To want to be appointed at top of pay band

[MsFrost]

I've been offered a new job in higher education and I want to go in at the top of the band becuase my current salary is above it.

AIBU to negotiate this? Would it make a bad impression to push for them to match my current salary, even though it means starting right at the top of the pay band?

Their policy is to start people at the bottom of the band.

I have applied for jobs before that are advertised at £35k to £45k (as an example) and then upon job offer been told that they only appoint at the bottom of the band. This wasn’t made clear in the job advert or interview so I can see why people apply expecting to be able to negotiate to higher than the lowest advertised salary.

In my current role, I negotiated to towards the top of the band and when I had been in role for 6 months they re-banded my role to the next band up to give space for annual increases etc.

Not true.

I work in a professionally qualified role for a local authority. I've been qualified for over a decade and have a significant amount of experience. I have moved between local authorities on a few occasions and each time have requested and have received pay at the top of the banding or at the spine point within the banding that matched my salary in my previous role.

There would be no incentive for me to move roles (and my profession is significantly in demand) if each time I moved I had to start at the bottom of the pay banding and get the same as newly qualifieds in the team.

We've had similar recently.

In the end we withdrew our offer, as the candidate would not accept any lower.

From our perspective we had others in the same role on less, that had been there 2-3 years. We did not want to pay a new starter more than the current staff. What they earned previously was not relevant, and they may have been very experienced in their previous workplace, but they were not as experienced in OUR workplace as our existing staff, so we declined to pay them a higher salary.

@Redbrickrebel I have in both public and private sector jobs. In some cases I’ve been offered a match without asking.

I've done this in the civil service. I was clear when offered the job that I'd take it only if I was put in at the top of the band. I got it and was told to keep quiet about it!

I have recruited people in at 'top of band' and I have negotiated to start at 'top of band' myself.

Granted not your sector.

Nothing asked, nothing gained.

It depends how much they want you. I transferred from one HEI to another and did move across at the top of scale. But they don’t like it and will only do it occasionally.

They needed me more than I needed them though at that point. It isn’t achieved all that often. Mid point is easier, top is rarer.

I did this in HE. (Not the top of the band but negotiated up.) it does definitely happen!

I think top is harder to justify in many institutions because often in my experience

a) there are likely to be others on the lower points doing the same job, and if you don't have the experience it's hard to justify putting someone on a higher pay scale without that (bit saying that applies here but it is a factor) and

b) there is likely to be an automatic progression through the band each year maybe or maybe not linked to performance. So if you start at the top there is nowhere to go - and that makes you a potential retention problem. If you're going to be an expensive 1 year hire then it's not worth it.

Not a reason not to ask of course, but university finances are generally fucked so it needs to be a good case

I’ve asked three times and been successful twice. Once in charity sector and once in higher education (management, not academic.) Both times it was to match what I was currently on, e.g. new job advertised at £35k-£45k, I was on £38k and asked them to match it. I do not think it would have worked if I had been on £35k and just said to them that I’d like to see an increase in my next role.

The time it didn’t work they just told me they honestly didn’t have the budget in the current year but I could expect to go up a point next year. Didn’t laugh in my face or anything.

We wouldn't go up to the top of the band.

As previous poster said, one or two spinal points is possible but above that is very rare and causes a massive headache.

Lots of universities have recruitment freezes pending so if there was another candidate appointable I'd do that rather than risk having to do protracted request higher up that could mean I end up having to wait to appoint anyone.

It really depends on the quality of the other candidates which you can't know.

You'll get further being realistic on how far to push.

I would ask!

As a side question to those posting on the thread. So say you’re a teacher with 10 years experience in one school and have progressed every year, if you move schools you’re expected to go back to the bottom again?
Sorry if I’ve misinterpreted but im surprised if so.

Don't ask to go in at the top of the pay band - if you're bringing a lot of experience, ask to go in at the bottom of the pay band with a market supplement to match your current salary and reflect your experience. See what they say from there.

(Much less likely to work if you're junior or they have several suitable candidates to fall back on.)

The thing is they're really not supposed to take previous salary into account when positioning pay. They need to position pay based on a balance between external competitiveness (the market rate for the role) and internal fairness. If there are other people in the role with experience doing it, then bringing in external people on substantially more messes up this internal equity, and existing employees are likely to be frustrated and ask for pay reviews.
Now- if your current salary is the market rate already then I'd say "go for it" and if you bring others up with you then so be it. The problem comes if you're moving sectors (say from private to public) when pay differentials are bigger.
Basically you can ask but there might be other issues at play.

That's not always the case. I'm a recruiting manager and our paperwork says that we normally appoint at the bottom of the scale, but I often make an offer above that point based on skills, experience, previous salary and benchmarking against other colleagues.

I've done this successfully in a local authority, where it is also very much the policy to go in at the bottom and they don't expect to negotiate salary. I did it in the phone conversation with the hiring manager when she offered me the post.

I don’t know how it works in HE

In the civil service they always appoint external candidates at the bottom of the payband - the pay bands are very misleading and really only “count” if you’re coming from elsewhere in the civil service and you’re already above the bottom of the band.

I work in HE. Hiring manager can make a case for it. We often appoint above the bottom despite HR’s recommendation to start at the bottom and negotiate. But it is more based on equity with current staff based on qualifications and experience than matching current salary. I do work in a shortage area.

Know your worth!
I'm in FE, been there years so top of the pay scale

We've had loads of new staff lately. All are offered bottom salary. Some negotiated (and came out at various points - many top as we're desperate) others didn't and are at the bottom

There is a lot of upset once people find out that others came in at higher salaries but absolutely nobody has been moved up once in the role

Most pay banded jobs recognise that the job is "worth" the top of the pay band and take money off employees for lack of experience.

If you can demonstrate you have relevent experience, then it is totally reasonable to ask to start on a higher band.

There is nothing wrong with asking at all.

Depending on the role you will be able to negotiate up. Remember the pensions and holiday allowances are often more generous so compare the whole package.

HE is tightening its belts at the moment so you could be offered some extra spine points now and more after 6 months if you pass probation successfully.

@MsFrost

AIBU to negotiate this? Would it make a bad impression to push for them to match my current salary, even though it means starting right at the top of the pay band?

Know your worth OP and don't put yourself on the back foot financially.

Remember interviewing is a two way thing when it comes to negotiating. They're not doing you a favour offering you a job, especially taking you on at a lower salary than you're currently on. Unless they're offering you other things which bump you up? Car/car allowance, much better pension, great medical scheme, bonuses etc 🌹

I know that some unis will match your current salary when you move across, especially if you bring substantial professional experience.
I had fully expected a pay drop to the bottom of the scale when I got a job in a uni but they matched my salary and rounded up to the next spine point. It's definitely possible and if you don't negotiate you definitely don't get.

It's often the case. If you negotiate, you'll likely get it.

A man would have no qualms about making their case.

Absolutely request it.