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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to say Taylor Swift is a once in a generation songwriter?

606 replies

HomeatRoseCottage · 27/10/2023 19:33

I’ve had 1989 TV on all day and she’s just magic 🥰

OP posts:
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9
readbooksdrinktea · 28/10/2023 00:38

Bbq1 · 27/10/2023 20:45

She's massively overrated and not that talented. Aren't all of her songs about her break ups with various celebs?

I don't get the hype either. I suppose she has great PR.

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 00:38

That's great for them. But I prefer artists who write their own songs about their own thoughts and experiences or who draw from their own imaginations (not someone else's).

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 00:39

My post was supposed to be a reply to one up the thread. Quote fail.

OkImListening · 28/10/2023 00:39

I am a "reluctant" fan because my daughter plays her songs all the time. Taylor's lyrics are so so clever. I now always play her songs on the Alexa when I'm cooking. We are going to see her next year, literally can't wait. I'm 49 btw, if that means anything.

EmmaEmerald · 28/10/2023 00:42

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 00:38

That's great for them. But I prefer artists who write their own songs about their own thoughts and experiences or who draw from their own imaginations (not someone else's).

So...she's blasted for writing about her own experience of misogyny, mental health...but also blasted for writing a song as a tribute to someone's child.

wow.

saythatagaintome · 28/10/2023 00:45

LOL

AngeloMysterioso · 28/10/2023 00:45

If she didn’t have rich parents who knew the industry and created her into a character, then she wouldn’t be famous.

Her Dad was a stockbroker and her Mum was a SAHM when she started out.

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 00:46

EmmaEmerald · 28/10/2023 00:42

So...she's blasted for writing about her own experience of misogyny, mental health...but also blasted for writing a song as a tribute to someone's child.

wow.

No, lol. I'm a swiftie. Not meant at you. It was a response to the Rhianna and beyonce comment.

Panaa · 28/10/2023 00:59

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 00:46

No, lol. I'm a swiftie. Not meant at you. It was a response to the Rhianna and beyonce comment.

It wasn't a dig at Taylor.
I was just saying that I think the demand for the tickets seems to be from teenagers rather than people over 30 as a pp said. I don't know any women (without kids) or groups of women who are regular concert goers who tried to get tickets.

MassiveWordSalad · 28/10/2023 01:00

Yes, I suppose she probably is the voice of a generation, but it's not a great generation for music. I've heard a few of her songs and they're ok - none of the stuff I've heard on the radio has made me rush to listen to a full album. The impression I get (possibly not a fair impression) is that she mostly sings about her romantic relationships. She appears to be pleasant and hardworking.

One artist that really grabbed me growing up was Tori Amos, and I love her still. She's a child piano prodigy who grew up to be a singer-songwriter and has released sixteen albums to date. The first two albums she co-produced, then the rest she has produced herself. She writes all her own songs, and plays piano and other keyboards (sometimes two at once). What grabbed me and pulled me in, apart from the sheer beauty of the music, is the astonishing range of subjects she covers in her songs. She's an unashamed feminist and examines the female experience in incredibly inventive ways. There are songs about the difficulties of growing up, love, loss, grief, being a ghost, rape, Napoleon, female genital mutilation, the Native American experience, Jungian psychology, masturbation, wanting to kill a co-worker, the patriarchy, motherhood, mythology, the American political landscape, psychedelic experiences, the Gnostic gospels, criticism of mainstream religion, criticism of pornography, fame, the Kennedy family, sisterhood, criticism of homophobia, the death of the American dream, and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

Through her music I've been introduced to the writing of Neil Gaiman (one of her albums, Scarlett's Walk is a companion piece to his book American Gods) for which I'll be ever grateful. There are many literary reference in her songs, from Alice Walker, Michael Ondaatje, Henry James to Daphne du Maurier to name just a few. Through her I discovered Joni Mitchell, Stevie Nicks, Leonard Cohen, David Bowie and Carly Simon.

I also love Kate Bush and PJ Harvey, but it's way too late to start on their genius tonight.

Those are my reference points from growing up in the nineties, and I'm not sure that any musicians around today can offer that breadth of experience, to be honest.

Greatbigfluffytrousers · 28/10/2023 01:10

I do like her stuff and think her lyrics are very clever. I think the comparison with Ed Sheeren is very apt - they are both really talented writers and it feels like both are able to think “what is going to sell write now” and fire it out. Can feel a bit soulless but I think they are both very shrewd, talented and very savvy operators. However, I’ve been listening to a lot of TS lately and can feel myself getting a bit tired of the references to her own appearance in her songs 😆 I think I’ve heard enough for the time being about her nice dresses, tight skirts, wide eyes and rosy cheeks so I might have a Madonna binge as a bit of a palate cleanse. Then am sure will dive back in again.

I don’t think Taylor has yet written her “There’s a guy works down the chip shop swears he’s Elvis” yet but hopefully she will.

catnipevergreen · 28/10/2023 01:11

I was aware of her as being a young country singer , and I'd caught her songs on tv etc. I'd heard her song with Ed Sheeran called Everything has Changed and loved it (it's a beautiful song ) I was on a plane coming back from somewhere and 1989 had just came out. I listened to it as I had nothing better to do and I was pleasantly impressed.
I'm a bit bemused by the level of obsession that her fans display but I don't mind her. My daughter likes her and we listen to her a lot in the car etc.
I highly doubt that people have never heard any of her songs - surely everyone has heard Shake it off somewhere at some point ? And if anyone watches The Bear I doubt anyone didn't cheer when Cousin Richie was singing Love Story in the car in the Forks episode . I cried a little to be honest!
So anyway - yeah I think she's a talented songwriter and she's pretty harmless

Greatbigfluffytrousers · 28/10/2023 01:12

And yes, Tori Amos is wonderful.

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 01:12

MassiveWordSalad · 28/10/2023 01:00

Yes, I suppose she probably is the voice of a generation, but it's not a great generation for music. I've heard a few of her songs and they're ok - none of the stuff I've heard on the radio has made me rush to listen to a full album. The impression I get (possibly not a fair impression) is that she mostly sings about her romantic relationships. She appears to be pleasant and hardworking.

One artist that really grabbed me growing up was Tori Amos, and I love her still. She's a child piano prodigy who grew up to be a singer-songwriter and has released sixteen albums to date. The first two albums she co-produced, then the rest she has produced herself. She writes all her own songs, and plays piano and other keyboards (sometimes two at once). What grabbed me and pulled me in, apart from the sheer beauty of the music, is the astonishing range of subjects she covers in her songs. She's an unashamed feminist and examines the female experience in incredibly inventive ways. There are songs about the difficulties of growing up, love, loss, grief, being a ghost, rape, Napoleon, female genital mutilation, the Native American experience, Jungian psychology, masturbation, wanting to kill a co-worker, the patriarchy, motherhood, mythology, the American political landscape, psychedelic experiences, the Gnostic gospels, criticism of mainstream religion, criticism of pornography, fame, the Kennedy family, sisterhood, criticism of homophobia, the death of the American dream, and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

Through her music I've been introduced to the writing of Neil Gaiman (one of her albums, Scarlett's Walk is a companion piece to his book American Gods) for which I'll be ever grateful. There are many literary reference in her songs, from Alice Walker, Michael Ondaatje, Henry James to Daphne du Maurier to name just a few. Through her I discovered Joni Mitchell, Stevie Nicks, Leonard Cohen, David Bowie and Carly Simon.

I also love Kate Bush and PJ Harvey, but it's way too late to start on their genius tonight.

Those are my reference points from growing up in the nineties, and I'm not sure that any musicians around today can offer that breadth of experience, to be honest.

Taylor's Tolerate it is on a similar theme to Tori's China.

I would actually argue that Taylor's albums folklore and evermore are in a similar vein to Little Earthquakes.

StoatofDisarray · 28/10/2023 01:13

I've never heard any of her songs. I've heard snippets but they didn't move me.

NeverTalksToStrangers2 · 28/10/2023 01:16

Panaa · 28/10/2023 00:59

It wasn't a dig at Taylor.
I was just saying that I think the demand for the tickets seems to be from teenagers rather than people over 30 as a pp said. I don't know any women (without kids) or groups of women who are regular concert goers who tried to get tickets.

You probably do. They just haven't mentioned it.

I'm 44 and very much a Taylor fan myself. I have kids but they are coming with me to see Taylor, not the other way about. They are also teenage boys, and don't proclaim to be fans, but still don't want me to give their tickets away, lol.

Catsmere · 28/10/2023 01:28

I just listened to Anti-Hero. Never heard any of her music (or listened to any recent music by choice). She has a lovely voice. Unfortunately I couldn't understand the words apart from the chorus, so can't comment on her songwriting!

spacecadette · 28/10/2023 01:31

Yabu.

She's mediocre at best.

CinnamonCoffee · 28/10/2023 01:37

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

CinnamonCoffee · 28/10/2023 01:42

Try again...
It seems pretty hard to grasp that different people like different things. Posting videos and song lyrics is pretty cringe while trying to convince people how wonderful she is.
Personally she's monotone, dull and the lyrics boring.

baroqueandblue · 28/10/2023 01:45

Itwasamemo2 · 27/10/2023 19:58

Think Ed Sheeran is far more talented.

To my knowledge I've never heard a Taylor Swift song, but been unfortunate enough to have my ears bled by Ed Sheeran a couple of times in shops. If he's better than TS, I hope I'll never have the misfortune to stumble across any of her music! 😬

isthatmyage · 28/10/2023 01:53

OK cannot be arsed to read all the thread ...basically if Taylor Swift is featured in an caption competition where people are asked if this 'lyric' is Taylor Swift or Shakespeare then in my view...she's won 😍

steff13 · 28/10/2023 02:25

I'm surprised that so many people haven't heard any of her songs. I guess the movie Sing wasn't popular among kids over there?

DeeCee77 · 28/10/2023 04:15

MeinKraft · 27/10/2023 23:46

'The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Queen, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Elton John, David Bowie...she's nowhere near this level in popular culture.'

They all have one thing in common that Taylor Swift doesn't have...

They are all groundbreaking?

I know they are all male, could have named Madonna too.

The Beatles - Let it Be
The Rolling Stones - (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
Queen - Bohemian Rhapsody
Led Zeppelin - Stairway to Heaven
Pink Floyd - Comfortably Numb
Elton John - Your Song
David Bowie - Life on Mars

Taylor Swift - ?????

Quick scroll through her songs listed on YouTube...out of curiosity listened to 20 seconds of Cruel Summer.. its certainly not to the standard of the classic song of the same name.

Could name any of the seven legendary acts above and 10 of their achievements, but will just go with Queen:

Popularised the music video (via "Bohemian Rhapsody")
First major act to play South American stadiums
Played behind the Iron Curtain (Budapest)
"We Will Rock You", "We Are the Champions", "Another One Bites the Dust"... the three biggest stadium anthems (can't go to a sports stadium/arena anywhere on the planet and not hear those songs)
Highest-grossing music biopic (over $900m Bohemian Rhapsody)
Musical ran for 12 years in the West End (We Will Rock You)
Greatest live performance ever (Live Aid)
Influenced every popular music genre, from heavy metal to pop (includes having a major star named after one of their songs: Lady Gaga, "Radio Ga Ga", and the first chart-topping rap song (by Vanillia Ice) using the "Under Pressure" bassline)
Largest benefit concert for a musician (Freddie Mercury Tribute Concert)
Record attendance at Sotheby's auction house (140k) for exhibition of Mercury's Garden Lodge possessions

Taylor Swift... besides the current tour gross (and that's a record held by The Rolling Stones four times, and if Freddie Mercury could somehow come back from the dead and perform Queen would smash every record in sight) what has she done that is groundbreaking? To be 'generational' you need a lot more than cheesy pop songs co-written by you and your team.

HappiestSleeping · 28/10/2023 05:50

Snowdayplease · 27/10/2023 23:31

I can't imagine how Mean / All Too Well / Anti-hero could sound remotely similar. They aren't even the same genres.
I love the country stuff myself.
Also love Morrisette, and think they have something of the same vibe at times.

I couldn't possibly quote any instance. I'm just going by what I heard on the radio, where I genuinely thought it was the same song until the DJ said "this is the new one from..". I am not knocking her success, but it's hardly Lennon and McCartney.

Pop music over the last 20 years has been almost devoid of key changes, which is what makes it so uninteresting.