It’s another “don’t have any friends” one

[ForTheLoveOfFriends]

I know that threads like this come up on here all the time but I just need some perspective, because my dp thinks I’m being unreasonable.
I have always struggled to make friends. I’ve always got on with people, have always been able to talk to them, but it never goes beyond that. I’m not talking about having a large group of friends who go out regularly or anything like that, just people I can catch up with occasionally, maybe for a coffee, maybe for a chat. But it doesn’t matter how many people I talk to, it just never happens.

So over the years I’ve got on with people in various settings, work/hobbies/through mutual acquaintances (usually my dp). But as soon as I ever suggest that we say, catch up for a coffee if we haven’t seen each other for a while they’ll either agree that we should, say that they’ll be in touch and I never hear from them again, or if I do follow up they’re still really busy so so will let me know, or will arrange something and then cancel at the last minute.

Or if we do get together with people, it’s a one off and I never see them again.
My eXH acknowledged that I didn’t have friends. Used to tell me that he couldn’t understand why people didn’t like me, and he pretty much conducted his social life without me, which was easy because he commuted so his friends were closer to work.

My DP has friends, people who he even says take an interest in me, but as soon as i physically enter into the equation everything changes.

It’s got to the point where I just don’t bother any more, because I know what the outcome will be.

So at the weekend my DP was invited over to the house of someone he knows through an event they attended together a couple of years ago. She invited us both over, but she doesn’t know me, so I wasn’t sure if I should go because I didn’t want to intrude. DP talked me into going, assured me that I would enjoy myself, said that I was overthinking things. So I went.

We had a good time. Got on with them, I played with the kids and they seemingly had a good time, and she even said that it was nice to have people over for once who seemingly don’t find it difficult to be around her kids.

Before we went she and dp had been having a text conversation, what time to get there, if we could bring anything etc etc. Then after we left he text to say thank you for the evening and that we’d had a lovely time and hopefully we’ll do it again. And nothing. No response, no acknowledgement, nothing.

And because of all my previous experiences I just know that it has to be me. But I don’t know what I’ve done. I don’t know why people seem to feel like this about me.
Thing is, I can accept not having friends. I’ve spent so long not having frends that I no longer have any expectations. But this has the potential to cause problems between me and my DP. he currently doesn’t live with me. he actually lives some distance from me, so he does go out with people fairly regularly. But we’re talking about moving in together. And I’m afraid of what that will do for his friendships. Because he says he doesn’t want to go out on his own, he wants us to have mutual friends as a couple. But I know that that’s just not going to happen.

he says that I’m over thinking. That people have busy lives, and in some instances that’s true. But when you have this many experiences you just have to accept that it’s you and not all the other people. And I don’t want to sabotage his friendships or make him feel that he can’t go out because of me.

Anyone else been here?

Your premise is unreasonable, because barring a massive drip-feed you sound great. You've also managed to get married and now have another partner, so you clearly can't be that problematic to be around. I think you've been unlucky, perhaps pushing too hard or backing off too quickly in the past. Try to relax, be nice, let friends find you and stop overthinking things about this new couple. I'm sure that sounds hard, because right now you don't have friends, but there isn't any other step you can take.

To a certain degree, I feel the same, however there is something in your post which seems to be about an aspect of you that is repelling other people and that you are concerned about this unknown thing affecting your DP and that is making me wonder what you are referring to here as that feels like it has moved into some kind of magical belief that is holding you back. You do sound great, but you also seem like you could benefit from trying to unearth what you are telling yourself about relationships. You clearly can form them, as the other poster said you have formed romantic relationships so there must be something else going on here. Imagine living life without automatically assuming you were about to destroy all chances of reciprocal relationships and then decide if you want to find out what is happening.

There was no need to answer that text. The conversation was over.

Then after we left he text to say thank you for the evening and that we’d had a lovely time and hopefully we’ll do it again. And nothing. No response, no acknowledgement, nothing. And because of all my previous experiences I just know that it has to be me.

Maybe it's just me, but I'm not sure I would have interepted that text as requiring a response to be honest. They told you in person that they had a nice time. It's understandable given your previous disappointments over friendships, but I really think your DP might be right about you reading too much into things.

I'd have responded to a text like that, I think its rude not to. However, sometimes people are not quick texters and it was only the weekend so don't write it off just yet.

Maybe, thing is where do you go from there?

Different scenario but how many posts do we see on here from women who have been on a date and who text after and never get a response. They are told that as they were the last ones to text if he doesn’t text back they shouldn’t text him again.

By not texting back an acknowledgement she has IMO left the ball in her court wrt contact. And this is the point where I would expect to not hear from her again.

I think you need an opinion from someone who knows you. While by far the most likely explanation is that you've been unlucky, it would be helpful to rule out if you are inadvertently doing something that puts people off. Would your DP be able to give you honest feedback on your interactions with others? To tell you if you talk too much/not enough/if you are tactless/dominate the conversation etc? Your experiences will probably have made you anxious around new people now, and that can effect how you come across.
The other possibility is that you may be gravitating towards a certain type of person who is not best suited to you. It might be helpful to think about what attracts you to want to develop friendships with people and why, and whether your personality is really a match for those people. I spent a lot of my younger years trying to forge friendships with people with lives like my own. Same age group, circumstances etc, and struggling to find them fulfilling. It turns out that the people I get on best with are actually nothing like me on the surface, but we share interests, values, humour that makes for much better compatibility than same age and lifestyle.

I agree with you, the ball is in their court for contact now. What a shame that things pan out this way for you, you sound lovely and its sad to read someone feels this way about friendships. Maybe you just haven't met your people yet.

You will meet your people. Don't give up x

I agree with your partner that you are overthinking it all. You had a social evening that you enjoyed, but still your negative thinking can't let you simply enjoy that fact.

You have a partner who is offering a route into mutual friendships but again your self doubt is putting up barriers to enjoying that.

The first step is recognising that internal voice that's constantly telling you you're a failure and telling her to shut the fuck up. You are fine and just as worthy anyone else.

I don’t understand people who say they don’t have any friends but have had multiple long-term partners. How did you get together with them?! Unless they took the lead and you did nothing to try and charm them, flirt with them or generally be likeable? You can’t be that bad. I think a lot of this is down to your own self-confidence OP.

I think making new friends is exceptionally difficult when we're older.

My life situation and circumstances are very different than yours, however, it is my observation that there's lots of things other people have that I don't. This is not 'self pity' just the bare bones of it:

Solid family of origin structure, for example live fairly close to or are in good regular close contact with their parents, grandparents, aunties, uncles, cousins, nieces, nephews, etc. (I do not have this, estranged from family since childhood due to parental abuse and dysfunction)

Have own children still of young-ish age ie under 25 living at home or in close contact. (I do not have this, no children, by choice)

Have lifelong acquaintances / friends from childhood schooldays. (I do not have this as relocated from where I grew up in my teens in order to flee abuse and dysfunction, did not partic keep in touch with anyone pre-FB and internet and mobile phone days).

Have a wide variety of work colleagues and contacts that are 'friendly' with and / or maybe even a good friend or two from work. (I do not have this as presently cannot work or even volunteer due to severe illness, incapacitated, and previously was self-employed very much a solo thing)

Live in a setting that is anyhow conducive to neighbourliness and at least the odd chit chat with neighbours who are friendly and not terrifying or dangerous. (I live in what turns out to be quite a hostile environment, not related to me, and with zero community - when I'm well again, I'll move because of this).

Have a partner who is also active and has friends (I don't have this as I've not been well for the last three years and my last relationship ended 5 years ago and was abusive so I took 'time out')

OK so what I learned on reflecting and observing on all of the above is a few things.

1. The vast majority of people over 40 who have some or all of the above are literally not looking to make new friends, have zero interest or time or space to make new friends. If they encounter you they think you're adorable and fun and like you very much but they are not looking to maintain a new friendship. Not personal. Mostly they're up to their eyeballs - life has never been more stressful than it is now.

2. If you don't have any / many of the above structures in place, you'll likely feel lonely and friendless. This is just a fact that one needs to bear in mind and consider how to combat.

3. For the purposes of hoping for new friends, best stick to meet up groups, college classes, community centre groups, etc, where other 'lonely' or time privileged people are hanging out (not all of them are).

4. It takes years and years and years to establish and keep new friends. Just be consistent over time, be authentic, be cheerful as you can be. Find people you genuinely like and find hobbies and activities you enjoy.

5. If you think you're actually putting people off you for some reason - consider the following - are you being bullish and over-talking in conversation? Are you being opinionated and political when others just want a laugh? Are you being 'invisible' and shy and held back so they don't barely notice you? Are you being weird and clingy and needy? Do you smell strange? Have you got a bad habit? Did you overstay your welcome?

Otherwise, don't beat yourself up, life is strange. Ramp up your strengths, go out into the world with your chin up, befriend other people don't wait for them to befriend you, enjoy people, do new things, join some clubs. Quit trying to hammer away attempting to make friends in the arena you're currently in as they're not looking for a new friend, they're probably busy, honestly, people are busy.

By not texting back an acknowledgement she has IMO left the ball in her court wrt contact. And this is the point where I would expect to not hear from her again.
Not necessarily. I'd have given a thumbs up or something to acknowledge the message, but equally might forget. The ball is certainly in your court to invite them over now, that's how it ought to work, not for them to invite you again.

I honestly think things like this are a self-fulfilling prophecy. You've got it into your head at some stage that people reject you and there's something about you that ppl don't like. Then you behave in ways that anticipate rejection and it isn't conducive to forming friendships e.g. you don't put yourself out there for fear of rejection. You take things personally.

Has this been a lifelong problem? Did you have friends when you were in school? Uni? Work colleagues who became friends?

I think you sound self-aware enough to know if there was a particular problem with your behaviour. Your ex said he didn’t know why people didn’t like you. Surely he would have told you if there was an issue people had with you?

I agree with @GRex here. I see your point about technically being the last person to send a message, but it's a message sent after the other woman hosted a whole party/event. She did the (massive) effort for the last time you met up.

I'd say the ball is in your court/DP's court for now arranging the next thing.

Maybe try that, and see where it goes?

You need to remember that women are in the majority, crap at socialising after a certain age and also are not bothered about making new friends. This isn't the case for them all but you need to find your tribe. Which is near on impossible unless you really make the effort. I've moved around and really struggled to find friends but I'm lucky I still have lots of friends from the past. Can you reconnect with any old friends? Can you join any social clubs where you will meet like minded people? Can you find groups of people with common interests? ( since I've been pregnant and had a dog, my social circle has expanded exponetially).

I wouldn't worry about it affecting your relationship with your partner, you will soon have mutual couple friends as things progress, but always make the effort (unlike where you said you didn't want to intrude). That person who didn't reply was probably too busy and forgot, I'm sure it's nothing personal (or go back to first comment where I say women are crap). It's really tough and I feel for you but just keep making the effort and keep being the confident one to set up meetings. If they say no, they are probably too self involved , not that they don't like you.

Good luck and you aren't alone and its not you that's the problem xx

I’m not good at friendships. Part of the problem is that I’m very happy on my own and I’m an introvert that doesn’t do small talk. I tend to skip that part and try and establish a connection and I know I can come over as very intense.

However, I was married to a sociable extrovert for many years. I assure you my personality did not stop my husband making and keeping many friends. We saw many as a couple, he had some that were his bloke friends and I have stayed friends with one or two people I consider ‘my’ friends.

So I repeat, I know that I did not cause him to lose friends, so in this case I think your partner is right.

I have watched my then husbands success with people and he is very smiley and laughs a lot with people wether it’s face to face or by phone. I knew him so well I could tell his fake laugh a mile off. He actively finds a hobby or passion with the person to have a subject to keep in touch about. He needs people to like him and will happily be friends with others who have racist or homophobic views, or those he considers to be inferior to him.

He likes to offer to do lots of favours for people. His philosophy is that he likes people to feel slightly in debt to him (acts not money), and he can call in favours. He views life as very transactional.

Everybody likes him and thinks he’s a great guy, so I tell you this so you can see a blueprint of what works.

I can’t do this, it’s too fake and inauthentic for me. It takes up too much headspace and time for me. Maybe you will think that too.

But it works for him. Not everybody who is popular does it this way I know.

@Isheabastard - hmm interesting stuff you raise here.

I'm not the OP but you've really given me stuff to think about here. I am ASD and cannot do any of those things either but also observe them all around me. I've noticed my friends who have a heck of a lot of friends also do these manipulations and games and inauthentic transactions - but they do work don't they?

I just can't do it... like flat zero... ho hum, loneliness beckons LOL

@Isheabastard

In other words he's a user of people. He cultivates friendships his own ends .

I would agree with PPs that there was no need for her to respond to your thanks, and it's only been a couple of days, she's probably busy.
What I would do here is leave it a couple of weeks then invite them to something you've organised.
(By the way as someone in early 40s with kids, we probably only socialise properly as a couple with friends every couple of months if we're lucky)

I had friends at school but I grew up abroad so when my parents came back here I came with them and lost all my friends as a result.

Never really had work friends, again, acquaintances but I worked in a very cliquey office where there were already established friendships when I joined so fitting in was never really an option.

I did have some mum friends but we moved away when my eldest was in y3 and again, school gate friendships were already established. It actually suited my eXH for me not to have friends as he didn’t like it if I went out, although he went out frequently.

Now I work from home so the potential for making work friends is 0.

Its difficult Im 50s. Reached out to a few lately a school mam. 2 couples he worked with yep we must meet. I stopped as feel Im always chasing up.. then do you appear desperate lol. I thought lately dont think its me. Just lives are busy. People dont commit. Its disheartening though.

Excellent response from @JFT

I can empathise with some of your experiences. All I can say is I think you have been very unlucky. I can understand why you feel disheartened. However keep making the effort where you think it may be reciprocated. People are busy and often it's not personal (as mt DH frequently reminds me). Sometimes I have to tactically withdraw sometimes when I need to regroup but generally I keep trying to be sociable where I can with people I'd like to spend time with. Sometimes those efforts pay off, more often than not they don't, which is pretty normal. But if you never try then there's no hope for change, and I think there is hope for you.