To think State education is really poor?

[Boswelian]

We sent our eldest to a taster day at a private school. He was agog. His school don't allow playing on the grass when it's wet. The private school change them into waterproofs and wellies for break. PE 3x a week. Sport every day. Dedicated specialist teaching in art, DT, languages, sciences etc. 16 in a class instead of 30. The difference in the quality of life between the two school has really blown my mind. The state school is "outstanding". The private school reckon DS is 2 years behind their curriculum. We've been told in state that he's meeting expectations. How is this remotely acceptable?

It isn't acceptable but when state schools get 1/3 of the funding per pupil that private schools get you can see why

Very misleading. 16 children in a class compared with 32 are going to need double per head funding just to provide the teacher. And not all independents charge x 3 what a state school receives per head .

Many would close. And funding won't increase in the state sector. Places at good schools will decrease as private school parents move into catchment. Lose-lose.

The majority aren’t bad. That is a ridiculous thing to say. Nearly 90% are rated good or above by Ofsted which isn’t easy to achieve.

No not really. Private education causes huge inequalities. The fewer the better. It is about time it’s recognised and I hope labour do something about it.

If that is the case then state pupils should clearly always be made a priority in applications for top jobs and all uni applications. Clearly it’s a bloody miracle they get any qualifications and that should be recognised. A state pupil with the same results as a private puil is clearly a far higher achievement. 🤔

Parents of state school children are perfectly entitled to give their school money to make up the difference of they’re not happy with the level of funding.

Many schools rated “good” are far from desirable. The bar is set pretty low.

The reality is that a huge number of state schools are not places where you would choose to send your child if there were other options. I fully appreciate state school parents defending the system because they feel any criticism reflects badly on them which of course isn’t the case.

You do realise that this policy will accentuate the current inequalities while at the same time removing opportunities for lower earning families in both the state and private sectors.

Its hard to think of a policy whose aims are so far removed from its inevitable outcome.

No the biggest cause of inequality in this country is private education. A teeny tiny rich proportion of the population can afford it or £££££ housing.

The best most wide sweeping way of increasing equality is to do something about private education. The Tories have done zilch and change needs to happen.

Ok then clearly state pupils with the same grades need to be made the priority in all job and uni applications. After all they’ve achieved the same in dire circumstances so are clearly far superior candidates.

“Something needs to be done about private education to stop the inequality”.

I know let’s gets rid of any possible access to private schools for lower earning families while at the same time leave the people who we have an issue with to continue with their elitist education and by definition become even more elitist.

Great plan Baldrick!

Why would someone who appears to strive for fairness wish to unfairly discriminate when it suits?

All that will happen is that bursaries for lower income families will end and private schools will become for the trulybwealthy only. Thus actually increasing the inequality gap.
A >10% reduction in DC going to private school = £0 net income from VAT.
Labour know all of this but they don't care.
If they were truly bothered about improving state education then they would be talking about ring fencing income tax, but they aren't.
VAT policy will add an additional 16,000+ students to the state sector this September 2024 at a cost of 100m+. The policy is already costing the treasury more before they’re even in power! Where is the extra budget coming to fund those 16,000+ places and more expected in next couple of years?

Private schools aren't the issue. The issue is chronic lack of underfunding of the stare sector. Labour have successfully created class warfare on this one in a populist policy. They just want to create the Them V Us divide and sadly people buy into this without digging into the details and facts.
Labour should be looking to improve state education with a sustainable policy through income tax. That is the only way of raising standards in state schools.
They aren't saying that they will do this.
6500 new teachers is about 0.25 of a teacher per school and does nothing to stop the attrition rate.

Does anyone think that those defending private education have very little experience of good state education?

We considered private education for DD for secondary but when we did the maths it was clear that it would be a huge stretch and we wouldn't be able to support DD through university. We took the view that paying for a tutor would be an option if required, which we did just for maths as she had a not great maths teacher.

DD went to a good state comprehensive, smashed her GCSEs and A levels and graduated from an RG university that required AAA with a first in a STEM degree.

The all state schools are rubbish mantra is simply not true.

We did state primary because the village state school was fab.
Private secondary because local state secondaries are dire.
State 6th form because the local 6th form college ie great.

I am not ideologically wed to private but I just want to do the best for my DD.
If we were in a grammar area then she would probably have gone to grammar.

There are good and bad schools in both sectors, most of us just do what is best for our DC.

The 90,000+ SEN DC in private are there for a reason ie mainstream state can't accommodate them.

Fundamentally the comprehensive 1 size fits all has proved not to work. It doesn't work for many SEN, it doesn't work for many high achievers and it doesn't work for many low achievers. What we actually need is MORE choice not less.

We’ve used both and we have similar results from state for Ds, STEM at RG

I don’t agree with the VAT policy due to all the reasons that keep coming up. It’s just a gimmick and will have poorer outcomes

Of course labour don’t care because a tiny number of families get bursaries and a tiny number will pull out of private. The scaremongering and frothing is all from MNers with kids in private. The rest of the country know the reality and the damage private education causes. The Tories lack of any attempt to sort the huge inequalities private education brings just showcases their entire time in power.

It’s not unfair discrimination. At the moment private school pupils are unfairly represented in the top jobs and unis for literally no good recon as state pupils get the same grades and actually have far better life experience. That is unfair discrimination and needs to change.

Hardly any low earners can access private education. All children from low and middle income families should have the same chances as kids from rich families. Sorting out private education unfairness properly will level the playing field far wider and in a more though way- but of course those with kids privately educated don’t want that.😂

Does anyone think that those defending private education have very little experience of good state education?

Absolutely.

Plus you have to be able to defend forking out upwards of £150k - £200k per child for a private education from age 4 through to 18.

I’ll say it again, if what you say is true, then why would you support a policy that will make the situation you appear to have an issue with even worse? It makes no sense.

I’m not sure the most appropriate way to correct perceived discrimination is to create an alternative discrimination in the opposite direction.

If >10% leave private school then there will be £0 income from VAT.
For every DC that leaves private means an extra burden on the state because that pupil now needs funding.
Short sighted.
If DC from state schools get the same grades and have a better life experience then what is the issue with private schools? Leave is to waste our money for no benefit for our DC.

VAT will bring in £1.6 billion. The unfair advantages private education causes needs to stop with proper measures put in place. Then it wont be a teeny tiny number benefiting but the vast majority.