To think that some parents like to label their children as dyslexic/dyscalculic/dyspraxic or as kinaesthetic learners....

[MrsSchadenfreude]

...rather than accept the fact that their child might not be particularly bright/academic, and by so doing this detracts from children who genuinely are eg dyslexic?

Kewcumber Kineasthetic learners are those that learn by 'doing' rather than just listening or seeing. ie you prefer to carry out an experiment yourself rather than watch a teacher or read about it in a book.

I don't think that way of learning is another way of saying a child isn't bright, any more so that saying an auditory learner isn't bright - it's just their preferred way of learning, it's what works for them.

I've read (skimmed) this thread with interest. As a TA in secondary I tend to support whoever needs it in the class whether they have an 'official label' or not. Dsylexia manifests itself in so many different ways - not just reading/spelling but memory issues, organisational issues etc I don't think it does anyone any good making sweeping generalisations about 'dyslexics' or 'dyspraxics'. We just have to accept that people are all different & have different strengths & weaknesses.

YANBU OP, I understand that you are saying that some parents would rather an SEN label than admit their child is naughty, lazy, etc.

It is annoying as a teacher to see how many pupils/parents at secondary school level demand an SEN assessment (not full statement), because they want extra time in the exams or an excuse for little johnnys poor grades as they won't admit little johnny is failing due to lack of effort!

It doesn't help the true SEN kids to have the SEN teachers time wasted in all these uneccessary assessments, as it makes it harder for them to get a time slot and the extra help they need to unlock their true potential.

My brother is not a very academic person. He is not stupid, just not suited to academic study (he is certainly quite intelligent) however, my parents have always claimed that he is dyslexic. HE is not, but it was an excuse for anything. But then, when it comes to my brother, they come up with excuses for him all the time.

Why are SEN teachers doing assessments? They don't have the qualifications to diagnose dyspraxia, dyslexia, Asperger's, ADHD or anything else mentioned on here. Except kinaesthetic learner maybe.

I never bother to tell the gawping public that ds1 is autistic when he kicks off now as I got fed up of the cynical looks. I just say 'he can't talk' (he's 9 now so big) and that seems to get a more understanding response.

Teachers can become qualified to diagnose dyslexia jimjam.

can they? I'm surprised the psychologists have let their grip loose on those.

ONe problem I think does exist is with the result of a dyslexia assessment. So dyslexia=25% extra time in exams. Automatically now, with no sliding scale of need. I have taught people with varying degrees of dyslexia- and really some desperately needed the 25% (or more) to be 'fair' whilst others really didn't. It was better when it wasn't an automatic allocation.

The other issue with this thread (I know it's old) is the naivety that people have surrounding statements. They don't dish them out for just having a condition. It would be incredibly rare for someone with dyslexia to get a statement, and is difficult with dyspraxia (a true hidden disability if ever there was one). Even in ds1's case- severely autistic - non-verbal- requires 24 hour help - we had to go back and forwards arguing before we had an even vaguely sensible statement that ensured he wasn't going to escape and be knocked over in his first week at school.

Totally agree with jimjam re statements.

mrsfreude I think you are being so judgmental.
So let me clarify what your line of thought is, you think a parent seeing his child struggle at school is:
a) able to conclude that yes, his/her child is in fact dyslexic/dyspraxic
b) go to an educational pscychologist and inform him/her of the findings
c) and happily get a diagnosis and get the extra help
d) Hurrah, problem solved. Oops and apologies to those who genuinely needing help.
You are talking nonsense. You are massively misinformed.
You are in no position to know what other people?s children are having to go through.
And it makes me really sad for children out there whose parents are trying to get the help they need and are being judged by people like you.

jimjams, here the senco (we all know what I think there lol) do a basic test then if neded refer to lea

she missed ds1- definitely dyslexic, picked up at juniors- and as labelled ds2 (waiting for tests) when he clearly is just lazy

YABU. DD3 has Dyspraxia and yes she is not super bright but she has average intelligence and her dyspraxia sometimes pulls her down. It was very difficult to get her the help she needed. Also I know that qite a few dyslecs and dyspraxics are very bright and your attitude does not help.

sadly i think that yes there are parents out there who are so competetive they feel the need to make an excuse for any percieved "failure" in their childs academic ability.

And yes it does mean that those with a genuine difficulty will get less than the attention they deserve.

Its not just academic though. My ds is Autistic and has associated behavioural problems. there is a child at school who has a severe disability...he has bloody awful parents who have absolutly no idea and no discaplin at all. mother goeas around saying " i think he hs that Autism thing that XX has"

no dear he is just bloody naughty because you have failed in your role as a parent.

---can you tell this is a bit of a bug bear for me?

Bug bear for me too Mamazon.

I have a dd 8 yrs and a dsd 8yrs.
I have posted on here before asking other mums for advice about dsd as she has had many difficulties at school and at home.

In her first yr her teacher told us she had "special needs", she didn't specify and to be honest not a lot happened other than she was put on ELS.
After a lot of back and forth to the school and with her mum, the school then said that she had learning difficulties associated with reading and writing and that they felt she may be dyslexic as some of her behaviour matched as well.

GP said that although she had some behavioural issues, that she was not in his opinion experiencing learning difficulties.

2nd yr at school and her mother had latched onto the special needs label and basically, stopped doing h/w etc, stopped support at home and dsd fell even further behind. The teacher hadn't even read her notes from the previous yr and again called us in to say that she needed extra support and she wanted to have her on the "concerned list" with a view to getting senco involved.

I know next to nothing about special educational needs, i cannot state in any way shape or form that i am qualified to comment in the general scheme of things, but as far as my dsd is concerned i know that the fact that her mother and indeed her teachers latched onto this so called special educational needs label has hampered my dsd greatly. In effect they all decided that she had low potential and didn't try to push her further.

She is now about to go into yr 4, after lots of meetings and rows with the school, her mum and an ultimatum to either assess dsd properly or have her removed from the school dsd is now working at an average level compared to her peers.
We have employed a maths and english tutor to help her catch up, ( 30 mins a week from each) and we have also worked with her mum to ensure that she gets at least 5 mins reading or maths practice at home every night.

If we hadn't done any of that dsd would still be stagnating in a "focus group" with other children who have genuine educational difficulties and she would not have improved as much as she has done over the last 6 months or so.

dsd is not and never will be an academic genius, but this isn't because she needs a statement, this is simply because she is fantastic at art and dancing type things, not so interested in the more academic subjects.
She does still have behavioural issues but we are working hard to help improve those and she has a bright future ahead of her.

I am not in any way stating that children with learning difficulties do not have a bright future, the point i am making is that if you wrongly label a child you can seriously damage their future outcomes.
Friends son on the other hand, is ASD, has to have a lot of support from senco etc but has just successfully completed 5 GCSE's. His future is bright because he needed and got a diagnosis that was appropriate to him and has therefore received the correct help.

I do actually know of a teacher who wanted to get a child in teh class assesed as having SEN so that she could get an extra TA in the class. the child was perfectly fine but he did have a rather loud personality.

she knew that if they could coach him into passing a SEN assesment teh schoolw ould get funded for an extra TA.

what hope have you got when dealing with lazy teacher's like that.
I just feel so very sorry for the parents and child.

Newforold - i am so glad your Dsd is making improvments and im sure with your combined hard work she will continue to progress.
It is a shame when people feel that a ladel of SN means that they can just rest at ease.

I've just read this whole thread thinking, 'not another one of these' and then realised it's the same thread from back in March. I only realised when I came across my post

A label of dyslexia isn't a guarantee of extra support and services.

Thanks Mamazon.

OP I know what you mean...of course there are those that are genouinely worried about their children and those that have every reason to worry...but there seem to be parents out there who almost want a label....
Here where I live a lot of children are appanretly ADHD....and very often, I think the Kids are just "normal" Kids, that are just lifely....I htink often it seems to be a matter of getting them statemented for the extra benefits the parents can claim then....and that makes me angry.....with those parents it is often a lack of proper parenting if anything

I am not talking about genuine cases now, o.k., before anyone jumps at me....!

Indeed it does detract from the real cases and it will make it harder for those who need the statement to get one.
A friend has had such a fight on her hand with her ds, who has aspergers. Makes me cross for those that really need it!

My DS is 'naughty' and 'difficult' but most definitely not as a result of my parenting. What label should he have?

VVV...I am not saying that some children don't have true behavioural problems and that those are NOT a result of poor parenting...honest...I know those Kids do exist...but I do find that , where I live, a lot of Kids are labelled adhd when they are just lifely little beings, often acting completely age appropriate, too....
But that is what I mean....the label should only be used for Kids that actually are whatever the label says...does that makes sense at all?

Having a diagnosis does not mean that you get support, not without one hell of a fight.

I once taught a set of kids aged 11-12.

2 boys had dxes of ADH, ADHD and one of the two also had severe EBD. 4 or the children had reading ages of 6-7 (remember that these kids are aged 11-12), one girl in the class had english as an additional language, her mother tongue was arabic.

the class had 18 kids in it, the other children found schooling hard but had no specific learning needs, though one had fairly sever epilepsy.

I had no assistance at all.

My son has dyspraxia and via the RAF we have got him 10 hours of 1 to 1 support. His reading age has gone up 2 years in one year and is now within the normal distribution curve. With a scribe he got 94% in his history exam and 96% in geography, and did above average for most of his subjects. Without the assistance that he has received, at the right time (and this is key), he is making progress.

Had he not had this help he would have ended up like one of the 4 kids with reading ages 4-5 years behind their actual age

But ADHD is diagnosed by a paedriatrician. Surely they're suitably qualified to distinguish between children with the condition and poor parenting? Have you ever been through the process of having your child referred to the paed? You don't just whizz your child in and out, tick a box then get a diagnosis. It's an extremely thorough process.

well....so, why are some of those children then so nice and completely normal behaved at nursery...and tbh, the same goes for when you see them out and about....surely, adhd has certain behaviour patterns that would be noticable...I am not talking about overly naughty children....
I do NOT know how these parents managed to get them labeled as whatever...I jsut see that those are children that =seem to respnd really "normal" to their environment....

ADHD is not just about being 'naughty'

also, those parents when seeing my ms always say, oh is he adhd....which he isn't ...he can be difficult,highly strung, lively, boystrous , but he just needs to be kept busy all the time....he needs to be challenged, otehrwise he just gets bored easily and then he will be "naughty"....but those people believe that he is just like their child and therefore "label" him with adhd...and I do take offence to that, tbh....and maybe that is why I started to question if all their children are really hyperactive/adhd and whatever else....