To consider myself working class?

[TheCatsKnickers]

I'm fully aware that it doesn't matter, but for the sake of argument - basically an ongoing debate with friend who insists I am middle class - which of us would be correct?

My background:
Dad probs upper working, good job but no higher education, bought our house and subsequent houses without mortgage. Mum from educated family but was SAHM. Grew up in MC area and schools, kept horses but more rough and tumble than 'posh'. Had a few years off too travel and have fun in late teens largely funded by parents, then went to uni late and studied fine art.
This, according to my friend cements me as MC.

The present day:
Followed my passion and became a painter. Didn't want to marry or have children so chose to rent. Preferred this as could move around and experience different places. Bit of a free spirit, but had to accept some financial insecurity for the pleasure! Am now in 40's and still similar, very content with long term DP but, I presume, not typical for many my age.
I have a decent 5 figure sum in savings although we received only a smallish inheritance due to both parents needing care in old age (they had also given their second property to an aunt and uncle who developed health issues in later life).
My income is somewhat fluid and would possibly terrify some, but I have intermittently earned very, very well and often receive high payments for my work (anywhere from £200 to £1k per commission or piece), but some months are quite the opposite.
So my lifestyle is not standard and has some financial insecurity, but I made my own choices.
Therefore, since I don't own a home or have a private pension I perceive my status to be 'working class', regardless of my background privileges and lifestyle. My friend argues not!

Which of us is correct?

I don't even know anyone who is upper MC.

My best friend is an artist, for example, came from a WC family in council housing. She was told to move out on leaving school if she wanted to go to college, as it was expected she contributed right away to the family pot. Her family would not accept her interest in music or science.
She never went to uni but did make a good living as a sound engineer and still tours with bands. Perhaps some of it depends on the determination of the individual - except of course she began with less resources and security.

A published poet I know is thoroughly working class although his family support his choice. He is also a par time tutor.

Do people on MN thing the working class are all in poverty? Many are extremely affluent here.

So your best friend made a good living as a sound engineer before becoming an artist and the poet tutors to support his income I guess? So they both also had/have real jobs too

I've never experienced poverty but some working class families do. I see with my Dad's school friends, their parents are having to make a choice of food or paying £20 for a school trip, others are even worse off and having to use food banks.

*Dd's not dad's

Yes, but I am not sure where people have come to the conclusion that I do not have to work for a living.
When my income dips, I shit myself, and my savings are going down. I will definitely have to take on extra work soon.
My teenage years do not apply now, even if i began life with those privileges.

Most people in the UK have to work for a living, one way or another. Very few of us live on stored savings alone or inheritance.

The recent bbc report on class categories put my financial situation at precariat/working class, hence my op. I was aware that my background was more middle.

I mean, your friend is right, but does it really matter?

Sorry OP, I meant salaried jobs or jobs with a stable monthly/weekly income. I understand been an artist can be hard work with varied pay, that's why a lot of WC people wouldn't nt choose it as a career unless they had another income source

I had a friend once (working class) who told me my family were 'common' because my dad looked and talked like someone from' last of the summer wine'.
We did not have RP accents in my family, although mine caught up a bit via schooling.

Oh god believe me my very MC friends from school most definitely thought I was insane and would not have dreamed of following my path, either!

Yes, I agree. And whomever invented the term 'underclass' wants shooting

😂😂

Is someone implying i am actually Aristotle?

Hahahaha I’m from a working class family and would never even consider such a precarious income, you need a lot of financial confidence and zero fear you’ll be out in the street to even contemplate it. That’s very middle class.

As are the multiple properties, horses and being bankrolled by parents to do nothing.

Despite a very gifted childhood and early(middle class) life, your "choice" of degree has meant that in your adult years you have - as you describe a "fluid" income, others may describe this as unreliable, patchy or even poor.
With no assets and having not made an attempt to provide for yourself in your future years you are still (upper) middle class. Even if your current earnings are more low/mid working class.

I meant to say - this is actually a huge factor in the under-representation of working class people in the arts. Inter-generational privilege supports creativity.

You’ve really made me chuckle OP. Come and spend a few days on my estate and you’ll be left in no doubt that you are indeed, very firmly middle class.

Why are you so keen to be seen as working class? Is it that it sounds slightly more exciting and dangerous than growing up in your nice house, where your dad would come home from work each day, your mum would prepare dinner and you’d all sit down and eat together after you’d mucked out the horses?

I don't think the OP is WC, but of course some artists are / were, especially if they went to art school when it was free to do a degree.

Tracy Emin, Sarah Lucas, Damien Hirst - they were all working class, not sure if they still see themselves that way.

As for the talk of real jobs, hobby jobs etc. Is being a carpenter a 'real job'? They are generally self-employed and make stuff, the only difference is that the results are of practical use rather than purely aesthetic.

Working class doesn't mean poor

Appreciate the responses, many have given me food for thought, especially the less ..polite ones. Thank you.

Op, you are what I call nouveau middle class. You went to university like a lot of us did, probably as first in family, which in turn bought you cultural capital. You live a more ‘middle class’ life because of that, but the true privilege that comes from being generationally middle class is absent. It’s very clear when you meet someone who is not nouveau, the financial and social capital they have inherited is incomparable.

i have one nouveau friend who is an artist, but most admittedly choose STEM because it’s a much safer bet when you don’t have the wealth/support to fall back on.

Only the daughters of viscounts and barons are entitled to be called Hon. The OP is the daughter of a miner and so is (just) entitled to call herself WC if she wants to. 😆Seriously though, I've no idea why people are so keen to gatekeep WC status - it's not like it's exclusive or something. Unfortunately, nothing's easier these days than downward mobility.

Indeed. I was reading an article a few days ago about Christopher Eccleston and theatre closures in the North West. He was concerned that he would never have been able to become an actor now, considering his background. More and more access and opportunity for WC artists across the country are closing up.

Dad had a good job and bought our house and subsequent houses without mortgage. Mum from educated family & we could afford for her to not work. Kept horses. My parents funded my travel and taking a few years to just have fun. Chose to do something with low earning potential at uni because I had no pressing need to make money.

The present day:
Followed my passion and became a painter (because I didn't have to worry about money). Didn't want to marry or have children so chose to have less financial stability and rent.
I have a decent 5 figure sum in savings.

I summarised it for you more accurately. You tell us what you think.

Working class people don't tend to just take years out for shits and giggles fully funded by bank of mum and dad. They also don't ride horses or have the household income to sustain one parent not working. They also don't usually have 5 figure savings while having a passion/hobby job.

OP I don't think you quite live in the real world 😂

You have no Idea what working class is so fuck off on your middle class horse hon.

Dear god.

"Whomever"!