Compassionate leave, is employer BU?

[Penguinmode]

DH parent is ill in hospital and he has had to return to his home country to look after them. They are in intensive care and have been now for 3 weeks the outlook is not really know yet.

His employer has given 2 weeks paid compassionate leave and another emergency day, he also had annual leave to use so is taking this currently. They’ve now let us know that he will need to start taking unpaid leave soon. He can’t work from abroad.

WIBU here? DH thinks they should continue to pay the compassionate leave as we are going to struggle on one salary and he can’t leave his parent. But I think his employer has been pretty generous already although it’s going to leave us in a mess and I think he should think about returning home.

For how long does your DH think they should give him paid leave?

Is he an only child

2 weeks is very generous. Our company only allows 5 days paid. Anything further must be taken as annual leave or unpaid.

I'm aghast at the comments that being signed off sick in this type of situation is abusing the system.

Stress is not necessarily work related - in fact in HR terms work related stress is a very specific condition. I was signed off (for the first time in 25+ years of my career, as it happens) with family stress in a similar situation. Unfortunately I think that approaching a doctor for a fit note is the only sensible solution here. However I would caveat that with the comment that unfortunately moving far away from relatives means that this situation is a much more difficult one to face and the reality is you might have to accept less time away from work as the consequence. I'm not saying that is "right" but it is unfortunately the reality - whereas one day off for a funeral is seen by many employers as reasonable, 3 days for the same funeral may appear less so.

My son was in hospital for 2 weeks after a freak accident my work were amazing

I got a week off compassionate leave and one week unpaid

your h is not being unfairly treated

It’s incredibly generous. I got one day for the funeral when my dad died.

Agree with op, his employer has been more than generous but I can understand him not wanting to leave. What is the prognosis for your in-law?

Two weeks paid is very generous.

But you wouldn't expect your clients to pay you while you were there, would you?

His employer hasn't said he must come back to work - they've said it'll be unpaid. Which is fair enough imo.

Your clients understood but did they pay you for the work you weren’t doing?
The reason I compared with self employment is that we are all different and I think an employee should take sick leave in a situation where if self employed they wouldn’t work.
If my DH was in ICU, I wouldn’t be able to work, likely for weeks. When my dad was in ICU, after a year punctuate by health issues I was able to work and as much as I would have wanted to be there all the time I felt it was unfair to say to my work I would’t attend but expected to be paid as it would have been a choice (he was abroad as well, I travelled back and forth at weekends)

Not saying everybody would feel the same about their dad being in ICU, my point is: if you are unable to work, yes sick leave, but not if you are able to but would prefer not.

Would he be paid if off sick? He might need to speak with his GP though and have a telephone consultation.

How long is he prepared to stay there?

He will have to take unpaid leave. He should not come home. You can always make more money, you don’t get a second chance to be with a parent during end of life and when they die. Abandoning a parent during their last days would be horrible.

this happened in my family last year. My sister in law went aboard as her mother was dying. They had said it would be a week. It turned out to be seven weeks until she died. Was it a hardship for my brother - absolutely. But I can’t imagine him ever telling her she needed to come
home and leave her mother. She would never have forgiven him to not be with her mother until the end.

Just a thought that came to me later... my employers do not accept sick notes if the employee is out of the country unless the employee is physically unable to return to the UK (and they must prove that). That is, apparently, lawful. I guess for fairly obvious reasons. If he decides to go down that route his employer might equally refuse to accept a sick note from a doctor abroad and require him to return to the UK. He can't exactly say that he is too stressed to get on a plane.

I know posters have jumped on this, but I agree

I get it's stressful but if he was needing singed off for stress, why wait until compassionate leave and annual leave are exhausted.

You either get company sick pay or statutory (ssp) on the 4th consecutive day of sickness onwards.

It's sometimes suggested by the company and is not 'abusing' sick pay as many people can't work under that level of stress and grief.

We don't know how it has developed. Maybe he wasn't expecting it to be this long
And if the job comes with paid sick leave and he is under so much stress that he can't work then absolutely he should do it. It's what it's there for.

Two weeks is decent.

He could try and negotiate another week on the grounds they are abroad and more stuff to sort out.. it’s worth a go.

But otherwise of course either he comes back or goes onto unpaid leave.

It was a very sudden illness that we couldn’t have planned for. I don’t want to say specifically which country as it’s outing but it’s an Asian country where the whole family would be expected to be by the bedside. I think he will speak to his HR about taking sick leave, his company sick pay is good around 6 months on full pay.

I think an additional week or so away would be ok, but I don’t think it’s ok to go sick for months because you’re part of a family group sitting in hospital.

Is there no prognosis?

It's hard but he isn't sick is he and is sort of abusing the company policy.....

You can’t just go sick though. He will need to go to the doctor to be signed off. The six months is in place for those who are signed off, it’s not just something you can decide for yourself, surely?

It’s standard, your dh’s employer is generous!

DH’s mum died and he had a week compassionate leave during which I got diagnosed with cervical cancer! They said no initially to further paid leave when I had the surgery but agreed another week after union got involved. He then used annual leave to care for the boys. Dh has been with the company 30 years at that point.

He can only self certify for a week. After that he would need a GP “fit note” to say that the illness of his parent is causing such stress or anxiety that it is impacting his health, making him unfit for work.

The GP may be willing to do this via phone call or a consultation, if you’re lucky.

Otherwise, I agree with you and most of the other posters that his employer has already been really generous. I’m known for being generous with this sort of thing, but I would not pay for any more absence unless it came out of annual leave. I would also want the GP to confirm that his health is being impacted due to the condition of his parent. We are quite strict about not allowing sick leave when family members are sick.

I wasn't arguing that it should be paid, though

PP said it would be dishonest to take time off sick for this - I was saying it would be perfectly okay to get signed off sick. If that's SSP/unpaid then fair enough.

Your H employer have been very generous

He is not sick so sick leave is not appropriate

If there is no option to work from home then it will likely be unpaid leave