To be raging - school holiday camp

[peoniesandpumpkins]

Booked my DC into the holiday camp at our local tennis club. They’ve just turned the age that you can go from but it’s just 3.5 hrs (they do pre school 2 days 9-3 and 3 days 9-1:30 so used to longer days etc.) It’s not all tennis, lots of games.

They have absolutely loved it. Been twice now. My mum picked up last week (she knows a lot of the coaching team) and they mentioned he’d been great, my mum asked about the toilet and they mentioned ‘oh yes they know where the toilet is’ ‘jokingly’ apparently. We took that to mean they’d been going quite a lot, but at least not peed themselves!! Husband picked up on Mon, great time again. Due to go tomorrow, really excited!

Logged onto work email (not personal) tonight to see an email from organiser sent at 8:43PM saying ‘sorry but don’t think peonies child is really ready for 3.5 hrs of tennis (it’s not 3.5 hrs of tennis) they are more interested in going to the toilet and this impacts on the coaching team’

Honestly, I do know that they can be a little bugger for wanting to go off to loo if they think they can go have a nosey/explore and get away with it. I apologised said as much but, said they love it and that messaging at 8:40 odd at night (to my work email (wouldn’t have seen it ordinarily) the night before was really not great, would they please let me have a chat, let them come tomorrow (really left me in the f’ing lurch) and if more of same then I understand.

They emailed back to say it’s a no as a member of staff has to take them to the toilet each time. I am confused about this as they normally have to be told to go toilet (unless opportunity for boggling - which they wouldn’t get if they have to go with an adult), so I’m like well yes I understand that and that is annoying but I am telling you that I am 98% certain that will stop once I’ve had a word and if it doesn’t then yes I’m in agreement. I just think it’s so shitty not to give them a last chance.

Also I don’t think it’s that they don’t want to have take them to the toilet full stop, as there are 2 children doing it who aren’t quite 5 (one not until the new year) who have been allowed as they have older siblings so surely if it’s an age thing they are having to take them to the loo when they need to go?!? DC quite capable of going on own physically iykwim. Can understand they need to be supervised.

If it was that they weren’t coping/joining in or didn’t have the motor ability then I understand but why not mention that then.

All just seems rather mean not to let us have a chat and give them another chance. Not to mention bloody unprofessional, she could have told me on Monday night or Tuesday night!

Someone phoned in sick/quit, last minute and they are suddenly short staffed - hence the last minute email.

then they’ll be registers with whatever the equivalent is that allows them to take childcare vouchers.
school starting age isn’t relevant - we have kids start tennis at age 3 (as do most other clubs) none of them go to school.

Do you think the club communicated well with the OP? Is this how club professionals communicate concerns with parents?

Why would they need to lie about that and why say the child can never come back?

Of course the coaches might be unable to make it if they are ill but there's no reason to pretend otherwise is there?

No,... I have sent my kids to these sorts of camps for years and NONE have been registered to take childcare vouchers. With an Ofsted equivalent or anyone else. DS is going to a theatre camp thing next week, they cater for children aged 3-18 and the camp is 10 - 4.30 every day. DS is 15 and doesn't need "childcare" but I definitely used it as childcare when he was much smaller. You pay the money to the drama club, no option to take vouchers. Council run multi-sports activity camps - no vouchers.

Similar with the local tennis club, I just checked their website out of interest and they run various sessions - 3 to 5 year olds 9.30 to 11, age 6-8 9.30 to 2, age 9-13 10am to 3pm. Again, no childcare vouchers.

People need to stop confidently proclaiming that things will "definitely" be X or Y and asking why on earth 4 year olds aren't in school. Because - surprise surprise - things are different in Scotland, Wales and N Ireland and probably different between the different English regions too.

And OP, if your kiddo is still up for tennis and you're anywhere near West Glasgow, drop me a PM and I'll pass on details of the local club by us offering sessions. They are still advertising availability on the weeks of 31 July - 4 August, and 7 - 11 August.

This club communicates poorly.

If they take younger ones, they need to be clear about what behaviour they expect.

If a child was fine at the trial and they accepted the payment, then they effectively accepted the child.

If the child’s behaviour could not be accommodated, they needed to call and speak to the parents either that day, or the next day when the child arrived. They should have explained their concerns and either made a plan with the parents about what behaviour they could and couldn’t manage, or be clear that they could no longer take the child. And that they would keep the child for that session but then the child would have to leave and there would be a refund. And if the truth was that the child was actually screaming, being violent and was a huge risk, then of course they would have to leave immediately.

Any company should be able to master basic communication skills with its clients. They made the situation worse by sending last-minute emails. Polite and professional communication saves a business time in the long run.

OP you will have to leave it now. I am sure you don’t want your child somewhere he is not wanted. Maybe another club next year.

Tennis clubs are open and coaching until well in to the evenings (especially in the weeks around Wimbledon as that's when demand peaks)

So they quite possibly emailed (to the address supplied) as soon as they had come off court

They didn't know that OP would have preferred a phone call

As a business telling someone they can’t come the next day they should phone or text to make sure the message had been received - unless they want to risk the person turning up the next day.

Agree that the communication has been awful. Someone could have spoken to the OP or whoever was picking the child up, or called her. Sending a email is shoddy and the cowards option.

If nothing else you phone to cover your own arse! Op could have legitimately not seen the email & just turned up the next day - leaving the coach to have a difficult conversation in front of the child & other parents doing the drop off.

Well exactly.

I really can't believe there are people trying to defend the 9pm email approach. That bit has absolutely nothing to do with the mumsnet childcare or not divide, it's just basic courtesy.

I had a restaurant reservation last month and the restaurant had an unexpected issue and had to close. Readers, even though it WASN'T CHILDCARE and I had full contingency plans for food, they phoned me to make sure I definitely got the message and didn't have a wasted journey. Like a normal business..

The club is really out of order here.

They shouldn't have emailed your work email (so not your primary form of contact) at 8pm the evening before their next session. For starters, terrible customer service, regardless of the reason. Since it was a last minute change/cancellation, they should have tried ringing OP first and following up with an email. The call would be for both their benefits as everyone would know OP was informed so didn't turn up the next day. Secondly, 99% of the time, it's obvious when an email address is a work one and many people do work standard working hours. It was stupid and cowardly of them to not call OP.

Regardless of anything else, if they can't accommodate very young children who behave as such (nothing OP has said has indicated that her DS's behaviour is out of the ordinary), then they shouldn't advertise or accept that age group. Was it perhaps the first year they've tried doing this age group?

Anyway, OP I would want them to speak to me face to face and/or send me their cancellation policy. I would complain as well about the fact they didn't reasonably try to inform you of the change in a reasonable timeframe.

I run a venue and we take bookings for corporates and customers and I would NEVER cancel something this close to the event without calling the organiser/main contact first and following up with an email.

I think the communication and lack of notice is really poor. However I do think you need to just accept that he’s not mature enough to attend yet. Constantly needing the loo age 5 is unusual, I don’t think it’s something the club should have planned for with that age group and I’m not sure I’d want a parent having a word with their child about it as potentially that child is having expectation put on them that they’re just not quite physically/ mentally ready for. Especially if the club is being used for childcare whilst at work. Perhaps they should have just suggested someone attend with him for a day and try and sort it out. Lots of people use that sort of club to give their kids something to do/ try new activities/ socialise. Part days in particular are certainly not just used as childcare

Your child is too young for structured activities for this length of time- he is showing you quite clearly with his behaviour. I’d suggest you listen.

Look it's done. Use it as a learning tool that he has to knock off doing the going to the toilet thing if he doesn't need it. It's normal to want 5o explore but they obviously can't be bothered and obviously can't have him constantly going off.

Remind him of this when he tries it on with you again.

of course she didn’t say it to her face….🙄🙄🙄, and don’t tell me you’re all sweetness and light behind people’s backs!!! Aye right!

The way you wrote the response makes it seem very clear that your mum was speaking to the coach:
told my mum the price (she is a member so that will be fun 😂) and her response was ‘jeeezzo really! Tennis Coach how do you afford to live on xxxxx road (one of the most expensive streets in town) 😂

Maybe you should try to write more clearly and take a moment to read back what you've said before, before attacking people when they misunderstand you.

Also, if you're already so sure that you're not being unreasonable and are prepared to defend your position to the death, then why bother posting?

From your OP and the updates, it sounds like you've been too busy to properly speak face to face to anyone at the club, they've tried to deal with your son as best they can, dropped hints to your mum about his excessive toilet use that have been ignored by all of you, and finally someone higher up has decided that its all too much to bother with.

You draw attention to the fact that the coaches gave positive feedback after your sons sessions, but from what you've said it sounds like the person who sent you the email isn't one of the coaches that you or any family members have come into contact with? So what those individual coaches said seems irrelevant. It may be that other coaches have said something to the manager, perhaps after complaints from other parents as a PP suggested, and shes taken this decision. I feel like you need to accept that your child isn't as manageable as you think and just let this one go. And for goodness sake sort out this habit he has of pretending to go to the loo whenever he fancies 'nosying around.' Would be do that in someone's house? He sounds like a handful and I wouldn't be surprised if these things keep happening to you if you don't sort it.

It sounds to me like they're intentionally getting everything in writing, as they didn't take her H's call then messaged in response.

I would hazard a guess that there's good reason they chose to communicate in that way.

Can you explain what that reason is?

They are extremely foolish for choosing to do this. There was a high chance the OP wouldn't see the email and drop the child off - they wouldn't then have been able to avoid a conversation

@sweepleall I'd guess that things have been miscommunicated between the caregivers.

You'll note that OP didn't hear about the 'rockstar' comment until today; only the negative stuff, so they may well be fairly difficult people to communicate with and they don't want their words twisted or misconstrued.

All those saying your child is top young for this...these considerations should have been taken into account by the organisation when agreeing the age they would start from. If they can't be bothered to do these things with children then they shouldn't offer to newly toilet trained children, and they should also make it clear to the children when toilet time is, and make exceptions accordingly. They should also talk to you about the problems and work with you to come to a solution, not just say "your child's toileting habits are annoying, we don't want them here anymore" which is essentially what they have said. YANBU

But why would you risk them not getting the message at all?

And there's the fairly obvious option of both phoning and then following up with an email.

@sweepleall if the OP gave the email address as her first emergency contact she should have regular access to it. That's her oversight.

I am sure they will have had a phone number as well. If not, that's their oversight

@sweepleall they clearly didn't want to speak to her over the phone. That's the point.

My point is that is deeply unprofessional when you have an urgent message