20 year old lazy, dirty son

[PissedOff2020]

Really at my wits end. Sorry this is a lengthily one.

We have 4 boys, eldest is 20 & dropped out of Uni after the first term - well over 18 months ago now. He didn’t tell us of course, had 5 weeks off over xmas and made no attempt to look for work. When we eventually found out and asked why the hell he hadn’t been looking for work he said he ‘wanted to chill and have the xmas break’. He was 19 then.

Mu husband eventually found him a job 2 months later, as ds’s effort was non existent. Zero hours contract and all good at first. His room was a dirty,dirty hovel with a smell coming out (think plates, food, rubbish etc all over floor). Carpet ruined, walls filthy.. clothes all over floor - can’t even open door there is that much shit. Anyway, that’s been a constant cause of arguments in house - just clean it ffs! He’s just got worse with that, we are quite house proud and I resent the smell upstairs- it’s a joke. He never contributes to household chores, despite countless conversations about it. Just does the bare minimum to get by.
Faat forward to now, his zero hours is currently working out at 8 hours a week. Been like that for 3 months and he’s not bothered to look for a job. We’ve told him he needs full time job, job hunted for him, sent him linked to apply - he does nothing. He sleeps all the time and games all night, sat in his filth.
Took him abroad last month, in the hope to speak to him away from the augments at home and also let him see life outside his bedroom. He slept all day, total waste of money. When I spoke to him about it he couldn’t see any issue with staying in his hotel room all day.
Over the last 2 months he’s got even worse, doesn’t even speak to us. Literally walks in a room and ignores us - we say hello, he has headphones on and so can’t hear anything, but makes no effort to acknowledge us etc. He eats meals if we cook, otherwise lives off sandwiches and cereal.
I have had enough, it’s intolerable. Constant tension and frustration in the house over it. Spoke to him and said I felt like he was treating us like doormats and he has no gratitude for what he has and enough was enough. Told him, the atmosphere in the house with him ignoring us was awful, just made us feel like he doesn’t give a shit about us. Asked why he wasn’t applying for jobs, he shrugged his shoulders. Told him we are not working our arses off, both working full time, for him to work a day a week and sleep all day. Then do not a thing around the house and blank us in the process.
Eventually it finished in a huge row after he snarled he’d apply for jobs but we shouldn’t speak to him at all anymore. Genuinely like he was angry we expected him to work. To add, even before his hours were really slashed he’s only ever worked around 25-30 hours per week at best. He’s had it so easily but he hasn’t a single bit of appreciation. We’ve spoken to him a year ago when he said he was unhappy at work - suggested all sorts, he was going to look into things but he never did.
I just don’t know what to try next. Explained to him over and over before yesterday this is his chance to build his career, we are supporting him whilst he does that. He’s not though, he is quite happy to do nothing and wait until it’s at breaking point - which is where I am at.
Anyone been here? Any advice from any others?

Do you know how hard it is to get into a homeless shelter? He might well end up on the streets. From there it's a very short downward trajectory for some.

I’m so sick of the whining, as if no generation has ever had to struggle before. He’s not even working full time, don’t act like he’s desperately doing his best, he’s not, he never has. Plenty of young people move out, part of it might involve giving up some luxuries that those spoilt previous generations didn’t have, you know, like their iPhones, Xbox, Netflix, and god forbid, but like previous generations, they might have to live in a shared house or somewhere that isn’t Instagram worthy. Horrifying stuff I know.

But instead of expecting them to at least try, many people on here seem quick to pathologies instead, labelling him with depression, ADHD, autism etc, because apparently they have diagnosis skills that far surpass those of trained professionals. Could he have depression etc? Sure, maybe, but that doesn’t excuse his behaviour. Getting him to a GP is just part of a bigger picture, expecting a 20 year old to grow up and start behaving in a decent manner is just basic, the cost of living is no excuse for treating other people like shit.

Not enabling a 20 year old man who works 8 hours a week, lives in a midden and treats his parents disgustingly is not acting superior. Expecting more than that is acting superior? I don't even know how to respond to that. The OP says in her first post how uncomfortable this 20 year old man is making everyone in the house. Would I make him homeless? No, would be pointless when he's only working 8 hours a week. But fuck me, mollycoddling a 20 year old man who treats his loved ones like utter shit is not the way to go. I will say it again, no wonder there are so many women writing threads about living with useless manbabies. We expect nothing from them from a young age apparently. Expecting more is acting superior and makes someone a keyboard warrior.

That’s fine, as long as he’s not expecting mummy and daddy to slave for him and provide a roof over his head forever more. 🙄

I'd like to see the stats from the developing world on this sort of thing. Id guess that less than 0.1% of 20 year olds would be living like this because there'd be no option for them to do it.

There'd be no parental tolerance of it AT ALL.

And the young people there know it too.

Your son is not coping. He has given up on university (as others said, perhaps he could not cope with the work load, demands of living away and so on). He cannot organise himself. He cannot save his dignity by finding more substantial employment.

As others have suggested, he may have mental health difficulties. He may be able to put on a 'couldn't care less' front and hide away behind his phone etc, but no-one would choose to live like your son, unless there was a reason.

I am assuming that this is new behaviour. After all, just over a year ago, he was able to pack up his stuff and set off for university. As others have suggested, he needs to be able to talk to someone. He needs to be able to work back into valuing himself again, and engaging with life a little.

The lack of communication, tendency to sleep all day, rather than engage in activities/social interaction, defensiveness, self neglect (rotting food in his room etc) all suggest (to me) that this is something more than just a lazy and unappreciative young man.

I have a 22 year old, who does not engage with life and will not look for work or even claim benefits. He is a broken soul, but he will put on an nonchalant ' don't give an F' front. I have tried the stick (do something or get out!) and the carrot (I'll pay for this, if you just try a little bit of that!) . Neither approach is effective (although both have there place). He does talk to me about his feelings, and what he tells me is frightening. Only now is he beginning to work with the MH services.

So, the first thing I would work on is trying to establish some form of communication. With my son, I noticed the music he was listening to and looked up the lyrics. It was Narrowhead, Li'l Peep and artists I had never heard of, but whose lyrics were dark. A simple question, such as 'is that how you feel?' opened up a conversation. Offer to help with the room, perhaps giving him a black bag or bin, just to put the rotten food in. Allowing him to see a large task can be tackled in small steps.

His behaviour is not excusable and there is no way that his behaviour should affect the rest of the family so negatively. However, it sounds like you son is really struggling with something, and, as other posters have said, this is, sadly, not uncommon among young people.

All of this. Fine to get him to a doctor but the man still has to grow up. Even if that means giving up gaming and share accommodation that he actually has to pay for. The horror!

The lockdowns have delayed the development of a lot of young people, so it's reasonable to assume this could happen in their early 20s. But the problem is the backdrop - as a teenager, a lot can be forgiven. It's harder for someone a bit older

I agree - my son is between his 2nd and 3rd years at university but I think in many ways he's probably more like I was as I left school. People seem to have forgotten covid and lockdown so quickly and how it affected young peoples' growth and for this age group their sixth form experience which is when you grow up a lot.

However, that doesn't mean the OP's son can waft around doing nothing - it just means he has to be treated as if he were 17/18 rather than 20. I disagree with the MN mantra that switching off the WIFI solves everything, but I would be wondering why he gave up on university so easily given the circumstances in which he started studying. I can understand dropping out but most kids found a different course in a different city and started again once lockdown eased. The OP hasn't come back to us on that.

The lockdowns have delayed the development of a lot of young people

Ive seen studies that suggest babies and toddlers language skills MAY have been hindered by lockdown, not seen any studies suggesting teenagers and early 20s have delayed development though. Do you have a source for this? I’d genuinely be interested in reading it.

In fact, whilst searching, I’ve just found a study that suggests the opposite:

https://covid19.nih.gov/news-and-stories/teen-brains-aged-prematurely-during-covid-19-pandemic

That article says this, copied and pasted

What did they learn?

After pandemic shutdowns, teens reported more anxiety and depression. They also internalized problems more than the teens interviewed before the pandemic.
Brain scans showed that parts of the brain involved in memory and emotion — the hippocampus and the amygdala — were thicker in post-shutdown teen brains. The cortex — the area involved in executive functions, such as self-control and problem-solving — was thinner.

Nice proving of our points about depression and executive functioning there. And of course, once it sets in, it isn’t easy to get out of. Maybe read your sources next time if you’re going to get smug about it.

YANBU
But, giving him the benefit of doubt that he may be depressed - I’d be inclined to give him a heads up but then do a deep clean of his room with him. Possibly it’s too big of a task now and he’s overwhelmed. Maybe an opportunity to discuss how worried you are for him. Could you get him to see a GP?

I would lay out expectations eg, find work, shower daily, do own laundry, keep room tidy etc. if he fails to do this (or at least make some effort towards it), I’d switch WiFi off/change password and cancel his phone contract. He maybe needs something to motivate him to work!

He is twenty. He is an adult. He is a disrespectful bully who is making your home intolerable.
Pack his stuff and tell him he’s moving out. It sickens me to hear og grown men behaving in this way.

You should encourage him to go back to university

At the very least turn off the Wi-Fi or change the password and don't give it to him unless he needs certain conditions.

Well duh that’s what parents are supposed to do.

Could you be any more obnoxious? 😂

Why are some posters so horrified and upset at the suggestion that an entitled, rude, disrespectful and lazy adult man be made to feel the fall-out of his very poor behaviour? 🫤

It’s symptomatic of how society has gone to shit. These pathetic men children are indulged by parents who are guilted into funding their latest Iphones, streaming services and gaming devices but the poor diddums are too depressed to shower and change their underwear. And are allowed to get away with it.

I agree it seems like the son could be depressed and lacking direction

It boggles the mind.