Russell Brand - everyone knew

[Mooshamoo]

I was watching the comedian Katherine Ryan say to Louis theroux that a British comedian is a sexual perpetrator. It is now believed that she was talking about Russell brand. She said on the video "when it eventually comes out about these type of people, Harvey Weinstein, Bill Cosby, this unmentionable British personality, it turns out that everyone knew. Everyone knew. ".

I was wondering did anyone on here on mumsnet know anything about Russell brand? A lot of us lived in London when her was living there. And many women on here would have been a similar age to Russell brand . I lived in London for a year and I saw Russell brand out on a night out once. That was the extent of it. I was wondering did anyone on here have any experience with him, or know about a friend/acquaintance that had any experiences with him.

Sorry 😂not having a go at Steven Bartlett! It was his interviewee that was the problem. SB and his podcasts are awesome 😀.

All pretty irrelevant really

'Alice' the 16 yr old was allegedly assaulted in 2003

Not the 70s or 80s

But then again you seem rather hazy on a few things

It happened but it wasn't normal or widely accepted. I'm in my 50s and can remember rumours or some definitely true stories about young girls and older teachers and it was always the subject of gossip because it wasn't normal and would always be a bit ick. When we were 13 one of our friends had a 17 year old boyfriend and we all found it a bit shocking and told her so. She hid it from her mum for ages because she knew she would get into trouble.

Entirely predictable that the rape apologists and the men's sexual rights activists have found this thread.

It was never acceptable or normal in the 80s for male teachers to have sex with their students. If it happened it was, rightly, treated as a scandal.

Even if it were not this is not a reason to say that RBs behaviour towards the 16 year old was acceptable. It wasn't.

That’s not what I meant. I wasn’t suggesting the papers be gagged. But this media frenzy is dreadful. The man has been found guilty and sentenced before anything has even been.reported to the police. This is wrong. And it is counterproductive. If it does come to court he will be justified in claiming he won’t get a fair trial.

Having both been a witness in a case and been involved in the process in another capacity also, I am under no false illusions that verdicts are reached with rigour and fairness.

The time I was a witness I was astounded at how much rests on BS, sleight of hand, false assumptions, and complainants’ inexperience with the system.

In my case I had witnessed a crime against someone I knew and made a 999 call.

In the run up to court, we didn’t coordinate our stories or even talk about the event. We were telling truth so (naively) thought this would be enough – and as is normal, on the day we were fuzzy on some minor details and had slightly different recollections.

By contrast, the defendants had been coached to all parrot the exact same barebones story. This, I gather, is viewed as more reliable recollection, but is based on the false assumption that a group of 4 people truthfully recounting an event from a year ago will have zero deviation or inconsistency between their stories.

When I gave evidence, the defence lawyer completely blindsided me by suggesting that I hadn’t been there at all – it was such a side sweep that I didn’t even think to point out until afterwards that it was me who made the 999 call, which could have been easily checked. No one pointed this out or questioned what he said, and we had not been warned beforehand (by our duty solicitor we met the same morning) that this is the sort of tactic we should be prepared for.

The process was obviously weighted in favour of the people more familiar with the environment, ie the guilty and their lying, cynical lawyers.

In the courtroom and the corridors afterwards, the guilty parties (who had been found not guilty) smirked and sneered at us before going off for a pint.

It was honestly a horrible experience which actually felt humiliating and bruising if I’m honest. It was nothing like the seriousness of a SA case, and I was just a witness rather than the victim. So I cannot even begin to imagine how traumatic it is to take someone to court for sexual assault or rape.

Sadly, being found not guilty does not mean someone did not commit the crime.

The man has been found guilty and sentenced before anything has even been.reported to the police.

I missed this, how long has he been sentenced for? <punches air>

No - and I was quite shock (I know I'll get lambasted for this). I work in similar circles and all I knew / thought was he was a bit of a fuck boy - shagged around and treated women badly in the sense that he'd shag them and leave and was disrespectful. Like his Aldous Snow character.

Heard rumours about plenty of other celebs but was really disappointed to hear this.

I 100% believe the allegations though and am disappointed in myself for not seeing it

The two are totally different. And it is ridiculous to equate them.

Life.

What do you think you should have seen or done?

We do not know if Russell Brand is a rapist.

We do know he's been accused of rape.

I don't subscrive to Believe All Women.
I subscribe to Take Her Seriously.

This should be taken seriously, and should be invetsigatde by the police.
If it's not, we should be very wary of public condemnation without evidence or trial or defense, that is the route to injustice and a breakdown of the social fabric.

You may now think you 'know' RB is a rapist. You don't. You know he;s been accused. Maintasin that distinction.

If only! I agree that’s what rapists should get though. 👍

Glad we’re on the same page!

Good I believe the women.

Why anyone thinks any man should get away with sexual assault and rape is beyond me.

Less 2% of rape results in conviction which means that essentially rape has been decriminalised.

Are all non convicted rapists innocent in your eyes or should people who use a public persona as a platform to abuse be called out on it?

@ehupo7 not anything I could have done, but feel duped that I fell for his carefully crafted persona where he drip fed just enough to pull the wool over people's eyes. I knew he was a massive twat but thought he was obnoxious and slimy at most.

Saying that though, I only met him in passing a few times, never chatted to him and I don't think he ever came up in discussions really.

Again, this sounds stupid, but feels a bit like 'well OF COURSE he was a creep. Literally everyone you've met in your life with that sort of persona was. Just because he's famous doesn't mean he wasn't a creep'.

I hear what you’re saying but don’t understand what else you were supposed to have known.

You already formed these opinions:

I knew he was a massive twat and

thought he was obnoxious and slimy

So what else were you supposed to do?

These were 16, 17 year olds at the time. This isn't excusing or condoning anything - I thought it was utterly revolting then and still do. But not everyone agreed back then, particularly slightly older generations than mine. My experience was that the biggest backlash to it all in the mainstream didn't start coming until the 80s, esp once Childline kicked off, and you started to get a lot more discussion of abuses of power.

@ehupo7 yeah nothing I can do, just feel like a bit of an idiot myself and watching his shows / seeing his tour / reading his book all the while not knowing. I'm not the only one, obviously, but assumed I'd have been savvier than that (as there's other people/ shows / franchises I do actively boycott because of what I've heard).

(I'm talking about my own school experiences and generational differences in attitudes there, btw, not Brand and his penchant for schoolgirls)

Likewise. I used to be really partial to Johnny Depp as well.

It's that Wounded Poet thing. The oddball outsider with the artsy streak. Groooooo.

I never saw his stand up but did see him on big brothers big mouth

The thread on Huw Edwards was interesting because apparently a 61 year old sexually pestering 17 year olds last year was ok. What wouldn't have helped in the RB case is the young woman's mother, BBC staff, her teachers etc all knowing and being ok with it.

His name is all over the papers because he is a celebrity. He’s used to it. He wanted it his whole life. Now he’s got it.

He is bipolar and before managing to turn his life around was clearly subject to major episodes of mania as well as being a former heroin addict and alcoholic. Why is his former abominable behaviour a “revelation”? The real question is why was it allowed to go on and why was he not being treated?

Raping people is not a medical matter. Brand went to several clinics for treatment. I do not think had he been bipolar that they would not have seen it.