DD 16, what to do!?

[Ifyouwantmeillbeinthebar]

Looking for a bit of advice and guidance with my eldest DD who is 16, I’m sorry if it gets a big rambly, there a few worries and not sure if connected

I am admittedly a bit over protective, especially with her, my first born as the teenager years are uncharted territories (though two younger siblings are not far behind) so I’m not sure if this skewing my judgment.

DD is a really good kid, she helps a lot at home, has a mostly good sense of right and wrong and does well in school. She was right at the front of the queue when it came to handing out creativity and it’s meant that she really excels at music, art and performance, something we have always encouraged but that has also came with a good hand of dramatics and she can also be quite an emotional child.

I should also add at this point that her dad, my husband is currently deployed so might add to current situation.

DD has a girlfriend, really lovely girl with a lovely family. This is DD’s 2nd girlfriend, the 1st ending, I think because things became too intense and afterwards we had a chat about boundaries and friendships with others being important etc. This seems to be a much healthier relationship, DD spends much more time with friends though I do often check her if I feel it could go back to all being a bit heavy.

Firstly we seem to have stumbled into some disordered eating, DD is vegetarian and has been for a few years however she has been slowly removing other foods from her diet, fish, milk, eggs because she wants to be vegan, certain fruits and vegetables because they didn’t taste nice after Covid the list goes on and it’s actually becoming really tricky to cook a meal for her.

Due to working and my DC all being old enough to fix theirselves breakfast, snack and lunch i haven’t noticed until the last few days how little DD is actually eating now but it’s not a lot, yesterday for example a couple of spoonfuls of yogurt and fruit that her sister had made, a coffee at Costa and half a bowl of pasta that I had to encourage her to eat because she was feeling sick. I have also noticed her in the mirror pulling her jeans out from her waist in the mirror and sucking her tummy in. She has always been slim and I’m unsure yet if she has dropped any more weight, though obviously it’s absolutely on my radar.

The reason I brought up the GF is that their has been a few things said that I’ve taken notice off, the first was upon meeting GF’s DF he mentioned that GF used to be a lot heavier but has lost a lot of weight recently, GF is really tiny and petite, she also wears quite baggy clothes the 2nd was them both sitting on the sofa and DD accidentally nudging GF with her elbow and saying your elbows are so shard and bony and DD said something like that’s the nicest thing anyone has every said to me which they both started giggling at, I found this quite shocking, am I wrong?

I think what had made me not take this too seriously until recently is that DD LOVES eating out, and would happily go out for food every day if her finances allowed, this food restricting only seems to be at home and I wondered if an attention thing (though realise that doesn’t mean that everything if ok)

Mixed in with this is sleepovers with GF, having an 11 and 14 DD’s in the house as well I’ve been very careful of what I’ve allowed as don’t want to set a precedent for boundaries when they might change if one of the girls were in a relationship with a boy.

I did say she could stay at GF’s house the night before last and she not only came home saying she felt very unwell, which turned out to be because had had a bagel and some sweets in 24 hours but also with bites (non insect kind) all over her neck which she thought were really funny.

Im not naive, I remember being 16 and I also know she is almost an adult but I just can’t help feel she is spiralling and I want to get a hold before it goes any further.

Rightly or wrongly I’ve told her she is grounded just now until she can start acting in a responsible and respectful way to herself and others (DD 11 looks up to big sis and doesn’t miss a thing she does) I’ve reminded her she is a role model to sisters.

Internally Im angry at her more than sympathetic, which I realise isn’t great but I can’t help but feel with all the jokes the outward pinching of skin in front of me and being so obvious about not eating as well as seeming to forever be spending her money in noodle bars, bubble tea shops and Tesco meal deals that she is really is pushing the act to worry me and get attention, though maybe that just makes me sound really ignorant and awful.

Any help on navigating any of the above would be great.

I’d grounded her because I’m concerned about how little she is eating and not feeling well off the back of it (faint, sick etc l) I’m worried she is going pass out and I’d like to spend some time chatting to me and come up with a plan on how to move forward as obviously she can’t go out every day skipping breakfast, and not getting in till after dinner and going to bed.

I can see it came from a place of concern but you’ve basically punished her when she hasn’t done anything wrong. A better approach might be to plan activities with her, where you can spend time with her, explain your concerns without judgement, without bringing her girlfriend into it and looking for ways to support her. She may be unaware that things have slipped as far as they have food wise and may need space to open up. Treating everything as a discipline issue at this age doesn’t work, think relationship first.

Rightly or wrongly I’ve told her she is grounded just now until she can start acting in a responsible and respectful way to herself and others (DD 11 looks up to big sis and doesn’t miss a thing she does) I’ve reminded her she is a role model to sisters.

I don't get this - what did she do that was so bad she got grounded and why are you putting pressure on her to be a role model to her younger sisters.

The disordered eating I'd keep an eye on but I sure as fuck wouldn't be secretly feeding her meat more trying to find stuff she likes to eat - finding poss vegan recipes - and possibly getting her involved in more food prep.

Thank you @NanFlanders that’s really helpful and quite eye opening,

I hope your daughter is getting help and is moving towards recovery. X

I’d grounded her because I’m concerned about how little she is eating and not feeling well off the back of it (faint, sick etc l) I’m worried she is going pass out and I’d like to spend some time chatting to me and come up with a plan on how to move forward as obviously she can’t go out every day skipping breakfast, and not getting in till after dinner and going to bed.

Saw this I don't think grounding is the right approach - asking her to spend more time with you or making more opportunities to do so or giving her tasks to do before she goes out and a time to be back by and as PP suggested trying to check her social media.

I might also without her knowledge start to read up about disordered eating and what helps and what doesn't.

Never ever set up a child to be “othered” form her siblings, as a role model, someone they look up to or a even the black sheep , the clever one, the silly one, the emotional one or whatever you happen upon
children should never ever be compared or made to feel they are responsible for behaving in a certain way that will be held in judgement by siblings

expect the same from your kids. You teach your kids to be the best people they can be , it’s not your other children’s role to do that by comparison

i know you’ve said you said it in error. But the fact you think this, could say it, means you are othering her. You need to think carefully about this and what you expect of her

as for food thing…watch carefully, I’d be concerned.

as for sex thing- set yourself boundaries and communicate them clearly to DD. On one hand you’re saying it’s ok to sleep over as they’ll have sex anyway, and then you’re getting cross at bites. Which is it. Make the decision, set clear boundaries. Follow through

Mate, DD’s anorexia’s more trouble than a love bite.

It sounds more like they’re just 2 teenagers trauma bonded together by this disordered eating opposed to actual girlfriends
16 is such a vulnerable age. I hope you get some support xx

This might be a rubbish idea - but someone mentioned spending more time with her and I wonder if doing some regular cooking together - of nice, vegan meals - might be a way forward?

You are getting a pasting here, but you say lots of times that you’re struggling and are muddling through. We all make mistakes and errors of judgement with our kids. NanFlanders has been a voice of reason here, it’s scary when our kids are doing things we can see as being dangerous or disrespectful. I agree with doing things together, if she’s going vegan, why not have a vegan cooking session, followed by a picnic? Make it a day when gf can’t come over (what a shame, oh well let’s do something together) Go with your other kids, take a frisbee or a ball and just relax. Make it a no phone afternoon for you all. Or if you can just a day together, walk in the park, the beach. Little steps.

Full blown anorexia is a medical issue and can't be addressed by just encouraging someone to eat or education, but if it's not at that level yet and is more the start of a path of disordered eating from a teenager exercising control over what she does and doesn't do - then trying to explore nutrition as a wider subject might be helpful. Not just the shallow diet level of calories are bad, eating as few as possible is the best thing, but what macro and micro nutrients your body needs to be healthy. That there's a difference between 300 calories of fizzy drink and 300 calories of a salad with hard boiled egg.

Excessive exercise can be a risk alongside disordered eating, but does she do much exercise now? It could be beneficial for her to see food as fuel to become stronger, to learn to use her body and build muscle and strength, through joining a gym with the guidance of a personal trainer/exercise classes.

OP there's a teen eating disorder thread on MN - you may want to post there.
Eating disorders can kill so that's what I'd be worried about. The rest just sounds like usual teen nonsense that time takes care of.

I also agree that 16 year olds having full on adult relationships where they stay together and spend all time together is not healthy

But very, very normal for 16 year olds.
When they fall in love for the first time it is all-consuming.
I do not agree that this is unhealthy. It's what young people do. It's part of growing up.

I agree with @NanFlanders . The biggest issue here is the disordered eating and the possible influence of the GF on that. It is so difficult for teenage girls these days and a lot of them seem to react by developing eating disorders.
My own DD(15) has a disordered relationship with food and it is difficult to address it. My DH was a very picky eater, she still is. Eats a lot of junk, doesn't eat in a predictable ways at meals. We try not to make a big issue out of it yet provide nutritious food... we haven't solved it, that's for sure. I hope it doesn't spiral out of control, and hope the same for your DD.
In my daughter's case, luckily, her BF is very sporty and a good eater. She eats well when she's with him (he's also accepting of her pickiness and a good cook).

As for the hickeys, you realize just like I do that if teens decide to have a sexual relationship, they will do it when they get a chance. Yes, hickeys are tacky; my DD went through that phase, she doesn't sport them any longer. Since you've accepted the sexual activity - and I agree with other posters who say same sex relationships remove the worry of pregnancy - and since your daughter seems to have a better balance between the relationship with her GF and with other friends now, the hickeys/role model issues should be secondary. The real worry here is the disordered eating.

You will lose trust if you lie, and give her meat,

I think your anger is misplaced, are you sure it's not just easier to feel angry than worried?

You can't really decide whether your 16 year old's behaviour is a problem or not based on the fact that you had two other children after her. Either it is or it isn't. If she was an only child would you ground her for getting lovebites? (in a long term relationship and at a classic age for it I must say! Most people do this once before realising how long they last!) Would you ground her for not eating enough and asking to come home?

On the subject of the eating - I echo a PP who said about regular meals. I'd cancel the grounding on provision that she has three solid meals a day, at least two of these at home. See how she reacts. Unfortunately I think the best advice with borderline disordered eating is basically just feed them.

You're mixing up her relationship with her eating disorder.

It's completely normal for 16 year olds to have strong, intense feelings in relationships. Yes, as adults we can see it's not ideal but it's part of being a teenager and it's how they learn and grow. Love bites again are normal for teenagers - punishing her for coming home with them when you allowed her to sleep over with her girlfriend makes no sense. She's not doing anything wrong.

Her eating disorder/eating issues are completely separate and she also shouldn't be punished/grounded for her eating choices. If you're concerned (and you should be) then you need to deal with that via the official channels - GP etc, not via grounding.

I also agree with PP's about not making her a role model for her sisters. She's a teenager who, by the sounds of things, is a pretty good kid - just one who is struggling with her eating/mental health.

Full blown anorexia is a medical issue and can't be addressed by just encouraging someone to eat or education

Absolutely this, OP.
You're worrying too much about the love-bites and not enough about the incipient anorexia.
Grounding her is not helpful, although I can see that you're worried about a variety of things.

She is not a role model for her younger siblings and you shouldn't hold her up to be one, or ask to, either. She is her own person.

She is your first child so of course you're struggling to navigate through the teen years. They can be very difficult. You say that you remember having sex when and where you could when you were her age.

I remember getting love bites at that age and being proud of them, too. I confess I cringe when I remember that now.

You need to research anorexia PDQ and read the threads on here about it. You will learn more there about this and it will be of great use to you.

As a vegan I would go apeshit at ANYONE who tired to tamper with my food. Some tried before for a laugh but they won't do it again in a hurry.
What sort of parent would even think about that as an idea? I would have never forgiven my dm if she had pulled that one.

I wouldn't try and minimise her disordered eating, as you might be doing when you say it could be an attention thing. Even if 'just' for attention that is a need that she is expressing and an indication that all is not entirely healthy in her self esteem.

I think the suggestion to try and gently encourage her into activity that isn't internet based or revolving around her GF is a good one, whether it's a sport or something more skill based, they can be surprisingly bolstering to self esteem.

If you think she has disordered eating/anorexia and is feeling faint and unwell then you need to take her to the GP. Anorexia can affect the heart and blood pressure, also kidneys etc and is very dangerous. She needs referred to an eating disorder unit.

@Dotjones
Try to stop her being a vegan/vegetarian so she eats more healthily. If it helps you can tell her the food you give her is "vegan" meat or whatever, but actually give her the real deal. If she's eating out a lot she'll inadvertently be eating meat and animal products anyway, all restaurants are careless about segregating vegan food from normal food, some deliberately mix it up.

Can't believe you said that! Vege food is often way more nutritious than meat. It's up to her if she doesn't want to eat animal products! Misleading her into eating it is even worse!!!

dotjones you are a complete --- it's not complimentary.