WIBU to take this much from DD’s benefits?

[BlueLines81]

My DD is 19 and has a disability, she is not able to work and won’t be able to for the foreseeable. She receives PIP.

As she’s no longer in education, I was not entitled to claim benefits for her from the end of august this year. My tax credits went down quite considerably, and lost CB too, and all of my housing benefit. All together I am about £190 per week worse off. Which isn’t great as I am a single parent and also have a health condition (I receive low rate mobility PIP), and I had to give my job up in July as I couldn’t manage it anymore, so that’s another £1000ish per month down.

I am self employed and doing bits and pieces where I can, to give you an idea I’ve managed about 12 hours of work this month.

I did an online calculator in august and it looked like I would be better off on UC, and also needed to start a UC claim for DD, so I claimed for us both on the same day. We had an appointment at the jobcentre for DD’s claim a couple of weeks ago, and the advisor suggested that I become her appointee and I could have her UC paid into my account, if we felt DD didn’t have the capacity to manage it herself. I asked DD what she thought and she said she’d rather it was paid into my account. I am getting fit notes for both of us from the doctor and and hopefully we will both be entitled to the LCWRA elements.

The idea of being an adult and having to pay bills terrifies DD, mentally she is more like a 12 year old in a lot of ways. I have spoken to her about it and said the options are that either we work out exactly what her share of rent and bills etc would be and she just gives me the money for those, and she can arrange her own food shopping etc, and pay for herself if she wants to come on holidays etc. Or I keep the amount that I’ve lost in benefits for her, she can have whatever is leftover (which I think will still mean she’s better off than she is now with just her PIP). And then she can carry on essentially being a child for as long as she wants (I don’t mean this negatively, she regularly gets very tearful that she’s not a child anymore). She liked the sound of that option better. She just doesn’t want to have to think about finances at all.

But AIBU to take this much money from her? I don’t know the exact figures of what I’ll have lost until we get our first UC statements in a few days, but will probably be at least £150 per week. I know this a lot more than a lot of people take from adult children, which is why I feel bad, but then maybe they have a partner or are just financially in a better situation than I am. Realistically she’s going to be living at home for many more years to come.

Evidence of scoring zero points.

Now you've read the wording on my actual letter, are you satisfied this is real?

Sorry Cola - I can't see it mentioning work at all in the report - am i missing it somewhere?

The reasons for refusing PIP are many and complex, and clearly dispute what you have reported in your application because they are not consistent with the findings of the assessment. Obviously there’s no way to know if this is accurate or not but it’s certainly not a refusal on grounds that you work, as you stated in your first post.

Sorry just seen a brief mention on the first page but that is just one line of the report and one small part of the report. The main issue seems to be that they don't think you have difficulties on the majority of days ? To qualify for the points you need to meet the descriptors for more than 50% of the time.

On page one it says:

"Low mood and motivation would be consistent with seasonal affective disorder, depression and bipolar but you are motivated to work from home for 35 hours a week"

I guess all the psychiatrists and therapists I've seen over the years must be lying then.

I take it the cancer patient previously mentioned is also lying and having chemo to pass the time.

Absolutely not. Your claim was refused because what you reported in your application wasn’t consistent with the assessors’ findings, and there are multiple reasons for refusal, all fully explained. Nowhere can I see refusal on the grounds that you work.

I'm not wasting my time engaging further.

Lots of genuine disabled people score zero.

If you need extra support at work or your employers allow you to work at home because of your health then it may be beneficial if you are going to apply again to include something like an occupational health report. you may have already done this.

Yes unfortunately they do but I have seen some people go from zero points to an award after an MR or appeal so please don't give up hope.

It’s not about your ability to work though, it’s about motivation, which is different. Without knowing what was stated in your application it’s impossible to know for sure but the assessor clearly disagreed with your own assessment of your condition on multiple issues and didn’t consider the medical evidence supported what you were saying.

I wouldn’t disagree with hat at all and I definitely wouldn’t say you weren’t genuine - just that you didn’t make your case convincingly. PIP is a very difficult benefit to claim and those with mental health problems have a harder time than most. I would apply again but get some help from a benefit adviser when you fill in the application form because it can be tricky and as you’ve found to your cost, you’ll be scrutinised. CAB can point you in the right direction and l’d be happy to help you reapply - just PM me.

Perhaps because some people working at DWP (or the outsourced DWP) are nasty pieces of work.

Perhaps because there's a bias towards physical disability?

Note it isn't disputing either mania or depression. I found the 'motivation' to work full time because I couldn't pay for anything otherwise.

They are not disputing you have the conditions but PIP is not about the diagnosis, it is about how the illness affects you in relation to the PIP descriptors, so cooking a simple meal from scratch, washing, dressing, communication/ engaging with others etc and scoring enough points on these descriptors. and as mentioned on the previous post, to score points for any descriptor, you must be affected on the majority of days.

It’s not just about that though. What about leisure activities, doctors/hospital appointments and day to day needs ?

This was low rate mobility on DLA. OPs dad is now on PIP and has obviously had a higher award as a result.

No it doesn’t. Just because the claimant isn’t seen in person or contacted by telephone doesn’t mean their claim isn’t assessed. It just means that the assessor had enough information to carry out the assessment based on the paperwork and medical evidence they provided and will possibly have been able to contact any health professionals involved with the claimants’ care to clarify as necessary. No-one is awarded PIP without an assessment. This can be in person, by phone, or paper based.

Spot on. I think this is where a lot of people get confused. No two people will be affected in the same way by a disability or health condition, so PIP doesn’t look at the disability itself, but the effect on daily life.

Op I think that you need to work out the amount your daughter costs to stay in her home. As she has already managed her PIP, she can have her benefits paid into her account and you can help her set up a direct debit to you for living expenses. You don’t need to make it sound so all or nothing and make her panic about becoming an adult. She sees it as being a big deal as you make it sound difficult telling her she will have to sort out her own shopping etc. That is unnecessary the transition can be a gradual one. The living expenses payment can include food and you can even help her set up a DD for saving for the next holiday. One of my friend’s DC’s is working and pays them £300 a month towards household costs, that includes food, as an example. They are also a single parent on a very low income with other children with Sen. I don’t think that you can charge her the amount of benefits you lost due to her becoming an adult.

Disability benefits like dla/then pip have only been around 30 years. My mum was very disabled from age 40 in the 70s, couldn’t do anything, bed bound. The poverty was unbelievable. There was no help or money. Then she died age 52 in poverty.

I didn't say I didn't think she wasn't entitled to benefits, I said after reading your posts I am sad that others that need benefits probably more imo can't access them.

The reason, as you ask, why I question you is that I think from what you've written it's clear you are claiming so much is because of your own recent financial loss. You said around £190pw worse off plus housing benefit stopped and also £1000 down pm on your own income. The tax credit loss and child benefit is probably the same for a lot of parents when they reach adulthood and finish college education, surely they don't all demand that amount in board, or do do they?

You say she's not capable of doing more than 30 mins at a charity shop yet did a years college course previously, I find that difficult to comprehend. Also she must have attended some sort of school, sleeping 18 hours per day and managing just 30 mins of work even with plenty of allowances for her condition seems odd.

Also, she passed the theory test first time, she actually sounds quite bright to me.

The way you write about Christmas budget cuts, ordering her own food shop, pay rent and bills makes me wonder how this conversation was had and I can't help but think as you need the extra money so bad it seems, that you have somewhat scared her into making her think that you having her benefits is better when actually as she's budgeted her PIP for two years already (your words not mine) she'd be quite able to have it paid to her account not yours. Why not just choose a normal board rate instead?

You claim she's smart and mature sometimes but it does come across you pick and choose when she is and I feel you're holding her back due to the money you've lost from her becoming an adult. It suits you that you write she wants to remain a child because of the money situation, that's how it all reads to me anyway.

Apologies for any typos, I'm rushing but didn't want to not respond to the question.

I was asking because I know people who do this - essentially you would keep the motability car as your family vehicle if you are insured on it then if DD Passes her test either of you can drive it - if she doesn't then you can keep the car as your family vehicle.
From what I have read before - I think you don't have to pay road tax and servicing etc as it is included in the amount they take out of the mobility element ( I might be wrong about this ). Just thinking it might be worth looking in to this and selling your own car.
I am on uc with my husband due to health conditions, i am on pip We went on uc 1 year ago - I am long term pip ( not entitled to mobility just daily living bit ) and my husband had to take some time off his agency job due to illness and his agency didn't want him back cos he was no good to them - stopped offering work ! So we had to go on UC . we already had a car on finance,people told us we would have to sell it but we carried on paying for it out of my pip because we needed it - to look for work and to get to my appointments at hospital.
A couple of months back we had to pay for major service and mot which means we had to cut right back on expenditure to be able to pay for it.
In my experience UC for people who are not working / disabled covers yours basic needs - but there is very little left if anything for that unexpected bill and certainly nothing for luxuries. Plus you would only pay for petrol on one vehicle.

@Meadowflower2023 to answer some points:

1. the £190 included housing benefit, and as I will be (supposedly) a bit better off on UC, I think the real loss would be around £150 per week. It may be less than that, I will know in a few days when I get my UC statement. I never suggested for a moment that DD also replaced my lost wages, just mentioned that because we have had a sudden and significant drop in income as a household, so there was no buffer there. With the cost of everything at the moment things are going to be very tight. I do all the housework, laundry, most of the cooking..which tbh is a real struggle for me but DD is not capable. Occasionally I manage to rope her in to help out but it completely exhausts her, eg I’ll ask if she can hoover downstairs, she’ll do half of one room and then slope off to lie down. So yes I would imagine £150 (or maybe a bit less) is more than a lot of 19 year olds would pay, but most 19 year olds would probably be able to/be expected to help out around the house more. £150 per week including rent, bills, food, meals cooked, laundry done, housework done, zero mental load isn’t a bad deal.

2. she did a one year level 2 course at college, with an EHCP in place to make a lot of adjustments for her. She was put on a part time timetable as she couldn’t manage 2 consecutive days, and even with that in place she missed a LOT of days. She also had a room at college where she could go and sleep when she needed to (which was a lot). It was also a very small group that wasn’t too overwhelming for her. Even so she found it incredibly difficult to get through the year. Similar deal at school, she missed nearly 2 years of school after she couldn’t cope in mainstream, I got her and EHCP and she attended a very small autism unit, where again she was able to sleep when needed, and often just couldn’t engage with her lessons, which were one to one. She was also on a part time timetable there and also missed a lot of days.

3. she’s very smart. Being smart and having disabilities aren’t mutually exclusive. But being smart and having crippling anxiety and becoming overwhelmed at the littlest thing also aren’t mutually exclusive.

@Meadowflower2023 oh and even if I did take £150 per week for her costs, she would still have a significant amount of money each month to spend on things she wanted.