and i cant change to days on this new job, so my options are

a) insist they stay at their dads (i would rather avoid this, i dont think this will benefit them or their relationship in the long run)
b) find another job (easier said than done i was looking for 2 months for this and as well as leting them down, it really is a lovely job and the pay is decent for the industry)
c) let the girls stay home alone while im out (7.30pm-8.30am) there are no laws I can find that say they arent allowed however lots of guidance to suggest they should not be left overnight under 16.

DD15 is 16 in 5 months, dd14 has only just turned 14.
They have phones, ring doorbell, comfortable with being home alone in the day / evening and we have a (very barky) dog, I just feel its irresponsible.
Their dad is also, as said above, a few minutes away on foot in an emergency and I am working 5-10 minutes drive away

Any thoughts greatly appreciated

My kids are this age and could be left overnight.

It may improve if he finds out you/they are not budging.

Nanna be supportive or helpful?

Random30 · 05/12/2023 05:17

crimsonleaves · 05/12/2023 04:02

I was 15 and left with my teen sibling overnight, other teens found out and I was sexually assaulted whilst my parents were away. I was a sensible child. I'm more protective of my own now as I'm aware of how quickly terrible things can happen and the long term consequences.

I’m sorry, that is horrific. I hope they were prosecuted.

sashh · 05/12/2023 05:27

I think you know your children better than anyone.

16 year olds who have been in care are often expected to live independently.

I would bet even money your ex calls social services though, who will probably laugh at him.

Do go through various scenarios with them for things that could go wrong and that any silly behaviour / asking friends round will mean they are with dad.

rowanoak · 05/12/2023 05:50

I would never do this, if only because it’s asking for CPS or whatever the equivalent is there to come knocking on your door (if they’re anything like they are here in the States). But also I would feel so bad for the daughters being all alone that much. I would way rather take a job with hours when they’re in school so that I could see them and be with them at night. Is that an option?

MonikerBing · 05/12/2023 05:58

They're too young - sorry OP.

I've been in a similar situation with my ex (minus the job) with my dc refusing to stay with their father. My ex even once left them alone while I was away on a holiday! I think you'll have to wait a couple of years. Are there no day time jobs that you can get?

3luckystars · 05/12/2023 06:00

Don’t do this. Everyone will find out. It’s not safe.
Get another job while they are at school, you will find one. I know nights sounded like an ideal solution but their dad is no good and keeps letting you down, so count him out.
Well done on getting rid of him.

junebirthdaygirl · 05/12/2023 06:19

The Saturday night is the most worrying as that's when teens party and it would be very easy and tempting for your dd 15 to invite a few over and it get out of hand. As a one off it would be fine but it s too much on an ongoing basis. Also sisters can get on and then a big flaring row could happen over clothes or something silly and they would be alone so could escalate. Would their Nana sleep over with them until they all get over the carry on of their dad? Is he the type to regret what he said once he sees his dc want nothing to do with him and would he apologise to them?

curaçao · 05/12/2023 06:21

LaurieStrode · 05/12/2023 03:43

Oh please. People used to get married at 16.

Show quote history

Are you and @ssashh and others not able to read? the youngest is just turned 14 and the eldest is 15 and a half
The youngest is 2 years off being 16!

theculture · 05/12/2023 06:42

I suppose ideally not but what is the alternative; you give up the job and can't find another one? I think you said it took a while to get this one?

Then what? Can you afford to stay in your house? Would you and the kids have to move to a cheaper area/different school? And still possibly have to get a job with unsocial hours that you don't like as much

Perhaps you can try being flexible with the kids, some nights they have to go to their dad but can stay home on their own sometimes too, see how it pans out but 3 nights is a lot to spend with someone they don't want to be with and you know doesn't behave like the adult he should be

cansu · 05/12/2023 06:53

They had a row with their parent which is not unusual for a teen. If you had a row would you expect your ex to support them in refusing to stay at yours? You are allowing your feelings for him to colour your behaviour now. If you are to parent together you need to work together even though you dislike each other. Of course the girls would rather stay at home alone. They also know that you are tempted because of the separation to take sides.

sashh · 05/12/2023 06:54

curaçao · 05/12/2023 06:21

Are you and @ssashh and others not able to read? the youngest is just turned 14 and the eldest is 15 and a half
The youngest is 2 years off being 16!

Show quote history

So does maturity just zoom in on your 16th birthday?

@rowanoak A friend called the local police when her son was 14 and asked if he was old enough to be left alone babysitting his younger siblings. They told her people leave 10 year olds alone.

Frogggie · 05/12/2023 07:04

Personally I would be ok with this. Only you know your kids and how responsible they are but I feel like they have both parents close enough that this would feel ok to me. You’d even be awake the whole time and contactable (if they’re able to call the building rather than your phone). Just make it clear if they abuse your trust they will be back at their dads whether they like it or not.