'Free Childcare' - Are your future plans dependent on this?

[KateyCuckoo]

Are you counting down the days until this starts in April?

I'm starting to wonder how this is all going to pan out. Speaking to providers, they are worried and listening to parents, they are unaware and breezy about the whole thing. I can't help but feel that it's going to be lose lose situation when I was always hopeful it would be win win.

I spoke to one mum the day after it was announced back in the Spring and she thought it was starting immediately, that providers just sent off their invoices to the government and got paid, deal complete. When I explained how it actually worked, she was crushed. How and why I don't know.

I've also spoken to many more people in the interim and no one seems to be concerned except for providers. Some parents are making plans based on the funding easing their finances so they can afford to move house, have another child, drop work hours, change careers.

Have you made plans for when you start to receive 'free childcare? funded not free

It's going to be an utter shitshow. The 'funded' places at the moment are already in short supply. Not to mention the funds the government pays the provider is way below cost - so parents are having to top it up.

Childcare providers don't like the funded hours because of the above, and I can envisage the demand for places exceeding the supply.

I'm not too worried - our nursery is not very popular and is subsidied by the church it's in. So unlikely to feel much impact.

I think many other places will see price hikes.

Would love a discount on my fees but not optimistic.

Childminder here, currently we get paid around 70% of our usual rate for funded places in my area, so parents are asked to top up so we don't lose out on money. I can't afford to lose the difference, so I wouldn't offer a child a funded place unless the parent/s were willing to top up. In an ideal world that wouldn't happen and I find it frustrating that they call it free childcare when it obviously isn't. Imo it makes the childcare provider look greedy when actually they're just trying to keep the same income as previously by charging top up fees.

Two women I work with, one friend, a cousin and my sister's best friend are all having another child because of the 'free childcare' they will get. There could be more people I know who are currently pregnant or trying who have this as their reason, but these women have specified the childcare as the reason and one friend is moving to a bigger house because she will save so much on childcare.

It seems like parents on mumsnet are aware about the shortfall of not only funding but also places. However in real life, everyone seems oblivious!

Round here there is already a shortage of places for under 3s so if more people want their younger children to attend there will be problems. Cost wise, the private nurseries charge top ups so they won't suffer. The preschools already cater mostly for over 3s so I don't think they will be much affected either. Can't get a childminder for love nor money - probably because they are so cheap - so they may not be affected either

No I am not. Surely anyone with sense wouldn't depend on it?

I think if they allowed a top up then it would work. That means each parent gets an ‘allowance’ towards the bill and hopefully guard against rises.
whilst we haven’t made plans based on it, it will have a massive impact on how tight we are finding things and be a small amount of breathing room.

We have plans for when DD gets the 30 funded hours which isn’t for another year. The 30 funded hours for 3 year olds has been in place for a long time so we don’t think any new government would get rid of that. Our plans aren’t having an extra child or moving house, it’s something that we won’t put in place until those hours are confirmed and something that can be cancelled. It looks unlikely there will be a general election before April so the funded hours will start kicking in before a new government can scrap them (that’s not to say it won’t be quickly scrapped when a new government is in) and we should get the benefit in April. We aren’t planning anything with that, we know it’s not going to be 15 “free” hours and 15 hours doesn’t come close to meeting our childcare needs so we’ll still have a large bill.

Even with the 30 funded hours, I don’t think we could afford to have a second child until DD is 4. I think we’d have to time it so that my maternity leave covered the last 9 months of DD at nursery. Even with the funded hours and sibling discount we can’t afford two lots of full time rates. A lot of people don’t realise it’s funded. Plus tax free childcare thinking we only pay 80% but it’s capped and that cap works out at about 3 days for most nurseries.

Will the 15 free hours from April, be for all 2 year olds all will it be from the term after child turns 2 ?

“Dependant” no, massively improved? Yes.

Labour are considering changing it so it may not exist anyway. So no I haven’t made plans based on this, but it will be nice if it does come in. Our nursery charges top up so won’t lose out, but it will be money off our bill.

I wish the rules would make top ups allowed in their simplest sense. Instead they make it all so complicated which is why invoices often need a maths degree to work out.

What are labours proposals? What are they planning on changing?

recent survey found that only 17% of providers will be able to afford to offer extended funded places. Check out Pregnant then Screwed.

Under the Conservatives this is not a sustainable offer.

This is not and never was ‘free childcare’.

Providers are being screwed to failing financially if they accept the low rates the government offers them. The shortfall is the providers not the government.

Many providers already closing, staffing nearly impossible and due to the low government rates providers can not afford to increase wages.

I’ve only got one child who is 20 months so anything will be a bonus but I’m not counting on it. I’m not making any plans based on having extra cash. I’m very confused by the whole scheme though- so a nursery charges say £70 a day. The government don’t actually pay the whole £70 so the nursery charges a top up to make the extra back. Is that right?

How does the 30 hours work? If you work 15 hours a week do you still get the 30 hours? Or is it based on 30 hours if you work full time and adjusted accordingly?

I don't see why it will work any differently to the current system that has already been set up for age 3+. Most proper childcare providers are already registered for that and for tax free childcare and most parents already have to go through the exact same process just one year later to get 15 or 30 hours free, and it's really not an onerous process at all, it's just one of life's admin tasks. IDK why there would be a big drama about it when it's just an extension of something that already exists, with (AFAIK) the same eligibility rules but younger age of onset for 15 hours free.

If it doesn't come in, we can't buy a house, because mortgage applications take childcare into account for affordability even if you're only paying that amount for the next 6 months (as we are if this works but I've no reason to think it won't).

Because the current system isn't properly funded. The fact that a setting is able to offer a certain amount of inadequately funded 'free' hours now says nothing about whether they can afford to dramatically increase that number. Some settings are only able to afford to offer the 30 and 15 hours now by charging more to privately paying parents.

Question - does anyone know how it's going to work yet? I can't seem to find any details about it online (eg eligibility, how to apply, where's offering it) which is a bit strange given it's not that far away now? Or am I missing some hub of information somewhere?

Hasn't changed my plans at all. I'm due to give birth in Jan so in theory should benefit from it but thankfully don't require govt subsidies to fund the nursery fees of my stb 2DC.

People that I "know " on line seem to be relying on it and making plans to put DC into nursery as a result but I expect a) it to be pulled b) nursery's not to be able to afford it so not accept kids who can't pay full fees c) if a and b don't happen the pool of people eligible will be lower than expected.

I don't trust the Tory government as far as I can throw them and labour have said it needs to be costed

Should also say my eldest turns 2 in April

Parents will need to get an eligibility code which will have to be reconfirmed every three months or so, which is how the current entitlement for working parents of 3 and 4 year olds works. There is some more information online here. https://www.childcarechoices.gov.uk/upcoming-changes-to-childcare-support/

From April 2024, eligible working parents of 2-year-olds will be able to access 15 hours childcare support. You can usually get funded childcare if you (and your partner, if you have one) are:

• in work
• on sick leave or annual leave
• on shared parental, maternity, paternity or adoption leave

The entitlement starts the next term (funding period) after a child's birthday.

Because if lots more people are entitled to ‘funded’ places, there won’t be enough places in nurseries and childminders for them! The funding is inadequate anyway, so childminders and nurseries will take people paying the full fees instead. Nurseries are closing left right and centre and childminders giving up completely as they can’t run a viable business.

It’ll be rather like the way that you’re ‘entitled’ to an NHS dentist, but lots of people can’t actually get registered with one because it’s not worth the dentist’s time treating patients on the NHS as the finding isn’t adequate, so they take private patients in preference.

Anyone planning another baby/moving house based on the fleeting fancies of a dying government is being very naive.