To give up breastfeeding 3 week old?

[Octosaurus]

Every time I breastfeed my 3 week old he spend the next few hours crying, spitting up and wriggling in pain.

On days where I exclusively breastfeed he also has had bad diarrhoea (12 poos a day vs his normal 5/6) and a red face and body.

When he has formula (when i was sick in hospital and when my supply had been too low for his appetite) he is much more content. He drinks, he can be burped nicely, no vomiting or spitting up and no diarrhoea or red blotchy skin.

I am so upset because I wanted to breastfeed and I feel like I can do it, I have a good latch and good supply now!

The doctor said there's no way he can be allergic to breast milk end of. I am coeliac and don't eat wheat and I gave up milk in case there was a dairy allergy.

I am seriously thinking I should switch to formula but I don't want to make him miss out on the benefits of BF and I'm afraid I will be judged.

Anyone been through similar? Or got ANY advice?

@Octosaurus I wouldn't give up just yet if you personally want to continue once you crack it is is so so easy and convenient. Do you always feed him in the same position ? Have you tried rigby ball hold, laid back feeding, side feeding ? It sounds like he's getting too much air at the breast x

I'm very pro-breastfeeding but I think you should stop!

If you're seeing this clear difference between breastfeeding/formula go for it. Maybe just try combi first, to double check he won't have the same reaction to formula before you leap, but if it works it works. He's had three weeks of breast milk, which will have included the colostrum.

It's awful watching them in pain, it's really not worth it if breastfeeding isn't working.

I think whether you’re pro or anti breastfeeding (and yes, some people are) telling the OP what she should do isn’t on. The most important thing here is the OP makes a decision she has reached independently.

@Octosaurus I have a very tricky history with breastfeeding. I don’t mind admitting I am pro breastfeeding, but being pro breastfeeding isn’t being anti formula. I cried at 5 days because it just wasn’t working and I thought I was going to have to switch to formula. I had a lactation consultant and the full works but nothing worked.

As it is I express breast milk. Like you, I just can’t bear to let my milk dry up. I think one of the big things with pregnancy and birth is that our bodies want to revert to normal long before our minds do! I was bizarrely upset when I thought my period had come back (it hadn’t.) Maybe that’s crazy but it’s my body and I’m allowed to be crazy

Whatever choice you make ensure it’s one you’re going to be happy with don’t let anyone pressure you either way.

If poo is green or fizzy, he may not be getting enough of the hindmilk. Breast milk behind as a drink and the fatty "food" comes later. Babies who suckle frequently but not for long get too much foremilk and not enough hindmilk and this can also make them gassy. A feed with a newborn can easily take 40 min. Don't switch breasts if he has just had a quick guzzle on the previous feed.

I couldn't believe the diarrhoea like nappies of my second baby from breastfeeding. I thought there was something wrong with her as I thought she had constant diarrhoea. My friend who had breast fed 3 assured me that this was normal for her breast fed babies so I wouldn't worry about that.

These are all very helpful messages guys thank you so much for your help.

I think the core milk hind milk might be something to do with it. I was told to switch breasts before they get tired by the lactation consultant! I had so much conflicting advice from the professionals it's crazy!

And perhaps it's not diarrhoea but there does seem to be actual yellow liquid alongside the solids that soak into the nappy that isn't there with formula. Perhaps a forenilk issue still.

I will report back! Thank you again

I am so glad to hear you are beginning to see some light at the end of the tunnel. First few weeks and months with a newborn baby are crazy, well done for persevering for so long! I didn't realise you were switching breasts. As a former BF network and infant feeding volunteer our advice has always been to feed on my breast for as long as baby is suckling. Then if they are still hungry offer the other breast. If you latch does not hurt, your nipples won't get "tired". Your can try feeding skin to skin or changing nappy after 30 mins to encourage longer feeds. (Feeds will get a lot shorter once your baby's suck gets stronger) Poo spilling out of nappies is normal for breastfed babies, I remember it very well. (Also, going for a few days or even a couple of weeks without pooing after 2 months is also normal in exclusively BF babies). Well done you, you are doing amazing!

There are loads of benefits overall population level wise like slightly less risk of cancer and diabetes (for mum and baby) and it's very good for their gut and immune systems.

bUT if your baby is sick from breastmilk he won't get many of these benefits!

I would seek support from health visitor. And perhaps experiment with a bottle that's half an half formulA/breastmilk to see if that's better? If you're going to stop You might also want to express and freeze some
Breastmilk and built up a little stock to see if he can handle it better in a few weeks - if he can then you'll have this handy for when he catches a cold etc.

This is good advice

Trust your own instincts.

What type of milk a baby drinks is a tiny, tiny part of being a parent. It's a stupid thing people get hung up on.

Stop feeling guilty and put the shoe on the other foot: Keeping on with the breast-feeding because of a misplaced sense of duty is preventing your child from being contented and enjoying his food.

Yellow liquid is normal in BF poo. It can reallly have very little solidness to it at all. I also think that not enough hind milk is likely the problem - that’s the milk that satisfies their hunger, the fore milk quenches their thirst. BM is amazing really!

My son is five months old (first child). I was determined I would exclusively breastfeed and naively it did not even enter my head that I would find it difficult. However, it made the first week with my newborn hellish. I did not sleep a wink as he needed to continously feed. Only, despite my best efforts, for me to be told at his five day check up, to take him straight back to hospital as he had lost far too much weight. Blood tests also then confirmed he was very dehydrated. To this day, I still do not really understand what went wrong, I fed him continuously. In comes the doctor at the hospital with a ready made bottle of formula and a disposable bottle for me to feed my son with, and honestly I will never forget the look of relaxation that cane over his little face as he finally got some nourishment. I feel it is important that every woman is supported and encouraged to give breastfeeding a go, but ultimately I also believe formula is a wonderful invention and no one should feel inadequate or ashamed if breastfeeding does not work out. You know in your heart what is right for your baby.

This happened to me too, I didn't realise he was even hungry I just thought he was crying because he was stressed and he can't have been hungry because I was "feeding" him loads.

When I look back at the photos and see how skinny he was and how bad his face looked it breaks my heart!

@Octosaurus I am exclusively bf my 5 week old. Just a thought are you feeding breast milk at the same time every day? My little one definitely has the witching hour (hours!) from 5pm-9pm and displays everything you’ve mentioned…(tbf in my case it also is wind/reflux fast flow but it’s definitely worse between these hours!)

So I tried switching back to ebf today and it's already going badly. The main concern is the puking/ curdled and normal spitting up. He has short bursts of feeds and sleeps in between; fusses looking like he's in agony and then spits up. 7 spit ups in the last three hours of this constant cycle.

Hellp

Do you eat much soy? DD1 was always so uncomfortable after a feed, bad reflux and green mucus poos, I cut out dairy (was told to wait 6 weeks for it to leave system) and she was no better so next was to cut out soy (which is surprisingly in a lot of stuff, especially as a vegetarian all the meat substitutes are soy) and it made SUCH a big difference

You are not 'giving up' you are switching x

'Fusses like he's in agony'.

None of the benefits of BF are worth that. A 3 week old in agony?

You're not a failure if you stop BFing now. You'd be a great mum putting your baby first. He wants to not be in pain, he doesn't care about BF vs FF.

Don’t feel guilty. Go with your gut.

HCPs will never recommend you formula
feed. They are literally not allowed to. So many mums out there struggling in similar circumstances.

My boobs just didn’t produce enough milk even though everyone insisted this was not possible. I got cross with the midwife once when ds kept losing weight and said “if it was your baby would you start bottle feeding” and she admitted yes. I started that day and we managed to mix feed for several months before he eventually gave up the boob. Never looked back.

Hi, there, it's former BFN volunteer again. I am wondering if your baby taking too much air during feeding. Is your baby making clicking noises during the feed? Do their cheeks looked sucked whilst feeding? If the answer to either questions is yes then you definitely need to improve your baby's latch. I am sending you a 7 mins video about what a good latch should look like. Ignore the nipple pain heading, the video has excellent graphics. If the latch is poor, your baby might be taking too much air which explains the symptoms. Apart from watching the video, I would suggest you look up your local breastfeeding support group. https://globalhealthmedia.org/videos/what-to-do-about-nipple-pain/

Sorry if I repeat anything been said I haven’t really read through the posts but wanted to give some input. My baby is 4 weeks and I exclusively breast fed and now combi feed. I had trouble in the beginning and he was on formula the first 3 days as he wouldn’t latch properly. With the breast the amount of poos described is totally normal, I thought he was dehydrated or not getting enough to eat when we started giving formula because he just doesn’t poo much on it. He started having pain too like you described and turn out he has reflux. Vomiting constantly. I feed him in an upright position and keep him upright as long as possible and he only does small vomits. Breastfeeding is better with reflux as the milk leaves the stomach more quickly so he won’t be sick later on. You know what’s best for your baby and you absolutely havent failed if you go to formula feeds instead of breast. I’ve found the formula has really given so much more flexibility when there are problems that come up. I also express my milk and he gets 1 bottle of either breast or formula a day.

One of my babies was like this. He was overfeeding. Got better as he got bigger and I was glad to have stuck with it.

How would it be the latch if the baby has the same reaction to breast milk from a bottle, but not to formula from a bottle?

Have you seen a IBCLC or been to a breastfeeding peer support group or similar? It sounds to me like an issue with latch is causing baby to take in too much air which is upsetting him. As for frequent feeding, this is a prime time for cluster feeding - your baby is putting his order in for his growing needs!

I accept I am ‘person on internet’, please do go and see a specialist in breastfeeding - HVs, GPs and midwives may be well informed but just as often are not! Get someone to observe a feed. Your latch may look wonderful but unless someone with a lot of experience knows what they are looking for things can be missed.

Also remember that look of content babies can get after formula is deceptive - it’s often because they are overfull as babies will happily tank an entire bottle because it flows easily in their mouths. Taking a full bottle of formula after a breastfeed is not indicative of baby being hungry so please don’t worry about that. Breastfed babies also have slightly different poo to formula feeding and switching between the two can be a bit of work for their guts.

but remember most of all that informed is best - if you have had the information you think you need, then it is your decision and it shouldn’t come weighed with guilt. I massively struggled breastfeeding the first 8 weeks and nearly gave up several times, 14 months on and still feeding I’m glad I persevered but you need to assess if it’s worth it for you, and annoyingly only you can make that decision. Breastfeeding guilt and trauma is very real, and whatever you decide does not take away from you being a wonderful mother who cares deeply for their baby. Formula fed babies are not loved any less than BF babies, don’t let anyone even imply that in your hearing. Its bollocks.

The way some babies nurse or bottle feed could include swallowing air with the breast milk if they have a gap in the side of their mouth. A sloppy latch on the breast can be repeated on a bottle.