To think people who want "safe routes to migration" into the UK are hopelessly naive

[ForestGoblin]

We could spend every penny of public money on bringing refugees to the UK in comfy and safe boats and planes. We could make it mandatory for every home to provide accommodation and food. We could ban healthcare for anyone except refugees.

And there would still be thousands and thousands of boat crossings every year and millions more people languishing in bad situations and trying to figure out how to get here or elsewhere in northern Europe.

It's a crap situation. Life is bad. I feel dreadful for them.

But "safe routes" is a load of glib nonsense that can't work.

Where did I say I wanted to lose any rights?

Initially, UNHCR, the UN Refugee Agency, was established by the United Nations General Assembly in 1950 in the aftermath of the Second World War to help the millions of Europeans who had fled or lost their homes.

The Refugee Convention is not UK immigration legislation. It is a piece of international human rights law, designed to remedy the problems that arise when people or groups of people can no longer rely on their state to protect their most fundamental rights.

It is more important that those like Rishi Sunak who have more money than they could possibly need, have 12 homes and not pay the same proportion of their income in tax as teachers and nurses, than everyone has a decent home to live in.

Hm, making our own rukes. That's gone well so far, hasn't it? Now that we aren't restricted by EU laws we can make our own, including spewing shit into our waters. Yay.

Nice dodge, but I'll ask again, in your mind what is the UN CHR?

Remember, the UK already has it's own legislation relating to this area.

For a fuller discussion of the UK immigration legislation do have a read of this useful article that a previous poster linked to.

https://levinslaw.co.uk/dinghies-in-the-channel-illegal-entrants-and-immigration-offences/

Please stop attacking me, I don't have to answer your questions, so go and bully somone else.

Where did I say I wanted to lose any rights?

But you want to rewrite them?

I am sure that it is much like BS and EN standards.

On leaving the EU EN standards still applied in the UK, and continue to do so for a transition period that was recently announced to be indefinite, because actually being in multi-national organisations is better.

So we could leave ECHR, without changing anybodys rights by simply getting in line with ECHR but having no influence in its further development.

Its the obvious thing to do really.

I doubt requisitioning properties will go far with many voters

The pp could give it a go and run on it

I didn't say that either.

Then what are you saying?

Why do you want to leave the Human Rights charter?

To strengthen the rights of everyone in the UK, because the current charter does not go far enough?

Thats the UN HCR not the UN CHR that you previously referred to. As you say the HCR is an organisation working to "ensure that everybody has the right to seek asylum and find safe refuge, having fled violence, persecution or war at home". Their work is underpinned by the refugee convention and you apparently want to withdraw from that, yes?

Or maybe those pro requisition pp could hand over their property to asylum seekers

You don't have to answer my questions, that is true. But equally I don't have to let someone calling for the removal of human rights to go unchallenged, and no that's not bullying.

Where did i say it was???

I suggested licensing them... you know.. names ... addresses. legitimate use... a means of tracing.... we can trace a piece of beef back to the individual animal, the farm and the guy who butchered it.. but we cannot find out where 1000s of boats are ending up in N. France came from?

Do tell me which boat chandler sells 5000 large non RIB inflatables with 10hp engines.... oh and wants 80 life jackets to go with it...

Of course it needs EU co op, which we haven't got... but breaking up the gangs and their means is one of the few options left...

As for waiting for NI to join ROI.... FFS we haven't got 10 or 20 years.... a border poll is not going to happen anytime soon.

@Alexandra2001 "As for waiting for NI to join ROI.... FFS we haven't got 10 or 20 years.... a border poll is not going to happen anytime soon."

It's closer than you think....

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/06/its-closer-now-than-its-ever-been-could-there-soon-be-a-united-ireland

It’s catching the person who buys the boat which is hard

If there’s no identification on it, how would you?

And why would someone who buys it leave ID on there. Does your average dingy come with a tag, if it does cut it off. Takes a second

How many smugglers are there, I might buy 10 a year from five different outlets, again not that hard

If it really was that easy to stop children being thrown overboard off the coast of Italy I think it would have been done by now.

People always get so wound up

Is it when arguments don’t stack up

Plus the French do do a lot to try and stop smugglers. We pay pay them to, not sure if it covers it all but they are trying

If it was as easy as a few phone calls they could just do that and get rid of the night vision and spotters on the beaches

I heard all that was needed was some drones, is that wrong?

Which arguments don't stack up?

That this 'stop the boats' is a crisis of the governments own making that they have no intention to resolve because it is easier to blame vulnerable people?

The only person getting wound up is you! i don't know why you keep raising this.... its a forum, no more.

ID is very easy, can be incorporated inside the boat and as as they have multi compartments, i doubt people will want to cut open the boat to find the chip... Could also look at deterrent sentencing too.

Boats used in the Med don't come from Europe, they also tend not to be dinghies....

I thought Aussies were Can do, positive people?

They may well use them.

"In addition, there will be modern, high-performance night vision equipment, thermal cameras, 300 lamps, 160 tactical lighting projectors, interception and communication means, as well as clothing effects.

Overall, France intercepts between 50 and 60 percent of small boats’

It’s expensive and there’ll always be people that get through but if they thought tracing boats was easier and better outcome there’s no reason why they’d not save money and do that