Page 37 | What are all pensioners getting another £300 this winter??

F0RBIDDENFRUIT · 2023-08-25T12:12:49+00:00

They are amongst the richest people in the country, yes there are poor pensioners but a lot of them are way richer than anyone else. £300 more for energy, none of the old people I know need this, they all have more money than their children. Just because they vote, that is the only reason they can be doing this.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 26/08/2023 22:12

TheThinkingGoblin · 25/08/2023 13:19

OP,

You are 100% correct.

The payment should be means tested. As should all pensioner benefits.

The time for universal benefits for pensioners has ended. The UK is too broke for this to be financially viable.

It does seem a bit much when other benefits are means tested.

Personally, I’m all for things being universal. But if other benefits are not, I’m struggling with my pensioner benefits should be the exception.

Anonymouseposter · 26/08/2023 22:18

75% of pensioners(not 90%) own their home. Of course, some own expensive homes and some own little terraced houses and find upkeep and repairs difficult. It's also true that home ownership is getting more and more difficult to achieve for young people.

porridgecake · 26/08/2023 22:21

Moving costs are very high, especially estate agent fees. Retirement flats have huge service charges, council tax and bills still have to be paid, adding up to more than the average state pension would cover. Any profit from the sale of the house would soon go. Then what happens? Ground floor flats and bungalows are in very short supply. There is no council housing for anyone who has sold a property.

Iwasafool · 26/08/2023 23:14

BIossomtoes · 26/08/2023 17:35

No, sadly it’s the percentage of the age group. Even more sadly 21% of 18-24 year olds who voted went Tory.

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I just checked on YouGov, who produced the stats. It was a percentage of people who voted and in total based on the survey of 41,995 voters, not sure how many in each age group.

This is the link.https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2019/12/17/how-britain-voted-2019-general-election

How Britain voted in the 2019 general election | YouGov

YouGov conducts one of Britain's biggest ever post-election surveys to chart how the nation's political character is shifting

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2019/12/17/how-britain-voted-2019-general-election

BIossomtoes · 26/08/2023 23:29

How can it be a percentage of the people who voted when the Conservative percentages across all age groups add up to 228? It’s the percentage of the age group.

Rosscameasdoody · 27/08/2023 00:12

Means testing is a race to the bottom. Where do you draw the line ? You end up with vulnerable people missing out because they’re over the threshold by a few pounds.

Iwasafool · 27/08/2023 00:16

BIossomtoes · 26/08/2023 23:29

How can it be a percentage of the people who voted when the Conservative percentages across all age groups add up to 228? It’s the percentage of the age group.

It is a percentage of the people who voted in that age group. If you look at the figures it adds up to 100% in every age groups. We definitely don't have 100% turn outs in UK elections, I know that personally as I've been a polling clerk in the past.

Iwasafool · 27/08/2023 00:17

I mean the votes for the various parties in each age group adds up to 100%

Rosscameasdoody · 27/08/2023 00:21

Oldsu · 26/08/2023 20:36

@Anxioys I love it when people say things like that without checking their facts, did you know that the guaranteed element of PC takes a single pensioners income up to £201.05 so thousands of pensioners on just the new full state pension of £203.85 won't qualify (unless they qualify for the disability element) so you are really saying that someone on £201.05 clearly needs it and someone on just £2.80 a week more doesn't.

Edited

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And this is why means testing is a race to the bottom. Thresholds are invariably set low and people in genuine need will be left to struggle for the sake of a few pence over the limit. I’d rather people who may not need it get it, if the alternative n]means those in genuine need will miss out.

Iwasafool · 27/08/2023 00:22

For over 70s it is 67% conservative 14% Labour 11% LibDem and the other 8% between Green SNP Brexit and other. Adds up to 100% of over 70s but is only 100% of over 70s who voted.

Iwasafool · 27/08/2023 00:23

Rosscameasdoody · 27/08/2023 00:21

And this is why means testing is a race to the bottom. Thresholds are invariably set low and people in genuine need will be left to struggle for the sake of a few pence over the limit. I’d rather people who may not need it get it, if the alternative n]means those in genuine need will miss out.

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Yes means testing always seems to leave some people with less than the "most needy" because they are over the limit but only just and the only alternative would be a tapering level and the administration would be very costly.

RandomButtons · 27/08/2023 00:27

CremeEggThief · 25/08/2023 13:17

Get a grip, OP and stop begrudging old people £300. YABU.

My parents just bought a house worth £900,000 cash buy, no mortgage, still huge savings.

Why do they need £600?

pollyglot · 27/08/2023 00:33

Actually, it's very useful since we stay at home most of the time so that we can give all we can spare to help DC and DGC with making ends meet.

TheThinkingGoblin · 27/08/2023 00:43

Anxioys · 26/08/2023 19:19

@MrsFiddle - don't see why not. I disagree with the triple lock as a policy. I would rather it applied to education budgets. What I notice is that there are not such generous policies for children. What a fantastic society we could be if there were.

Alas, it's just Conservatives making prejudicial policies for the old. More children in poverty than pensioners, needs looking at urgently.

Its very telling that pensioners gloss over that fact.

Child poverty in the UK is 26%
Pensioner poverty in the UK is 15%

I have posted the graphs about this previously.

Just take a look at the waffle type answers, the pearl clutching, and the railing against [insert entity here] but no actual "its more important that the poor children get better". I specially love the "but we give to charity" or "we help our kids from time to time" comments (essentially this is a copout as it has been proven 100x over the years that private charity is no susbtitute for Govt programs)

It actually tells you a lot about these individuals.

What the Tories have actually created in the UK is a large group with a bottomless need for more and more. They have become downright mercenary and entitled to believe that they "deserve more" because "reasons".

Largely pointless to argue with them in my view because its like arguing with a think tank person who is paid to say X. Since, their livelihood depends on saying X, they will twist themselves into a veritable mental pretzel justifying their actions.

It really is a sad commentary on the state of the UK. It was not like this in the 90s. Not by a longshot.

Iwantmyoldnameback · 27/08/2023 00:55

TheThinkingGoblin · 27/08/2023 00:43

Its very telling that pensioners gloss over that fact.

Child poverty in the UK is 26%
Pensioner poverty in the UK is 15%

I have posted the graphs about this previously.

Just take a look at the waffle type answers, the pearl clutching, and the railing against [insert entity here] but no actual "its more important that the poor children get better". I specially love the "but we give to charity" or "we help our kids from time to time" comments (essentially this is a copout as it has been proven 100x over the years that private charity is no susbtitute for Govt programs)

It actually tells you a lot about these individuals.

What the Tories have actually created in the UK is a large group with a bottomless need for more and more. They have become downright mercenary and entitled to believe that they "deserve more" because "reasons".

Largely pointless to argue with them in my view because its like arguing with a think tank person who is paid to say X. Since, their livelihood depends on saying X, they will twist themselves into a veritable mental pretzel justifying their actions.

It really is a sad commentary on the state of the UK. It was not like this in the 90s. Not by a longshot.

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No one cared about kids being cold in the 90s, 80s 70s or earlier. Central heating and double glazing wasn't the norm then. We put another blanket on our beds and scraped the ice off the inside of the windows. But I guess you didn't know that as you were being educated abroad .

Cholumenosoapy · 27/08/2023 07:00

When I grew up we only had a coal fire to keep warm. In winter it was usual for us to wake up with ice on the inside of the windows. A frequent meal in our house was baked beans and chips. We had one small black and white TV. Compared to what many people have these days, we grew up in relative poverty.

I’m now retired and I have 40 years of NI contributions. I’m a WASPI woman, so I was robbed of my pension at 60. I think I deserve that money towards my heating bill. When you’re old you feel cold and you are full of aches and pains. Enjoy your youth, it’s not great being old.

Howpo · 27/08/2023 07:15

No one cared about kids being cold in the 90s, 80s 70s or earlier. Central heating and double glazing wasn't the norm then. We put another blanket on our beds and scraped the ice off the inside of the windows. But I guess you didn't know that as you were being educated abroad

Of course people cared! but it was a lot harder to keep yourselves warm, there wasn't the means & often not the money but those with money didn't let their kids go cold nor they.

Btw don't know what country you lived in but most people in the UK had central heating in the 90s its was common in the 80s too, CH came in the 70s.

Zebedee55 · 27/08/2023 07:46

LindyLou2020 · 26/08/2023 12:51

For the last time, I will explain that people on the following benefits will get the COL payment:

Universal Credit,
Income-based JSA
Income related ESA,
Child Tax Credit
Working Tax Credit
Income Support

I will suggest that people in these groups will be younger than people of retirement age.

People of retirement age receiving Pension Credit will also get the COL payment.
All I did was find this information from the government online.

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Yes, I know. Others can't seem to see it though.

Pensioners not on Pension Credit will not get the COL payments. They are due to end next Spring, as far as I've read.

All pensioner households are eligible for the Winter Fuel Allowance, which will be between £500-£600, depending on age etc. Over 80's get the higher rate.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cost-of-living-payment-2023-to-2024-management-information/cost-of-living-payment-2023-to-2024-management-information

Cost of Living Payment 2023 to 2024 management information

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cost-of-living-payment-2023-to-2024-management-information/cost-of-living-payment-2023-to-2024-management-information

Zebedee55 · 27/08/2023 07:49

Cholumenosoapy · 27/08/2023 07:00

When I grew up we only had a coal fire to keep warm. In winter it was usual for us to wake up with ice on the inside of the windows. A frequent meal in our house was baked beans and chips. We had one small black and white TV. Compared to what many people have these days, we grew up in relative poverty.

I’m now retired and I have 40 years of NI contributions. I’m a WASPI woman, so I was robbed of my pension at 60. I think I deserve that money towards my heating bill. When you’re old you feel cold and you are full of aches and pains. Enjoy your youth, it’s not great being old.

Yeah, and me. Freezing cold bedroom, dreading getting out of bed, ice on the insides of the windows in our draughty cold Victorian house, and hurtling downstairs to get near the coal fire lol 🥴

Zebedee55 · 27/08/2023 07:55

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 26/08/2023 22:12

It does seem a bit much when other benefits are means tested.

Personally, I’m all for things being universal. But if other benefits are not, I’m struggling with my pensioner benefits should be the exception.

Show quote history

There is also a contributory element to some claims of JSA and ESA. The contributory element is incorporated into UC.

https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/employment-and-support-allowance-contribution-based

Benefits Calculator - entitledto - independent | accurate | reliable | www.entitledto.co.uk

Check what benefit entitlement you are entitled to. The entitledto benefits calculator will check which means-tested benefits you may be entitled to e.g. tax credits, universal credit, housing benefit …

https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/employment-and-support-allowance-contribution-based

VioletVeeVee · 27/08/2023 08:06

TheThinkingGoblin · 25/08/2023 13:28

There is a vast array of universal pensioner benefits.

Why should a wealthy pensioner get access to a free bus pass?

Why should a wealthy pensioner get free prescriptions?

These ALL need to be means tested now as a collective.

Its right that poorer pensioners should have help.

It is not right that wealthy pensioners get additional non-means tested benefits.

The UK is financially crippled because of an ageing demographic with too many universal pensioner benefits.

This has to come to an end.

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It probably will come to an end just in time for us Generation X’s!

coalbunker · 27/08/2023 08:38

1 in 7 70 year olds own a second property.
1 in 5 are millionaires

Yes there are poor pensioners, but the most wealthy are in this group too.

explainthistomeplease · 27/08/2023 08:42

'The UK is financially crippled because of an ageing demographic with too many universal pensioner benefits.'

@TheThinkingGoblin this is NOT the reason the UK is financially crippled. Are we unique in having an aging demographic? Of course not. Don't be so daft and full of misguided hate.

explainthistomeplease · 27/08/2023 08:46

And I totally agree that universal free bus passes and winter fuel grants are daft. But if you think getting rid of those will get us out of our hole, you're deluded. Drop in the ocean

And no I'm not a despised pensioner.

As for free bus passes in our area. Well once I'm no longer able to drive they'll be a fat lot of good because they're are no buses!

Cakemakes · 27/08/2023 08:51

explainthistomeplease · 27/08/2023 08:42

'The UK is financially crippled because of an ageing demographic with too many universal pensioner benefits.'

@TheThinkingGoblin this is NOT the reason the UK is financially crippled. Are we unique in having an aging demographic? Of course not. Don't be so daft and full of misguided hate.

I agree, some people really are gullible fools.