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Original poster

AIBU to think the disabled are the next target?

384 replies

Locutus2000 · 30/09/2023 13:14

The Guardian

Though Jeremy Hunt said the government was “not in a position” to contemplate a decrease in tax immediately, he said the welfare budget could be hit further down the line to foot the bill.

He told the Times that 100,000 people a year were “moving off work into benefits without any obligation to look for work” – a sign he said showed the system was not working.

The welfare system had to be a “mix of carrot and stick”, with more assistance required to help people find work, given there was “no shortage of jobs”, he added."

Funny how 'carrot and stick' always equates to 'more stick'.

UK welfare budget could be cut to pave way for tax cuts, says Jeremy Hunt

Chancellor says system has to be ‘mix of carrot and stick’ with more assistance to help people find jobs

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/sep/30/uk-welfare-budget-could-be-cut-to-pave-way-for-tax-cuts-says-jeremy-hunt

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
TheThinkingGoblin · 30/09/2023 18:43

SunL1ghter · 30/09/2023 18:38

TheThinkingGoblin

Hold on a minute so are you saying that those of us in our 50s not far off retirement in the sandwich years who have worked our arses off for years far longer than those just starting out without any of the benefits Boomers had and with years of austerity whilst supporting youngsters through Uni and elderly parents with zero care deserve less?🤔

Bullshit. We’ve spent all our lives working for our pensions.

Don't you get it?

There is no "pension". There is no "pot of money".

Its the working population who pays DIRECTLY for the State Pension.

Do you folks not understand basic math?

When the ratio of working folks to retired folks drops from 6:1 (1940s) to 3:1 (now) and people live 20+ years in "retirement"...

The State "Pension" becomes total and complete nonsense.

You may as well offer to pay it with monopoly money.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

SunL1ghter · 30/09/2023 18:44

So those of us that have paid taxes all our lives don’t get what we were promised?

Babyroobs · 30/09/2023 18:44

Sirzy · 30/09/2023 18:42

Why do these things need to become a race to the bottom rather than those who can supporting those who can’t or need more help to do so. Why is it always those ar the bottom of the ladder that need to be pushed further down?

Because as has been explained there is no longer enough people paying tax to support those who need help.

Babyroobs · 30/09/2023 18:45

SunL1ghter · 30/09/2023 18:44

So those of us that have paid taxes all our lives don’t get what we were promised?

Well we'll have to get something but likely won't be as generous as current pensioners get. We'll have to hope that private pension are going to top us up enough !

loislovesstewie · 30/09/2023 18:46

Become an MP; they seem to award themselves great pensions, severance pay, redundancy .

itsgettingweird · 30/09/2023 18:47

It frustrates me on this thread that so many assume disabled people don't work. I am disabled and a higher rate tax payer.

It is frustrating.

My 19yo ds is disabled. Enhanced PIP. He is a software developer (PT) and full time elite para sportsman which is funded.

Wouldn't matter if he worked FT as a software developer as a higher rate tax payer he'll still have a MND and still be entitled to enhanced PIP.

So on the flip side those who aren't lucky enough by the lottery of birth and life and have a disability that doesn't allow them to work I have no issue with them taking PIP and any too ups.

And certainly as someone who was lucky in the lottery of birth and life not to have a disability I've no issue with my tax funding it!

Babyroobs · 30/09/2023 18:51

itsgettingweird · 30/09/2023 18:47

It frustrates me on this thread that so many assume disabled people don't work. I am disabled and a higher rate tax payer.

It is frustrating.

My 19yo ds is disabled. Enhanced PIP. He is a software developer (PT) and full time elite para sportsman which is funded.

Wouldn't matter if he worked FT as a software developer as a higher rate tax payer he'll still have a MND and still be entitled to enhanced PIP.

So on the flip side those who aren't lucky enough by the lottery of birth and life and have a disability that doesn't allow them to work I have no issue with them taking PIP and any too ups.

And certainly as someone who was lucky in the lottery of birth and life not to have a disability I've no issue with my tax funding it!

Unless they start means testing disability benefits.

LolaSmiles · 30/09/2023 18:53

Unless they start means testing disability benefits.
Don't give them ideas. They're vile individuals who think that people should be left to drown at sea and that if they make everyone live in poverty then they'll magically get rid of long term illnesses.
Nothing would surprise me from this lot.

Coveescapee · 30/09/2023 18:53

I am in my fifties and realised in my thirties that I would probably not get a state pension as the money would run out. I think they will make it means tested or only payable after 70s/80s. I feel sorry for anyone who puts faith in anything govt says. My generation (X) and the one before at least had a chance to buy a house, its the next generations I feel sorry for who are likely to be pensioners and renting.

Sirzy · 30/09/2023 18:54

Babyroobs · 30/09/2023 18:44

Because as has been explained there is no longer enough people paying tax to support those who need help.

Show quote history

So look at how we can help people more so they can contribute.

but at the moment the goverment are just making those who have have more and those who don’t have less. It’s all about supporting themselves with no consideration for those who need help.

those who need help are left feeling guilty for asking for help which is wrong

Spendonsend · 30/09/2023 18:55

SunL1ghter · 30/09/2023 18:44

So those of us that have paid taxes all our lives don’t get what we were promised?

I think it will be very hard to give pensioners nothing as most youngsters dont want to see loads of elderely homeless people dying in winter.

But I think we could see means testing of some sort.

Plus raising the age higher still.

TheThinkingGoblin · 30/09/2023 18:57

Coveescapee · 30/09/2023 18:53

I am in my fifties and realised in my thirties that I would probably not get a state pension as the money would run out. I think they will make it means tested or only payable after 70s/80s. I feel sorry for anyone who puts faith in anything govt says. My generation (X) and the one before at least had a chance to buy a house, its the next generations I feel sorry for who are likely to be pensioners and renting.

I don't think it will be means tested. It would create too many problems.

It will just be less generous as it will be uprated more sustainably (vs the insanity of the triple lock now)

I do agree with you about the future of the current generation.

Thats a huge timebomb that will go off eventually (poor retirement savings and still renting).

Octavia64 · 30/09/2023 19:00

Babyroobs · 30/09/2023 14:38

I think something will have to change. There has been a massive increase since covid of people applying for working age disability benefits. alongside of course huge numbers of ageing elderly who are living longer and with ageing brings frailty. Whilst claiming PIP does not stop people from working, claiming it alongside the LCWRA element of UC or ESA often gives people enough income to not have to think about whether they could in fact mange some kind of work so they just stay on these benefits long term. As part of my job we help a lot of people in their fifties and early 60's to claim these sickness related benefits and at that age they are basically just counting down to state retirement age as they know that it will be doubly hard to find employment which recognizes their limitations and accepts older workers. Once a person on UC has been recognised as having limited capabilty for work, their partner has a good chunk of their earnings disregarded so works out enough for people to live off comfortably especially if mortgage paid off and all the extra elements you get on UC when you are deemed unfit to work.

Well, there are a lot fewer pensioners around after covid - see eg www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/statepensionsavingsfollowingthecovid19pandemic
for an idea of how much they are saving on the welfare bill due to the deaths.

I'd imagine a lot of the increase in disability is also due to covid as well - not many reliable figures around on this one but a lot of people seem to get Long covid for at least a few months afterwards...

Justifiedcheese · 30/09/2023 19:04

Spendonsend · 30/09/2023 18:55

I think it will be very hard to give pensioners nothing as most youngsters dont want to see loads of elderely homeless people dying in winter.

But I think we could see means testing of some sort.

Plus raising the age higher still.

Show quote history

Really? I get the distinct impression they would probably say "boomers - deserve it" based on some of the hatred spewed on here...

TheThinkingGoblin · 30/09/2023 19:07

Octavia64 · 30/09/2023 19:00

Well, there are a lot fewer pensioners around after covid - see eg www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/statepensionsavingsfollowingthecovid19pandemic
for an idea of how much they are saving on the welfare bill due to the deaths.

I'd imagine a lot of the increase in disability is also due to covid as well - not many reliable figures around on this one but a lot of people seem to get Long covid for at least a few months afterwards...

Show quote history

Yes. Morbidity in the working population has increased due to covid and lack of NHS access.

This is making the UKs current public finance situarion worse.

Less people paying in tax (net) vs more people taking out (net)

Thats the problem in a nutshell.

There is too much delusiona thinking in the UK, and way too much lying about the situation.

The UK is effectively broke right now.

But too many people operate under the delusion the UK is a "rich" country to understand.

If you spend more than you receive, you get poor really fast.

Thats the UK right now.

Coveescapee · 30/09/2023 19:12

Some really good points @TheThinkingGoblin and still so much waste going on by govt (eg vast sums spent on HS2).

loislovesstewie · 30/09/2023 19:16

Well, my DH died last year. He didn't even get 1 year of his state pension.

Princessandthepea0 · 30/09/2023 19:17

SunL1ghter · 30/09/2023 18:38

TheThinkingGoblin

Hold on a minute so are you saying that those of us in our 50s not far off retirement in the sandwich years who have worked our arses off for years far longer than those just starting out without any of the benefits Boomers had and with years of austerity whilst supporting youngsters through Uni and elderly parents with zero care deserve less?🤔

Bullshit. We’ve spent all our lives working for our pensions.

Of course not. You’ll not get it though. There is no money for people like you. Highest state dependency on record, and every increasing now majority of adults reliant on the state. A minute, upside down pyramid when it comes to tax take which is now at toppling point. A country getting into debt to meet its outgoings. I have news for you and everyone in that situation…so do all the other agencies raising the alarm in the past year.

BIossomtoes · 30/09/2023 19:18

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TheThinkingGoblin · 30/09/2023 19:20

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Princessandthepea0 · 30/09/2023 19:21

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No. I’ve reported you for that. Troll hunting is against the rules @mnhq can check my ip.

BIossomtoes · 30/09/2023 19:22

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😂😂😂😂😂😂

IClaudine · 30/09/2023 19:23

Princessandthepea0 · 30/09/2023 19:21

No. I’ve reported you for that. Troll hunting is against the rules @mnhq can check my ip.

Show quote history

Hope you will report Gobbers too for their personal attack on Blossomtoes.

Babyroobs · 30/09/2023 19:24

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Sorry but this has made me chuckle. I just keep thinking of that old ladybird book that those of us in our 50's might remember about people pulling up a giant turnip😂