To think Europen governments need to respond to immigration?

[Finlesswonder]

So the Netherlands is going to have a far right government.
Sweden has moved to the right.
Finland has shut its borders.
Countries that have traditionally been liberal are hardening and irrespective of the many issues listed its to do with immigration.

Ireland has seen violent protests last night following a series of stabbings.
In the UK we obviously had Brexit.

I think governments need to start responding to voters feelings on immigration as if they don't we will continue to see a general slide to the right in Europe, when actually these countries aren't right wing: it feels like a single issue is distorting the entire political landscape?

No idea? How

If it’s that hard - for you again - traffickers tell people what story to tell and they convince people it’s safe.

Ending up in Rwanda is a much harder sell.

With all this stuff do people know what they are arguing for?

What do you even want to see with what’s incoming

Oh I see, I understand what you mean now.

I think you're kidding yourself. As I said before, if you are willing to risk dying in the channel, you are willing to gamble that you will be in the 99.9% not sent to Rwanda.

The numbers going to Rwanda under the plan were tiny. It was just a performance for the UK electorate. Sorry if you fell for it.

It’s not just my view so no kidding necessary. No need to apologise 🤷‍♂️ I know what a successful immigration plan is like, it’s taking ages for U.K. to get close to what I’m used to

What is it you actually want to happen?

What do you mean by 'no kidding necessary'?

I didn't actually mean I was sorry, it is just an expression.

I can't believe people think a very expensive scheme to send 0.01% of those who cross the channel will make any difference. But I guess the government wouldn't keep selling these stories if there weren't people willing to swallow it.

The stories part is traffickers informing people what to say btw. Your attempt at superiority is grating for sure but you still will lag behind countries that have sorted it.

That will get harder as migration pressures get greater, there’s no getting around that.

You didn’t answer, what is it you actually want to see?

Oh, you aren't from the UK? Why are you so interested in our immigration policy then?

Not sure if you’re completely unaware but people can hold more than one passport, and yes I am ‘from the U.K.’ nice bit of xenophobia there

It’s of great interest to me I’d prefer it for my dc if the U.K. sort it out

I have no idea why you and others are battling so hard against a plan for how to tackle increased migration

It’s bizarre and the most head in the sand stuff I’ve seen, god knows why when it’s so obvious. And any answer on what you want to happen?

I've said on lots of threads.
I think Rwanda is a bonkers waste of money. I'd build closer relationships with Europe and tackle the traffickers instead.
But the real issue for me is legal migration. And that basically requires some investment to reduce e.g the government could start paying universities rather than making them dependent on overseas students to exist. This government won't do that. So we need a change of government.

it’s taking ages for U.K. to get close to what I’m used to
This doesn't sound like you are resident here, maybe consider your own use of language before insulting people

I'd build closer relationships with Europe and tackle the traffickers instead

What does this actually mean in practise? I think you’ll find it very hard to ‘tackle the traffickers’

If it were that easy the Med crossing wouldn’t be an increasing issue either

There’s a constant supply of people ready to pick up that profitable business and it will get greater

I’m from two countries I’m used to both 🤷‍♂️

And you tried to insult with your pick up on ‘not from the U.K.’ anyway

The perpetrator was an naturalized Irish citizen who lived in Ireland 20 years. Ashling Murphy was murderered by someone from an EU country. I don’t see the relationship between them - unless we think everyone from any other county is more likely to murder people than Irish people. Which is ridiculous.
The rioters are not reflective of Irish society- they were mostly teen boys from a deprived area of Dublin.
But I see that people are disillusioned with the cost if living crisis and, in particular, the housing crisis - lots of people seem to be blaming asylum seekers for this but I haven’t heard talk against all foreigners from all other countries. I could only hope that only a tiny minority would like to return to being the inward looking, white catholic country with bad food - that we once were.

The two people who intervened in the incident in Ireland were, as I understand it, a) from Brazil b) from France.

Agree. Numbers are rising sharply and some people are still on denial on the serious consequences of unsustainable number of immigrants would be bringing to Europe. Funny that the same people also want excellent services, NHS for all and social housing for all. They may need to be reminded that land is finite. More people need to be net tax payers to keep services going and diversity of skills and experience is needed when considering immigration.

You have just explained why the Rwanda scheme is a fairy story for the gullible: There’s a constant supply of people ready to pick up that profitable business and it will get greater

And yet other countries have managed it….

Any idea what you want to see yet?

What does this the stories part is traffickers informing people what to say btw mean please? I am trying but struggling to follow what you are posting.

Why do you think, given all you say about increased migration to come, that a tiny scheme like Rwanda will make any difference?

The two halves of what you say don't seem to fit together 1) this is a massive and growing issue 2) a tiny intervention like Rwanda will fix it.

Oh, I'm ignoring that. I'd rather talk about why the Rwanda scheme is total bollocks.

You are so certain it will work, which I find unusual - you seem to really believe in this government.

I bet you are. You can’t answer

Like I said I’m used to another immigration policy not just the U.K., and what has been implemented works so well not even Labor will touch it. It’s bi partisan.

All this handwringing decades after they did it is bizarre. Especially when most know what is incoming

And quotes like this are the reason people feel that they can’t voice their concerns about immigration. Not everyone who thinks uncontrolled immigration is a bad thing is racist. You’re the one trying to be simplistic by putting everyone in the same box, because it suits your narrative, and is lazy thinking. Fortunately more people are now finding their voice.

And you can't answer the questions about how the Rwanda policy would work.

You have a deep personal faith in it, I can see. But faith is not an explanation.

Only 0.01% of those crossing the channel would have even got sent to Rwanda. How would that deter people? The traffickers will simply say 'The British have a pointless scheme to send a tiny number to Rwanda, but 99.9% of you won't be affected.'

I know what has worked. Do you?

I don’t care what it is but I do know that most people are incredibly head in the sand over it all.

You can’t answer and if you think about what countries will face you’d probably want to.

Universities are fucked because of the push for them to accept such a large proportion of the population. They increased their size, and particularly their infrastructure, so they require a large number of students to continue to attend to pay for it.

But population decline factors into that, but maybe more the reality that we don't need 50% of people to be university educated, and in fact it's a waste of money and productivity to be parking them in university for four years. Plus it's caused degree inflation and negatively affected teaching content.

I think students who really belong in universities should be fully funded, but it needs to be far fewer than it is now. They are probably going to have to shrink which will be hard.

That being said, universities are one area where a lot of international movement is common and probably important to their functioning.