Shaken after being sworn at by horrid man

[cadburyegg]

Posting for traffic

Was cycling home from after school club tonight with kids. We all have lights on our bikes and hi vis jackets. Nearly home when I get beeped at by a car. The driver stops and shouts at me that I'm an idiot for driving down the road without lights on the bikes. I said oh, we do have lights but he was adamant that we didn't and he couldn't see us. Became really aggressive and called me a "fucking twat" in front of the dc and that I "shouldn't have" dc.

I feel really upset that he couldn't see us and like an idiot because I thought the lights and hi vis made us visible, they were definitely on and working obviously not and I will get more lights, and make sure this doesn't happen again, but I can see the dc very clearly in the road. he also had a go at us for cycling in the road rather than the pavement. But am also upset that he was so horrible. We are told not to drive to school but I don't want to cycle anymore either. Feel so upset that my dc had to witness it and so guilty 😥

@Justwant2sit No they can't, that's the point. Those headlights are dipped and only actually illuminate a few metres directly in front. Full beams are not permitted in a built up area as they dazzle other drivers.

If you're dressed in dark clothing or off to the side, drivers cannot see you. Until I started driving I had no idea how invisible I was. As most pedestrians don't. Cyclists need to be lit up like Wembley stadium because otherwise they can't be seen.

Have a watch of that. That's how we look to drivers.

He was a wanker. He never should have shouted and sworn at you.
If he couldn't see you very well, which is a possibility, perhaps he got a shock. If that was the case he could have stopped and nicely pointed out that it was difficult to see and better lights/even more reflective clothing might help.
But to start shouting and swearing shows he's just a knob.
Some drivers are knobs about all cyclists - irrespective of the time of day - because some of them think cyclists shouldn't be on the road at all.

It is difficult to see cyclists at night and pedestrians too and especially if it's raining and there are a lot of reflections from other lights on the road.
The more lights and high-vis the better but honestly, I wouldn't want to be cycling with kids on the road in the dark.

To be fair the OP did mention that she had both lights and HI Vis at the time she was verbally abused : which I took to be cycle standard… who can say but the OP who was there. I’m sure there is more OP could do ( more lights / better lights) but for some drivers it will never be enough .

I find some flashing front cycle lights problematic as a driver. Sometimes they are very bright and flash directly into your eyes and are a distraction rather than a help.
The other point is, depending on how they are set, the interval when they are not flashing can be crucial. I approached the junction at a roundabout, looked right, saw it was clear and was about to set off when the flashing cycle light came on again. This all happened in a split second but was long enough for a less careful driver to have been halfway across and into the cyclist. Continuous light is better imo.

Saying that the OP had every right to be there is true but not much help if an inattentive driver hits her. Sometimes it's wise to swallow your principles.

Cycle commuter here. Some advice:

Reflective jackets: are better in the dark, hi-viz is better in daylight and dusk. Reflective clothing can be seen from all angles and really stands out. Proviz or similar is good and they have a sale on now. Backpack covers on ebay can be really visible from the back if they have big reflective stripes on.

Lights: research apparently says that flashing lights stand out better against other lights like car lights and non-flashing lights are easier to judge the distance of. I use one of each on the front and on the back.

Knob-ends: there are plenty of horrid aggressive men who love shouting at women. I've had FAT BITCH yelled at me before; I'm a size 6-8. They just want to take out their anger on you in whatever way their limited brain calls think of first. It can really shake you but please don't let a pathetic man force you off the road. Keep going!

Here's a link to the Proviz site, there are other brands of course! They are really visible, someone at my work has a jacket from them https://provizsports.com/collections/cycling-childrens?country=GB

You can be lit up like a Christmas tree and people still won't see you, because too many people are driving with crap eyesight, or distracted, or preoccupied whatever way.

Agree with pp that he saw you too late and got a fright and then acted like a complete dick.

What are your lights like just out of interest? I run a huge rear light on permanent but with a surge of brightness. Also make sure that where your lights are mounted that any coats don't hang down and obscure them, I've fallen foul of this before.

Obviously he shouldn't have yelled at you, but the silver lining is now you know so please ensure you get better lights for the safety of you and your family.

Disgusting way to behave. He could have made his point without being vile and abusive, especially in front of a child.

Maybe he was blinded by other car's headlights. I've almost missed a lit-up but not hi-viz cyclist because of that before. I like those white/silver jackets that glow all over in the headlights. Much better than traditional yellow.

Not sure the school has any remit to tell people they aren't allowed to drive, they may prefer parents not to during peak periods but this late at night you do what's safest for your children and cycling clearly isn't. Yes, the guy was an arse but as pp have said you may not be as visible as you think you are and he was obviously alarmed and you got the brunt of his anger. Better that than a family wipe out to be honest.

I was going to recommended Proviz. I bought my DH and DS the backpack covers. When light hits them they light up like a Christmas tree! Super bright and very obvious. They also have super bright lights front and back.

If you have to cycle I'd stick to the pavements when it's dark and just apologise to every pedestrian on the pavement, that's probably the better option.

Do not do this. Pavements are for pedestrians. Get off and walk. (I do make allowances for children. I'm sick of adults cycling on pavements though.)

I used to work in a relevant industry and it's super common for people to get into a state of rage after nearly being in a collision.

I've had SO many people go ballistic at me when I can hardly be considered to be a contributing factor from an office several counties away. But they do it. It's shock.

Obviously it's not ok to verbally abuse other people. But when they're very frightened, I gave them a lot of leeway on that. It's not nice but I know they're not thinking straight.

This.

I bought this stuff for my DH

I'm so sorry. I was in tears myself yesterday after cycling home from school with my children after being shouted at by a woman who didn't want me cycling on the (very clearly signed) shared use bicycle/pedestrian path. I was wearing a high vis gilet over my winter coat and I find that when I wear high vis, I get close passed and get shouted at whereas people treat me like a human if I wear just my normal coat. I'm torn between wanting to make myself visible and not wanting get death threats (happened last month when wearing the high vis) and aggression from drivers.

It feels truly awful to be on the receiving end of some idiot's vitriol but you're definitely doing the right thing cycling the school run. It is so much better for your kids than being stuck in a polluted (and polluting) car. And statistically you and your kids will live longer than the families driving the school run, so any fear mongering from drivers has no basis in reality.

I'd add a few extra lights just because you can never have too many. I ride a cargo bike and have a string of Christmas lights wrapped around the rain tent. I find these have the happy mix of being cheerful and visible. Maybe add some of the fun lights that go on the wheels (I think they are called monkey lights?).

And I think I'm going to ditch the coloured high vis (since it seems to make drivers view me as non human) and stick with just the reflective silver option if it is actually dark. I have lights on whenever I cycle day or night.

He should have his licence taken away. It's scary that we have to share the road with people that stupid and aggressive.

It's dark all winter so I don't think you have to stop cycling. I find Proviz silver jackets pretty unmissable at night. Lidl also does some kids reflective jackets that were in the shop last week.

He's just a massive irrational cycle hating twat, don't let him put you off

It is so much better for your kids than being stuck in a polluted (and polluting) car. And statistically you and your kids will live longer than the families driving the school run, so any fear mongering from drivers has no basis in reality.

I don’t think this can be correct. Cycling on roads amongst car exhaust is much harder on the lungs than being in an enclosed car breathing in filtered air.

please can I say very nicely for you to check how good your lights are from a distance. Since the darker evenings have drawn in I have been surprised at the lack of decent rear lights on some cyclist's bikes (who were mainly not wearing high vis). Most seem to have small flashing things which really don’t show up well from a distance.

and yes he was a horrid twat and I hope you can put it behind you.

Studies in several different cities have proven that you're exposed to much higher levels of pollution inside a car than on a bicycle. amp.theguardian.com/environment/2018/dec/13/cyclists-exposed-to-less-air-pollution-than-drivers-on-congested-routes-study

Meh, some people are twats. Try to learn to shake it off OP. He won’t be the last.

And here's info about increased lifespan of cyclists vs non cyclists. There have been a number of studies on this as well. www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2018/12/31/drive-sharper-live-longer-look-sexier-and-43-other-reasons-to-ride-a-bicycle-in-2019/amp/