All old people should sell up family homes for families.

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Not really an AIBU, more a hypothetical question really. This view comes up a lot on MN, and I'm interested in the detail of what people actually imagine when they say it. What type of property should they be giving up? What type of property should they be moving to? How old is old? What about younger people who under occupy a property? For example 2 friend couples, have recently downsized. Both from a 4 bed detached, one to a 4 bed semi, and the other to a 3 bed semi. Their homes were bought, one by a young professional couple, and the other by a couple in their seventies, themselves downsizing. If you hold this view what do you visualise?

It was my understanding that this does happen but there is a cut-off point. No-one over 60 can be compelled to move, whereas a person in their fifties, who lived with elderly parents who died, for instance, gets told they can't stay in the property unless there's a child or disabled person resident. Those are the rules where I live. They will be offered a tenancy elsewhere. But I wouldn't say by today's standards that even 60 is particularly old.

Another thing is ... I know loads of senior citizen/elderly people, probably 75-85 plus, who've lived in the same council house, (3 or 4 bed property that they've lived in for 60+ years,) that they raised their two to five children in ... and they've lived on their own for the last 25-30 years since all the children left.

They looked after it, and it was immaculate and looked after as if it was their own property. Beautiful garden, lovely curtains, nicely carpeted and furnished, lovely decor, lovely flooring etc....

Then what happens is they're pushed or forced into care - or into a one bed flat or bungalow (bullied by the younger generations in their family and occasionally by the council,) to 'free up the house.' And what do they move in? A single parent or family with two to four kids - entitled and shouty, who scream day and night at one another, and exhibit appalling behaviour ... and within 12 to 18 months the place is an absolute shit tip, after being kept immaculately for 60 + years.

Don't even pretend this never happens. I know at least 7 or 8 properties this has happened to ... 3 and 4 bed properties kept beautifully for 60 years or more, and when the older tenants of 60 years leave, the council completely does it out.... new kitchen, new bathroom, new windows and doors, new central heating system, all decorated out for this new family ...

And within 12 months it's an absolute dump. Stuff broken and smashed - after arguments and rows, or one of their parties, and the new tenants demanding it's repaired immediately... And the garden is full of broken toys, smashed up rabbit hutches, dog shit, knackered garden furniture, old car and motorcycle parts, and grass that's never cut, with weeds all over the driveway and lawn... Yeah, yeah. right. Let's make people 'free up' their homes that they've had for 60-70 years to make way for THESE kind of people. 🙄

Tell me you have never been in social housing with a lifelong tenancy and affordable rent, without telling me you have never been in social housing with a lifelong tenancy and affordable rent. 🙄

Social Housing isn't hostels, @Luckydip1. It was designed, policy-wise, as housing for working families and families in need. Originally there was an income test.

I think some people on MN think it's free or something

Even desperate women with children in refuges are required to apply for UC and housing benefit to pay their rent.

My mum is 60. She absolutely admitted lifw for us (her kids) is more expensive. Thpugh we are from another Eu country, but still, similar should logically apply in UK.

@Luckydip1 🤣🤣🤣🤣 you need to accept social housing is a way of life for some people. It's very much needed it's literally impossible for some people to buy a house. Be practical do you actually understand how difficult it is to gain social housing today or you still living 30 years ago? @AutumnCrow is right.

Well they would think differently about it if you were only entitled to live there for say five years or until your youngest child was 18, obviously with exceptions for disabled etc. If you knew you only had a limited period you would work your arse off to save money to buy or rent when your time is up.

I don't know where you live, @PurpleButterflyWings, and maybe you're just very unlucky, but social houses where I live are kept pretty well by young families. The only real dumps are the houses owned by single men, alcos and an old woman who lives near me and is an enthusiastic feeder of pigeons and who has inadvertently infested every bloody garden in the street with vermin. Please don't tar all families who need social housing with the same brush.

The income test was to ensure the main earner could afford the rent. In the early days of council housing, inspectors visited prospective tenants, and made judgements about the standard of cleanliness. Some of the files make for fascinating reading!

Families valued the improved standards, most moved from homes without hot water or bathrooms and took a pride in their new homes and gardens.

@gemstoneju Yeah sure some social housing homes ARE kept nice by young families - but some are NOT. As I said, I have seen quite a few kept beautifully for over half a century by people, only to turned into shitholes within a year by a certain type of person. (When the old tenants of 60 years or so leave....)

And as I said, the people who had this place as their lovely home, are turfed out against their will, for THAT.

Like I said, don't pretend it never happens, with your faux naivety - because it does. People have much less respect for their social housing properties these days. Many people were grateful for them pre 1990s, now, some people believe they are entitled to them, like the 'old people need to fuck off so I can have their house' types.

I find people who spout this shitty mantra... 'people should give up their social housing as soon as they start earning over a certain amount lalala,' are jealous. Jealous of the low rent, and the secure tenancy people have, and how they have all the repairs and maintenance done...., While they are struggling to make ends meet, struggling to pay ever rising mortgage rates, and have to pay for repairs and maintenance and all the structural flaws with their house etc..

OR they are desperate for social housing themselves, and are bitter and angry they can't get it... Hilariously - these people who are demanding others move out of THEIR HOME so they can have it ... (the home that they have always paid rent for, and made their family home and sanctuary for 40-50 years or more,) will never EVER EVER move out themselves.

And what is the point of someone moving out, if, for example, their family income suddenly bumps over £40K??? They have to go private let, or try and get a deposit together for a deposit for a house. Then a year or two down the line, their income drops again, so they are on £30K or less family income.

What then? Are they going to be given a shiny new tenancy on another social housing home? Are they FUCK! They will very likely never get another social housing home!

You would have to have rocks in your head to give up a social housing home willingly, just because others are jealous and bitter that they don't have one!

And in my experience, the people who are allocated social housing, (ergo people on fairly low income, or state benefits, or pensions,) are very VERY unlikely to EVER be on a very high income, in a high flying career, and in a position to pay high private let rents, or BUY a property.

Leave them alone FFS. The young - and the old - AND the ones in the middle.

YOU not being able to get a social housing property, or struggling with your mortgage and house repairs and maintenance are NOT the problem of people sitting pretty in social housing. As has been said before, you are angry at the wrong people!

Well, fair enough – you described your experience, and I described mine. Nothing to say that they aren't both equally valid. Yes, there are problem families who fight and drink and live like pigs, but there are plenty of people who take a lot of pride in their houses, and are very glad to get somewhere that's not a short-term rental. The one big issue there is with social housing though is the UC/HB/tax credit fraud that goes on – the phantom dad or live-in boyfriend who isn't declared for benefit purposes – that does piss me off, and I know of numerous houses where it goes on.

Older folk should stay if they want. Inheritance tax is the means to redistribute wealth through taxation and benefits.

My dad lives alone in a large 3 bed detached house with 3 reception rooms and a massive garden. He would love to downsize to a 2 bed but hasn't found anything suitable so has decided to stay put. I'd like him to be more comfortable and to have something will suit him for years to come but the lengthy process and costs associated with it have led him to refusing everything but the non-existent perfect place. Maybe if there was some support in place to do this it might be easier?

This happened to my mum's house . Gorgeous garden house well looked after inside and out . I can't even walk past it now it's too upsetting. Who ever is in there now well they are fucking animals and that is an insult to animals ! Full bin bags piled high in the front garden all down the side of the house, shit and junk everywhere Christ knows what the inside is like .

It's interesting to me how emotional people are about their houses. I've lived in my current house for 20 years but I'd move on quite happily if I found somewhere I wanted to move to and could afford (and, in the current market, could sell it at all!)

I am not attached to it at all, it's just a roof over my head in a decent area.

'This happened to my mum's house . Gorgeous garden house well looked after inside and out . I can't even walk past it now it's too upsetting. Who ever is in there now well they are fucking animals and that is an insult to animals ! Full bin bags piled high in the front garden all down the side of the house, shit and junk everywhere Christ knows what the inside is like.'

That is deeply annoying. Years ago the council authorities where I am did annual inspections of council houses and gave the tenant a rocket if it was neglected or there was any damage. I think the rules around council tenancies used to be far stricter. They seem to have given up now.

Nora who is 78 should be not rattling round a 4 bedroom social housing dwelling on her own. She doesn't own it, her kids are gone and there are 3 bedrooms falling into disrepair and a huge garden she cannot namage. Nora SHOULD be moved into a smaller place that suits her needs and let a young family start the cycle again.

But NORA will not be offered a lovely little bungalow by the council will she? NORA will be chucked out on her ear and expected to find a shitty little insecure private let flat. Or a private let bungalow (if she can find one!)

Let the 'young family' get a private let! Why do their needs trump Nora's? This is Nora's home. With all her memories. And possessions.

This young family chose to have kids with no secure housing in place. How stupid is THAT? So because of their poor life choices and irresponsibility - NORA has to chuck half her life on the skip, and live in a private let dump with no security of tenure? Yeah fuck that! The family made their bed, they can lie in it.

You sound bitter and angry. Are you struggling to get social housing? Or are you struggling to pay the ever increasing mortgage payments and for the repairs on your house? OR have you got a daughter or son (or other family member) with kids who can't get social housing because 'all the old people are hogging them?' 🙄

It's one of those 3. THAT'S for sure!

I despair.

Some people (especially those who want social housing, and people who are buying a home) seem to think this... that people who haven't got kids at home anymore should give up their 3 bed houses for a 'family in need.' As has been asked before, where are these people supposed to go?

The amount of decent one-bed social housing properties is minuscule, as is the amount of bungalows. Bungalows are as rare as Hen's teeth. Nobody really moves out of them unless they die, and they very, very rarely come up. If you go on the housing list, when there's a nice, decent 1 to 2 bed bungalow on the there, you'll get 150 to 200 people going for it ... every single time. In some authorities, you'll probably get 400 to 500 going for it.

Moreover, maybe no-one WANTS a one bed anyway. Many people, after many many decades will have tons of stuff.. Memories, collectibles, family heirlooms, collections of things they had when they had a hobby, photos, old stuff from their childhood, stuff their parents owned, stuff from their childrens childhoods, holiday memorabilia, valuable (and sentimental value) ornaments etc etc.. Along with DVDs, CDs, Vinyl, video games, books, and all their furniture and white goods... Where are they meant to put it all? On the skip? So they can make way for 'another family?' Dump 50 to 80 years of memories or more on the skip?

It seems that the people who think that folk should move out of their three bed properties (to make way for them) are assuming they should go for some shitty one or two bed private let property with extortionate rent and absolutely no security of tenure. So I'll ask you this, why don't you go for these shitty private let properties with no security of tenure?! Why should your need trump this other person? Just coz they got perhaps one or two extra bedrooms? Why should they give you THEIR home and languish in a private let? Why don't YOU get a private let?

Also, as I said, how stupid does someone have to be to have children when they have no secure housing? Seems to me like SOME people have children, when they have no secure housing in place, in the hope they will be allocated social housing. YEAH don't try and deny THIS either. Happens every fucking day!!!

Why don't you - as I said before - blame the councils, the authorities, and the government for this ... not the people who are sitting in a house with one or two extra bedrooms, that's been their home for the last 50, or 60 years or more. With everything they own in it, and all their memories? And room for their grandkids to stay?

No way should they move for your convenience. Maybe... if the councils could offer them a lovely little bungalow in a similar area with another permanent tenancy and affordable rent, only five or 10 minutes walk away from their old house and everything they know then yeah... But they never do do they? They boot them out - and expect them to find their own place ... And there's just nothing there, except shitty insecure private let, and even THEY are becoming hard to get now, with each property having 25 to 30 people going for them!

SO... Where are they supposed to go? Like fuck should they move out because someone made poor life choices, and wasn't responsible enough to get secure housing before bringing children into the world!

This young family chose to have kids with no secure housing in place. How stupid is THAT?

Did Nora do the same when she was given a council house in the first place?
WHY should Nora have a 4 bedroom house GIVEN to her by the council 50 years ago and stay in it when she only uses 1 bedroom? This is NOT Nora's home, she doesn't own it, the council does.

The only thing I will agree on is that there is a lack of suitable housing for Nora but maybe she could do a swap to a 2 bed that larger families are cramped into.

I don't fall into any of the categories you mentioned, not even close.

Moreover, maybe no-one WANTS a one bed anyway. Many people, after many many decades will have tons of stuff.. Memories, collectibles, family heirlooms, collections of things they had when they had a hobby, photos, old stuff from their childhood, stuff their parents owned, stuff from their childrens childhoods, holiday memorabilia, valuable (and sentimental value) ornaments etc etc.. Along with DVDs, CDs, Vinyl, video games, books, and all their furniture and white goods... Where are they meant to put it all? On the skip? So they can make way for 'another family?' Dump 50 to 80 years of memories or more on the skip?

Nora should have bought her own house then or privately rented like you want the larger families to do.

@changeyerheadworzel

WTAF are you banging on about?

Time for your bed I think. You're over tired.

And yeah you absolutely ARE one of the 3 categories I mentioned. You wouldn't be so salty and wound up about all this if you weren't.

Now night night, don't let the bedbugs bite. Go and dream about fictional NORA and her lovely big 4 bed council house, and all the lovely OLD people 'rattling' around in their massive over sized homes with LOADs of bedrooms.. Ooooooh those evil individuals. Mwah ha ha ha ha ha. 😆