...to think teachers DO get paid over the holidays?

[MasterBeth]

It doesn't make sense to me.

Some people say teachers don't get paid over the holidays. They are paid, they say, for 40 weeks, but their money is aggregated over 52 weeks and paid monthly.

What does that even mean? How is it (practically) any different to being paid (less per week) for 52 weeks?

Do you get paid for the weekend?

When you get your monthly pay slip it covers a time period with several weekends in it. My pay slip is for 'august'

(Is anyone left that gets paid weekly - my first job i got an envelope of cash on each friday )

The contract teachers have is a bit odd. We didn’t choose it, but it seems like we are often being told that our contract isn’t what we think it is, we really get paid exactly the same kind of salary as everyone else and we are just being silly. No, we have a weird contract, sorry. It’s just how it is and doesn’t make vast amounts of difference, just in some minor details.

@Countdown2023 it's not because it's cheaper. It's v likely more expensive. There probably just isn't a teacher to hire.

Usually if I worked 80% that would be matched in my holiday allowance so if everyone else got 20 days, I'd only get 16.

But your pay isn't for the holidays, your pay includes a proportion of 'holiday' pay which is 80% of a FT teachers pay.

There would almost certainly far less teachers if they didn't get school holidays.

Especially as it makes their daily pay higher

Teachers quote they aren't paid for all
Holidays but they are, in reality.

If a teacher earns £30000 per annum that figure is split over 12 months so they receive £2500 per month

That's exactly the same as anyone else employed on £30000 per annum - They receive £2500 per month

The difference is that teachers work (actual teaching weeks) 39 weeks and 13 are 'holiday'. I'm not saying they take 13 weeks 'off' but it's really no different to
Someone in a private business who gets £30K and statutory 28 days annual leave (5.6 weeks)

The contracts state though (I believe) that they 'work' 195 days (they are teaching days/inset) and then they receive some holiday pay (but it's not 13 weeks)

I agree with you. It is exactly the same as how my pay is worked out.

Plus also, if teachers work part-time, they still have 100% of their leave, whereas with any other profession, it's pro-rata...

Well yes, but that's because the school closure days are set by the school and/or Lea. It isn't self selecting.

It also works the other way round too, usually - ime anyway.

For example: If a part time teacher works W-F, for example, then those Monday bank holidays - they just don't get them. They aren't given pro-rata.

@maddening not sure a teacher did bring it up. Someone asked a question, teachers answered, and the usual 'well teachers always moan they work harder than everyone else' pile on began. Which no one said ever.

Can't quote multiple posts so in response to my replies... I know other sectors/people work just as hard. Not disputing that at all. But how many other jobs are expected to take on middle management roles with extra workload for no extra pay? Or no reduction of their main duties?
A "promotion" for no more pay.

Only a 10k difference between a complete novice and someone that has 30 years experience + middle management + mentoring/training all expected of them. It's the 'package' of the job that would be paid a hell of a lot more in other sectors, not how hard teachers/others work.

What other graduate jobs with post graduate qualifications, additional qualifications, management and mentoring/training expected of you have £40k as the very top of the pay scale?

Again, not denying other professions work hard. I know they do. It's the lack of salary progression in teaching I think is the kick in the teeth.

Same as any other employer where you get 5 weeks off a year, it’s usually still the same monthly pay spread out over 12months whenever you take your holidays.

Unless I'm misunderstanding, it's incorrect.

If I work part time in an office, and work Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and I want to go on holiday for a week, I only need to book 3 days of annual leave.

If I'm a teacher and my normal working days are Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, then during half term, I'm off for the whole week, but technically only Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday are holiday days.

If I work a set number of hours a week then I need to book that number of hours out of my holiday entitlement to have the week off.

I suppose the difference is that teachers don't accrue leave, so if (unusually) a part time teacher started in the middle of a term, then they'd still get full pay over e.g. the Christmas holidays, but the salary is calculated based around people only starting at specific points in the year.

There always the simple answer:

Want a job with 13 weeks holidays and 'apparently' 9-3 a day ...

... go and train! We are crying out for teachers in many sectors and subjects right now.

If it's all so fab, go and train and get that teacher shortage crisis sorted.

I'm interested in why people bring it up as a "thing" when I can't see the material difference it may make.

A friend who is a teacher adds it to his list of grievencies about teaching ("And we're not even paid for the summer holidays!") I absolutely agree with him that teaching is hard job which is rewarded less well than it should be, and teachers' salaries have not kept pace with inflation. However, he's never been able to explain very well why not being paid for the summer holidays makes any discernable difference.

(The posters who have mentioned how it affects materity entitlement may be on to something!)

@fuckityfuckityfuckfuck yup. V well put.

Please please come train if you believe it's a nice easy job with loads of holiday and short hours. Your children need staff, and we don't have them anymore. Can't imagine why 🤷‍♀️.

In other professions? Yes, if the normal annual leave allocation is 25 days and you work three days a week (0.6fte), you would only get 15 days leave.

I'm interested in why people bring it up as a "thing" when I can't see the material difference it may make.

I've never really known a teacher to bring it up as a thing, unless questioned, provoked or,criticised about holidays and/or reducing school hours.

It's all BS. You get paid say £28k. You get the same £28k as anyone else gets. Monthly salary. 12 equal instalments. The holidays are part of the package so to speak.

TA's on the other hand don't get paid during the holidays and neither do most office staff.

If you're a teacher, and you're being asked to take on a middle management role for no TLR and no reduction in contact hours, surely you tell your boss you won't be doing that? And you wait until they offer a sensible TLR and reduction in hours?

If your colleagues are choosing to do that, I'd argue it's on them, because a system is in place to pay people extra for the extra work they do, and those who take on extra duties in this way undermine everyone else.

The £10k difference is from M1-M6, if you're doing additional stuff to benefit the school, then you should be on UPS. Again, if your school isn't offering this and is expecting UPS level work from you, then you need to say no.

I'm not saying that I think our pay/contracts are fair or workable BUT what describe is a school that's taking the piss.

The one thing I would say is that when I worked in the private sector, if we needed someone with shortage skills, and couldn't recruit, generally the job would be readvertised with a higher salary/better benefits etc etc.

Schools don't have as much flexibility to do this for teachers of shortage subjects- which is a problem.

The problem is that for people who don’t realise that the paid for 12 months in equal instalments is simply to make salary administration easier, it appears that teachers get paid for the school holidays when they are not visibly in school working. Though of course many are working, either in school, or at home. That is where the resentment starts. It’s the same as the “A teacher’s working day starts at nine and finishes at half past three” myth.

well yes, of course. I’m trying to figure out the bit about part time teachers getting 100% of the holiday.

This.

It comes up time and time again and still daft twats waffle on about paid holidays etc.

Many teachers max out their hours by about May. Imagine what would happen if we all stopped when we reached that limit?

And yes, we all know teachers who do nothing but their timetabled hours. They work in a bloody good team and some other poor sod does the extra planning hours etc for them.

I'm not a teacher. My job contract says I should work standard hours of 9 - 5.30, plus any other hours required to do my job. I dont get time of in lieu or overtime or anything like that.

I don't understand how the teachers' contract is any different - you're asked to work 1265 hours plus any other hours you need to do your job.