To think it's not a foregone conclusion that Labour will win the next election?

[flashbac]

I am seeing things here and there predicting Keir Starmer being our next prime minister etc, as if its already been decided.

I won't be voting for them under Keir that's for sure. Their stance on Gaza is the straw that broke the camel's back. I don't care if the Tories get in again. I am so disenfranchised I dont give a shit and at least with the Tories its "better the devil you know" and not Labour pretending they give a shit about people/human rights.

I won’t vote Labour. Whilst their ideology’s are admirable, they have not set out how they will source the money for it.

They haven’t set out anything. They’re very sensibly keeping their cards close to their chests until they publish their manifesto.

*A vote for the Conservatives is like voting for the gang that broke into your home, smashed everything up, took everything - including the Christmas presents under the tee - and shat on the floor.

No one, no-one, rewards behaviour like that by inviting them back.*

Except they’ve been back several times in the last decade.

Twice to be precise, on two of the last four occasions they didn’t get a majority.

No but they have set out 5 missions that will be the backbone on their manifesto, but have neglected to say how they will finance it. I’m not convinced they can afford to implement them. I am however, not an economist or such like, so might be worrying over nothing.

Spot on !

I remember the Sheffield rally. It was held the night before the election. Nobody seriously believes it cost Labour the election. The polls had Labour narrowly in front but they failed to account for 'shy Tories'.

The polling companies changed their methodology after that embarrassment. Do you think having Cameron as de facto leader will help the Tories? He is a cannier operator than Sunak or Starmer. A plausible rogue. He can't hurt anyway...they've nothing to lose now.

I prefer the old days when all the leaders were boring as hell and you just voted for a party of your choice!

@GoonieGang "I won’t vote Labour. Whilst their ideology’s are admirable, they have not set out how they will source the money for it."

Neither have the Tories. Because they haven't published their manifestos yet.

No party tells us the truth or even the full story on how they will finance things - they can't because they are all bound by events and changes that occur. If the Tories had promised to massively increase our nation's debt and spending in 2010, or again in 2019, or to have increased taxes to record post-war levels, would that have been a vote-winner for you? Because that's what they have done.

Excellent point @Fieldofbrokenpromises.

Potentially a full year to the next election, that’s a long time in politics, not convinced it will be the labour walkover predicted by many, hung parliament seems as likely

I think this is Labour’s mistake

Blair/Brown started their campaign to win the election long before the election was called, we knew their vision we knew their goals they just presented it very nicely packaged with slogans/sound bites come election time

What does Labour stand for now what is their vision most people could not tell you

I have no real idea what Sirky and his bunch stand for. Nothing new, innovative or exciting. their policy at the moment seems to be "remember sheffield say nothing" we need people in politics with convictions and views, real policies and direction. no one is giving me this.

Who is "Sirky"?

Sir Keir. Mr Starmer. You know, leader of the labour party.

I honestly don't think the current labour leader can win easily, it certainly would have me worried we'd have conservative again.

If someone like Andy Burnham was in the role it would be a landslide, but I think we should keep him in Manchester as our mayor.

Why not say that, then?

The issue is that the opposition’s ideas are stolen by the current government, bastardised and implemented in a perverted form and they take the credit for them. The windfall tax on energy companies is a prime example. I’m really glad they’re sitting back, watching the government destroy itself and keeping their powder dry until an election is called. It’s a very sensible strategy.

Yes I agree Andy Burnham would appeal to many more voters

people do vote for someone they feel would be a good PM I know on MN it’s so often dismissed that people don’t vote for a PM (and technically we vote for the local MP) but vast majority of voters will not know their local MP’s but they do know leaders of the party are

And a strategy that’s working, given the lead in the polls.

And there's way more Tory Self Destruct to come.

Have you ever voted Labour though?
Would you ever consider voting Labour again?
If not, then it really doesn't matter.

I like Andy Burnham - he's got that northern no-nonsense thing and I do like a Mancunian accent - whereas Keir's accent is an awful, nasal whine.

Admirable criteria.

😆

I’d encourage you to keep an open mind until you see it all set out and not dismiss them just because they haven’t yet done that. It’s too early to have all the details published, that’s what a manifesto is for.