Refusing to pay tradesmen

[Wifeoftrades]

DH is a tradesman and has finished job. The customer is refusing to pay and it's quite obvious now that this was always his intention. He has admitted that there is no problem with the work but he can't afford it and never could but it needed doing. DH is out ££££ on materials and paying his employees.

I'm just so sick of tradespeople being treated like this, you wouldn't believe how common it is. There is basically no chance of him ever seeing that money.

How would you like to go to work for a week and then have your company say that they've decided not to pay you? Please do not hire someone if you can't pay them.

Well he needs to remove them, and if the property is compromised then that’s just tough shit.

ill bet when he starts to remove them then suddenly the money will be found.

that wouldn’t actually stop me, I’d remove it all anyway now.

It’s not called Small Claims Court anymore, you just make a claim through the county court and the court fees are based on the amount of the claim. Certainly no £5k limit, you can claim for hundreds of thousands. If this happens to your DH a lot I would definitely recommend getting familiar with the process, it’s quite easy to do.

I’m currently making a claim against a window fitter who stole £3,000 from us.

Yep. This is exactly what you should do. Forget court. Just start to remove the work you haven’t been paid for.

The Small Claims Court does have its downsides - the limit for claims is £10,000 and the proceedings tend to lean sympathetically towards the defendants. The other consideration is it's pointless pursing a "man of straw" through the courts because even if you do obtain an order for payment, if the debtor really is broke and without assets even bailiffs will be unable to recover your money.

That is so horrible, what sort of person engages someone to do expensive work for them knowing full-well they won't be able to pay for it? Arseholes, that's who!

I would go through the courts as has been suggested, but I don't think I'd be able to resist ensuring that all of this persons neighbours, other local tradespeople, work colleagues (including their boss - they might feel he was bringing the company into disrepute) and even their Postman knew exactly what sort of nasty, lying arsehole he was!

I really, really hope your DH gets what he's owed, it's such a bloody cheek!

(Sorry about all the exclamation marks, but I'm raging on your behalf.😡)

I have had a full renovation done and have never not paid a tradesman.
We have always paid in stages and for materials in advance.
I would call the police on him especially if he planned to do this.

Search the address at land registry for a copy of the register - it'll tell you (a) whether the customer owns it (so there's something to get a charging order against) and (b) whether he has other CCJs in which case he might not care about another.
Also google his name and address, see if he's a director. They don't like going bankrupt.
This sort of info might give you a clue as to whether he's worth pursuing, or cutting losses. If no CCJs on property he might care a lot more than he pretends about possible legal action and a nasty mark on his credit history.

Hopefully someone on here will provide you with a suitable letter to send to this evil thief.

However, I do agree that it goes both ways. There are a lot of bastard customers. There are also a lot of tradespeople doing awful, shoddy work and ripping people off.

@Wifeoftrades

This is exactly what the "small claims court" is for. It is a simple enough process but you do need to get all the evidence together before any hearing. Copies of estimate, copy of bill, copy of bank statement [to show non-payment], pictures of the work. Letter from the defendant saying it's OK but he cannot pay.

There is no guarantee that you will get the money [but it is fun later sending the high court bailiffs round.] The defendant will get a County Court Judgment which may give him all sorts of grief!

I couldn't decide if YWBU or not. Surely if it was obvious from the start that the customer had no intention of paying, then that is the time to protect yourself.

Ask for downpayment at least, if not payment in full... or walk away, if it really is obvious that the customer has no intention of paying.

If the purchase of materials is involved, it surely must be standard to have the customer pay for that, etiher directly with the wholesaler, or upfront through the tradesperson.

He owns a property. Get a judgment. Enforce it

This made me laugh not at you op but at the number of people who say on any trades thread that no decent tradie should expect payment upfront for materials or otherwise the. Say the exAct opposite here. People who do this are complete scum sadly there's no recourse other than legal action.

This is awful I'm so sorry!

It's obviously quite common sadly. Thank you that sounds really helpful.

My friend made and fitted 6’ high about 20’ long metal railings. The customer refused to pay.
My friend got his angle grinder and cut them all down. Job done 😂

Thanks for all of the advice I will pass it along to DH.

Those saying to go and take back the materials it really isn't that simple. A lot of them are worthless now they have been used and the most valuable ones if taken would mean the property could sustain significant damage which I don't know if he would be liable for. It's a minefield.

Get them to pay instalments weekly/ monthly
Take out what you've put in
Or take something of a similar value, jewellery, tvs, PS5 etc

My husband is a tradesman. It has happened to him multiple times, but if they ask for money up front the customer accuses of being a cowboy and after running off with the money (which he would never do, too honest and massively undercharging)
It also happened to his mate which sent his business under, what made it worse is it was a local cafe and when he approached them they used cancer as an excuse 😡 and clearly had no intention of paying and had been turning round to trades they owed thousands to and going oh by I have cancer (never high risk btw) now they have the locals all praising there achievements but none of the locals know that they got there through thieving and destroying tradesmens businesses and families. Makes my blood boil

I don't suppose you know what he does for a living (also his spouse or partner if has one) ...if it is a profession that he needs to be a member of a professional body may be worth threatening to let them know.

The area I work in we would get thrown out of the professional body for "bringing them into disrepute" if this kind of thing was to be drawn to their attention

Yes clearly they have property even if no other assets so long term you can get money back off them (unless they are bankrupt)

That is absolutely appalling. How can someone allow a trades person to do work in their home and spend money on materials they have absolutely no intention of paying for?! Can he send in bailiffs or debt collectors OP? My dad is a builder and I think he’s had to take people to the small claims court before. If this guy had no intention to pay then that is theft. Might be worth getting some legal advice to see where he stands.

I've never heard of this before.

You do have the right to remove good which haven't been paid for.

It’s not that hard to go to court. I’ve used small claims god knows how many times for much less than your dh is probably owed.

If it’s too much for small claims you can still go to court or send a letter before action detailing how much it will cost them to fight a case if costs are awarded to him. Courts don’t like cases being bought, they expect people to behave themselves and not refuse to pay tradesmen. It won’t look good for him if your dh has to use legal redress and if he can’t afford the job he can’t afford the court case.

Same but 80s. Also turning up outside work etc and preparing to make a scene.

I have family in a like situation. You have to rely on the goodwill of your customers. Your life really is feast or famine a lot of the time.