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AIBU?

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Original poster

Cardiology appointments

52 replies

originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 08:35

I'm genuinely not sure if I am being unreasonable or not so hear me out.

Over the past 30 years I've had 3/4 cardio appointments ranging from age 14 to 44. At each one I've had to be fully undressed including bra from the waist up. All of these appointments were carried out by men with no chaperone offered. So in a room on your own with breasts exposed. Just had one this morning (echo) with a very pleasant male sonographer. This is the first echocardiogram I've had, but again no chaperone. Because of the way I had to lie on my side on the bed, he had to sort of perch on the bed next to me so his body was touching mine. He also had to touch and move one of my breasts to place to US probe in the right place.
I'm not for a second suggesting there was anything untoward going on with this man. But surely for his OWN peace of mind/security it would make sense for there to be someone else in the room? And as I say, this is not a one off - it has happened at other appointments too - in different locations and hospitals.

I'm a very chilled person and used to go topless on holiday etc but I can imagine some other women would feel extremely uncomfortable in this situation.

To make it worse, when he left the room to allow me to put my clothes back on (seemed pointless 😆), another random guy (I think was a doctor?) just walked in as I was putting my top on! He apologised but I've come away feeling like I've exposed myself to half the department!

Is this the norm?

OP posts:
Alittlebitofthis · 23/08/2023 08:42

I work somewhere where we do ECG's lots on a shift. It can be carried out by both males and females. No chaperones. They could however ask for a male/female to carry this out. Not sure about the echo's although it's probably positional as they'd have to look at the screen whilst the probe is on you.

Alittlebitofthis · 23/08/2023 08:44

Just to add, it really annoys me when medical/nursing staff just come in without announcing themselves. They just don't think but it's not a good enough excuse. We're told to never just walk in.

user1492757084 · 23/08/2023 08:44

Can you not bring in your own chaperone should you want one.?

Lisdeflores · 23/08/2023 08:47

I don't think your unreasonable to think that you should of had a chaperone available. As you say not only for your comfort/safety for his safety as well. I'm guessing the lack of a chaperone is down to lack of staff in the unit.
I know first hand that getting any appts is hard work it has taken over a year for us to get a cardiology op appt for my son.When I complained I was told that the unit was really short staffed.
I think they would have to provide a chaperone if you asked

Original poster
originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 09:50

It's not that I particularly wanted a chaperone myself, but it would have been nice/a good idea for one to be offered. I've been to other scan appointments, gynae appts etc and there has always been a female nurse present.

There wasn't really any explanation of what was going to happen, so I'm not sure how people would know to take their own person along?

OP posts:
Angelmonkey · 23/08/2023 09:56

I’m surprised male staff don’t want someone else present to safeguard themselves against complaints. I work in a GP surgery and the male doctors will always have a chaperone in the room if they are examining breasts or genital areas. They are not prepared to take the chance that a patient might submit a formal complaint even if they have done nothing wrong

Mozzie1 · 23/08/2023 09:59

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This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Previously banned poster.

Original poster
originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 10:10

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Previously banned poster.

No, but women may feel uncomfortable.

It wouldn't take much to offer, even if it was a woman from the reception desk.

It is routinely offered at GP appointments for intimate examinations.

OP posts:
MissCherryCakeyBun · 23/08/2023 10:26

The cardiology unit I visit in Bristol offers chaperones on both the appointment letter/email and on a sign on the check in desk. It also says on all my appointment letters if I want more info on what will be done to call.
Maybe something to suggest to the nhs trust you are seen under ?

Original poster
originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 10:28

MissCherryCakeyBun · 23/08/2023 10:26

The cardiology unit I visit in Bristol offers chaperones on both the appointment letter/email and on a sign on the check in desk. It also says on all my appointment letters if I want more info on what will be done to call.
Maybe something to suggest to the nhs trust you are seen under ?

Good idea, although this is the third NHS trust where this has been the case. I will feed back to PALS though.

OP posts:
sashh · 23/08/2023 10:38

He wouldn't be a sonographer it would be a cardiac scientist.

There probably isn't a 'spare' female in the department, they would all bw busy, a clinic is different as there are clinic nurses and this is one of their duties.

Unfortunately with where the heart is located you do have to be in that position.

BTW don't yo think some female staff with male patients might like a chaperone thenselves?

You are touching the patient in a darkened room.

user1471505494 · 23/08/2023 10:46

I had an echocardiogram last week conducted by a male technician and there was a lady in there with me. She said they provide chaperones to protect themselves

Mozzie1 · 23/08/2023 12:26

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Previously banned poster.

Fallstar · 23/08/2023 12:35

I have an echo every year and it's usually a man doing it. Never been offered a chaperone. Each person that's done my scan has been matter-of-fact but friendly and I've never felt ill-at-ease.

I can imagine that for some women the 'I-just-need-to-lift-your-breast-out-of-the-way' moment could be difficult. If I felt awkward about the scan, I would take someone along with me and I'm sure they wouldn't object.

Fallstar · 23/08/2023 12:39

Having said that, it's not on for a random member of staff to walk in unannounced when you're changing. Definitely something to talk to PALS about.

Original poster
originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 12:41

Look, I absolutely get it that the NHS is stretched, but I'm just curious as to why there has ALWAYS been a nurse or HCP present if I've ever had a breast or gynae issue, but for cardiology there is not?

I am a very chilled person and even I felt slightly uncomfortable that I had a man sitting on a bed with his body pressed against mine whilst he was touching/moving my breasts with no-one else present.

I can imagine that for a lot of other women this could have been quite upsetting for them.

I just find it strange.

OP posts:
Summerrainagain1 · 23/08/2023 12:44

I think it's up to you to ask for a chaperone/ female if you feel uncomfortable. They are doctors, or medical professinals, doing their jobs and they don't have a room full of would be chaperones available to be on offer to everyone.

I think I would feel more uncomfortable with someone stood watching all this happen btw.

ClaraMarmalade · 23/08/2023 13:02

You do need to take some responsibility here OP, and if you want a chaperone either request one in advance (so they can ensure that they can offer that or rebook if not) or take your own. There simply isn't a surplus of staff of a certain gender hanging around hospitals in case patients want a chaperone they haven't mentioned anything about previously.

The other staff member walking in unannounced, though, is not acceptable, that's a violation of your dignity. I would personally report that, they must be pretty lax for that to happen.

Original poster
originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 15:13

ClaraMarmalade · 23/08/2023 13:02

You do need to take some responsibility here OP, and if you want a chaperone either request one in advance (so they can ensure that they can offer that or rebook if not) or take your own. There simply isn't a surplus of staff of a certain gender hanging around hospitals in case patients want a chaperone they haven't mentioned anything about previously.

The other staff member walking in unannounced, though, is not acceptable, that's a violation of your dignity. I would personally report that, they must be pretty lax for that to happen.

As I've said already I didn't want a chaperone.

I've said multiple times that other women might have wanted this and at no point was it offered.

It also wasn't explained at any point what the situation would be - therefore no opportunity to make decision over whether you wanted someone with you or not.

OP posts:
tt9 · 23/08/2023 16:14

@originaltastecoke I have to say she you have experienced is not good practice. I would speak to PALS. in the very least they should put up posters reminding patients to ask for chaperones if they would like one.

tbh it's in the healthcare professionals interest to offer a chaperone as it protects them from potential litigation.

but also to explain why the technician was so blasé, when you do something so many times a day and are focused on getting certain images etc. its easy to forget that's a person and just think of the anatomy.

FooFighter99 · 23/08/2023 16:20

I know how you feel @originaltastecoke I've had 2x echoes in the past few years and was absolutely mortified at the first one because I didn't know what to expect, and having some young chap manoeuvre my (massive) boobs (he honestly looked about 15!) was just plain embarrassing!

It's made all the worse for me because I also work at my hospital 😩thankfully not with the staff who do the echoes, and I'm sure they wouldn't remember me if I bumped into them in the canteen..... but even so!

Trenchfootinthescottishhighlandstoday · 23/08/2023 16:27

Not too sure how to answer op except the last breast exam I had was by a woman who commented it must be cold outside.. So inappropriate I never returned when I was recalled...

WiddlinDiddlin · 23/08/2023 16:45

I've had loads of cardio appointments to scan heart and check what its doing (dying, very very slowly, is the grim answer to that)...

Never had a bloke do it, I think I would feel uncomfy about that without the offer of a chaperone - they do have to press up quite close to you, rummage about, move a boob, press down hard with the doodad (they do on me as im faaaaaaaaaaat, probably less so on a normal sized person). It is all rather personal... mm!

I would raise it that the offer of a chaperone seems appropriate, and it seems inappropriate that it isn't offered currently!

ManateeFair · 23/08/2023 16:52

I wouldn't expect a chaperone unless I'd asked for one, but other staff should not be walking in while you're undressed.

Original poster
originaltastecoke · 23/08/2023 18:41

FooFighter99 · 23/08/2023 16:20

I know how you feel @originaltastecoke I've had 2x echoes in the past few years and was absolutely mortified at the first one because I didn't know what to expect, and having some young chap manoeuvre my (massive) boobs (he honestly looked about 15!) was just plain embarrassing!

It's made all the worse for me because I also work at my hospital 😩thankfully not with the staff who do the echoes, and I'm sure they wouldn't remember me if I bumped into them in the canteen..... but even so!

Yes this is a very similar experience to mine...

OP posts: