Do you support the ULEZ expansion?

[icecream99]

Just curious as it is due to start at midnight tonight and could potentially cause a lot of chaos. I don't support it.

YANBU - I DON'T support ULEZ expansion

YABU - I DO support ULEZ expansion

OK whatever. The effect is positive. Hurrah. The thread was about whether people support it. I do, because it has a positive effect on me, my community and kids. You don't only get to say it impacts you if you think it's a negative impact.

Could be worse. Lambeth have increased street parking charges for anyone working on your house to 28 quid a day (or any part thereof eg a one hour quick fix or a visit to quote). The really fun bit is that you have to upload evidence of the work you're having done and it can take up to ten days to approve, so good luck getting an emergency plumber.

When this received a bit of pushback at consultation the response was that this would incentivise businesses to use cargo bikes.

So the Bromleyites should count their blessings.

Hell no. I live in zone 6 - just outside the new zone but literally streets away from it. Minimal affect on pollution has been proven, not good enough public transport and is just a grab on people's money when there is a COL crisis going on. Also totally fine to pollute if you pay the fee!

I have a 10 year old diesel car which isn't compliant - bought when they said diesels were better for the environment. I was going to keep it until it broke basically. Now I will have to shell out money I don't have - what's the environmental impacts of new cars? Or just because the impact is on some third world country its okay? Hypocrisy.

Amazed by how many people think Sadiq Khan personally receives all the money from the ULEZ charges 😂

No; that article only talks about the expansion to the north and south circular (which is already currently in place).

This expansion is way, way beyond that. And in fact, in July 2021, Sadiq Khan was asked by a London Assembly member whether he had plans to further expand the ULEZ to the whole of Greater London. He replied no, he had no plans to do that; it wouldn't be appropriate etc.

Yet just over a year later, he announced the expansion. He's just like every other politician - full of lies.

Your attitude is a classic "I'm alright, Jack" one. A lot of people are unable to see past their own nose and grasp the bigger picture.

I'm also going to be OK. My on-order compliant car will arrive eventually and I'm lucky enough to be able to afford this and any incurred charges in the meantime. I'm still against the expansion as it makes no sense in how it's implemented. It's all about money.

You're lucky that you were able to buy a car recently. Many people bought theirs a long time ago and are not able to afford a replacement. Many people bought diesel based on the misinformation given about the pollution.

Like I said, a lot of people can't see the bigger picture because it doesn't affect them They're alright so don't give a shit about those who aren't. You're not alone.

I would be more in favour of it, if an alternative was on offer e.g a decent functioning public transport system. However our trains, tubes and buses are generally overcrowded and unreliable. Our cycle lanes are nonexistent in many places outside of many cities (so cycling into ULEZ is akin to dicing with death as drivers are too fast and too angry). It like everything governments do...knee jerk reactions without stopping to put think through the consequences.

After much googling... the last sentence is the key one. November 2022. Less than a year.

A spokesperson for the Mayor similarly confirmed to Full Fact that the government did not specify any particular further expansion to the ULEZ in its 2020 funding letter.
They said: “The Mayor of London confirmed he would expand ULEZ up to the North and South Circular in June 2018. He then confirmed in November 2022 that he would be expanding the zone to cover most of London.

It's certainly not in his election manifesto for 2021. Only the N/S circular expansion.

Try saying you don't support ulez expansion to a child having an asthma attack- look them right in the eye

My dc do have asthma, they've both been hospitalised with it at various times, but I don't believe ULEZ will make much of a difference. A decent public transport system would.

Most of the anti-ULEZ posts are ‘I’m alright Jack’ too, except they’re alright with the air quality which is killing other Londoners, which is the real bigger picture here.

@gkd 10 mins walking is around half a mile. Did you really think there were no houses for a mile (half a mile each side) around the M25? That seems really odd if you live fairly close to it.

Soupdrzgon, the big picture? You mean clean air for more people? I'm not sure why car drivers needs trump everyone else's, they've had it their way for the last 50 years, time things changed.

I do support it but I'd like to see all SUVs of any age added to it. Even the electric ones take up too much room on the roads and therefore add to congestion and pollution.

Yes

Clean air and environment trumps everything

(I do think people with disabilities who can't use public transport should have a scheme where they can register and be exempt)

Yes I did @eurochick .

I regularly travel a few junctions on the east (not a hell of a lot I accept) and it’s fields on both sides.

We had concerns about being so close (3miles as the crow flies) to the M25 when we bought the house so conscious that there’s no housing within about a mile.

It’s something I’m aware of, I was bought up next to elevated section of A40 - could see westway flyover from my bedroom.
My childhood asthma disappeared when we moved east (again near a dual carriageway but not as close) never had an attack or hospitalised since.

Was the 80s mind so 4 star petrol and whatnot.

@GKD I live up in Yorkshire and there's new build estates being built in sight of the A1 for example... the A1 isn't as bad as the M25... but there doesn't seem to be any control of where housing can be in relation to major roads.
These houses aren't cheap either.. its "Executive" housing!

A lot of the M25 goes through the green belt, so there may be less housing due to that not the road.

@SoupDragon quite right, sorry! But I think it was discussed, even if not formal policy as long ago as 2006 ish. BJ got cold feet about the initial stage 3 expansion in 2008 after lobbying from Heavy Freight industry. The history is here: https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cdp-2022-0240/

But I still think the writing has very reasonably been on the wall for a long time.

Haha at 'I'm alright Jack'. Quite the opposite. 70% of poor outer londoners do not have cars, of that 30% most cars are compliant. Yet they suffer the most from air pollution and are least likely to be able to do anything about it. As a pp said, look a child having an asthma attack in the eye and say your perceived right to drive a highly polluting vehicle beats theirs to breathe. Say you're OK to Ella's mother, Ella who choked to death. This faux outrage on behalf of others by the anti ULEZ crew is tedious. What they're really interested in is driving a polluting car to the golf course. Bromley, Havering et al have excess deaths due to particulate pollution, and so there is a public health imperative to act (and it is a public health policy, not a climate one).

Anyway, happy ULEZ day everyone.
Breathe easier. I'm off to enjoy my day.

(@LaurieFairyCake if you're disabled there's a much longer transition, I think you're exempt until 2027 currently).

@PuttingDownRoots Dual carriage way I was aware of A406 A40 have homes on them - I was bought up a stones throw from one then a 5 min walk from another.

We declined offering in a few houses last year due to proximity to local A-road (noise, pollution, safety). Obviously if we had no choice then so be it.

Makes sense re green belt and everyday is a school day! I bet I notice the houses now

(For the record I’m on the fence re ULEZ, it’s been poorly rolled out and the misconceptions! But I didn’t know re 10min walk to motorway)

Interesting how the majority of votes are anti-ULEZ when the majority of posts seem to be pro. Not often that I see the benefit in the voting buttons, but this is an exception.

Aside from the air quality arguments, can you imagine if we get stuck with another 5 years of the Tories because Labour loses so many London seats?!?

Air quality in the outer London Boroughs is completely different from the air quality inner London boroughs pre inner London ULEZ zone. Will you also be demanding ULEZ is implemented in Cumbria because its a problem in central London?

Air quality always been vastly better than inner London (reports green against standards most days of the year).

If the politicians really believed in it then they wouldn't be using regressive tax which penalises the poorest and smaller businesses whilst exempting more polluting new and expensive cars.
Or they would be providing realistic scrappage support.

Or they would target changes instead of sitting in Islington and just assuming that the M25 is an air quality barrier and not a bloody road.

So they have a scheme which is designed to boost new car sales (a massive carbon hit) and penalise lower and average income famiies with no matching improvement in public transport to reduce the need for cars.

Its virtue signalling with a large side order of hypocrisy.

I'm not convinced that all this investment is just for a dwindling number of non compliant cars or air pollution

I’m not sure Lab will lose LDN seats due to ULEZ.

1. it will have settled by then, many naysayers will realise they are exempt
2. Uxbridge was Tory anyway and even with ULEZ the Tory maj was hit hard.
3. The hard objecting boroughs (Havering/Bromley etc) are Tory anyway. Plus point 1.

I do think Lab have handled it badly though - they’ve not publicised that this is/was Tory policy and seem to be throwing Khan under a bus with going ahead.