It's a school shoe spot the difference thread!

[TheUnstoppableWindmill]

Can you work out which of these shoes is NOT an acceptable school shoe for a policy which states that students must wear black shoes of polishable leather in a non-trainer style?

I've got a year 7 child just starting secondary school. We were encouraged to email the Head of Year to check that shoes are acceptable under the school policy if we had any doubts. Thanks to a helpful Mumsnet thread I sent a handful of pictures in the style that I know if comfortable for my son. I was told these were "all perfect."

The ones I bought have now been rejected. I genuinely can't tell the difference.

So, AIBU to think that if 3 out of 4 of these shoes are perfect, then they should all be acceptable?
And can you guess which ones are too "trainer-like"?!

Should clarify that what I meant in my last post was, if (some) Velcro ones are ok, then the school should include pix of acceptable ones in the info it sends. Velcro is a necessary option for sure.

I had an argument once re ds; he wore lace up shoes but bc he played footy at break times, the pointy smart ones were not suitable, so I got him lace up ones that were more like trainers for practical reasons. School agree iirc.

Oh this is really tiresome isn't it. No I can't see anything particularly worse about the Hush Puppies, unless it's the branding on the outside they're objecting to?

Was just thinking back to my secondary school days 10-ish years ago where other kids would have definitely had something to say about the Velcro.

I'd like to think kids are taught to be kinder these days. DS y10 has always chosen velcro, and DD y7 chose ones like these too. They can do laces and do on their trainers, but prefer velcro. And I prefer something robust like these purpose made school shoes, rather than lace up office style shoes that seems to be the alternative. They have a lot of walking to do, and hopefully some running around at break times too. Nobody appears to have said anything to them or indeed care what's on anyone else's feet.

If they’re saying you need to buy new shoes, email the SENDCO and ask for a reasonable adjustment to the uniform policy for your DS as he needs a specific type of shoe to manage. It shouldn’t be a problem.

As a teacher, I firmly believe any school with such an inflexible uniform policy to be the opposite of child-/family-centred, especially when we're under the yoke of a cost of living crisis. No primary or secondary school in the region I work in could justify such demands; our families simply cannot afford to comply.

In addition, research undertaken by the EEF has previously found that a strict uniform policy does not impact outcomes for children.

It's very sad to me that some of our young people are spending what should be the most magical, inspirational years of their lives under the guidance of such archaic attitudes.

all 4 pairs look like trainers to me.

Is looking at the shoes hard a distraction from the absolute shite storm of RAAC?

Actual trainers aren't even velcro are they? Couldn't find DC trainers with velcro since they're in adult-like sizes.

I agree. And think his much easier the life of pastoral. Staff would be without all that bollocks. Best performing school in thr area has scruffiest looking kids and a polo shirt and trainer uniform. Although it does attract a more mc parent or one willing to pay the bus fares.

I’d email the head with all four pics and ask if any of these are acceptable. They’re all so similar I’ll be astounded if he picks out the hush puppies as not allowed when the others are!

He is getting the hang of laces but not reliably, and given how hard everything else is in the transition to secondary I really wanted to minimise the stress in any way I could. We're working towards laces for y8.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Feibmir-Elastic-Shoelaces-Universal-Tieless/dp/B09BW27L7W/ref=sr_1_5?keywords=elastic%2Bshoe%2Blaces&qid=1694346270&sr=8-5&th=1

Elastic laces - had to resort to them for PE trainers which had to have laces.

Velcro would get your ridiculed in my kids’ secondary too. Awful how much kids require the conformity of others to ridiculous fashion rules which change regularly. I talk to my two every day about difference being important, and ridicule coming from a stance of fear or insecurity. The eldest just eye rolls and carries on. Kids can be so cruel.

I would say all of those are unacceptable because they have a flat trainer sole with no defined heel. I’ve attached an example with a defined heel which imo makes it a “shoe” not a “trainer”.

They do look like trainers, not school shoes.

I guessed the Hush Puppies ones but honestly, it's absolutely pathetic that it should even be a thing.

I would tell the school categorically you will correct this when these shoes are outworn/outgrown as lack of clarity from school and cost of living crisis. However you child's SEND needs require velcro and high level of comfort, this will have to be taken into account in next shoes.

Why are we parents - and teachers - putting up with this utter bullshit? I just don't know. What a waste of qualified educational professionals time and energy.

These policies are why some schools are failing schools, I'm convinced. They just focus on totally the wrong things. Why invest so much time on that when you've got kids whose behaviour in class is so bad that no-one else can learn. They seem overly obsessed with the idea that if you get the little things right, everything else flows from there. It's absolute bollocks and one of the reasons why I left secondary education.

There ARE some sensible secondary schools. My sons went to a fantastic grammar. I thnk both of my sons had shoes similar to these all the way through till Year 11, when they started wearing plainer shoes with shoelaces so they could also be used with suits for proms, weddings, funerals etc. Nothing was ever said about the shoes they wore, and funnily enough their behaviour is exemplary, they both came out of school with fantastic qualifications.

They all look the same to me.

We've just moved from Scotland so I'm dealing with this just now.
It's much more relaxed up there. In primary school my dc's wore any shoes to school because they changed into 'indoor shoes' once in school, kept the school cleaner, and the kids all the same. They all wore black pumps inside.
In secondary it's just black shoes, just not trainers or heels. But it's not strict like I'm reading here.

They don't look like trainers. But they also don't look like "wedding shoes"

My son is also. I get round it by using slip on shoes like this

Boys POD Formal Shoes Durham | Fruugo UK

I think that for some members of SLT it's the only thing they think they have any control over. They can't control the kids any other way, they're running riot through the corridors in some schools. Very easy to put in place a school rule about school shoes and have most of the kids "complying" cos it's the parents buying the shoes and they haven't got the time or money to waste buying multiple pairs of shoes so the easiest thing to do is just try and get the right ones in the first place.

It's idiotic. Many countries in the world don't have school uniform and somehow they still churn out successful pupils at the end of their education.

That school is batshit. I'd be inclined to email them and ask why they are wasting time on such utter trivialities when it could be far better spent on actually supporting your son.

I hope he settles well into secondary school, and wish him good luck

Have the school explained clearly WHY the Hush Puppies are not OK?

I remember the days of indoor shoes at primary in Scotland! Is it still common now? I can see in general carpets getting muddier and wetter than in England, where I've never known indoor shoes to be a thing, but as a teacher I shudder at the thought of shoe changes several times a day.

I know from school gate conversations that I’m in the minority re: uniform and shoes. I think it’s nice for children to look smart and I am not fond of the move towards “sporty” attire in schools.

These all look trainer-y to me. They would pass at my son’s primary but not at my daughter’s secondary school where they do not accept Velcro unless ASN. Slip ons are the lace free shoe of choice there.

I was thinking this but seeing as the majority on this thread identified the Hush Puppies I'm going to climb down from my fight response and have ordered the Next ones for delivery tomorrow.

Nothing has been said about the branding btw- rather that the Hush Puppies are trainer-like while the other ones aren't.

Thanks for the good wishes @JimJonesLivesInMyHead . Much appreciated!