That two parents working doesn’t work

[Itsmyshadow]

We have 3 DCs aged 8, 4 and 1. DH works full time. I have recently returned from mat leave doing 4 days per week. On my day off I have DC4 and DC1 at home and a large part of that is taken up with swimming lessons.

I feel like I’m failing at everything to be honest. House is a state, am not on top of my work, kids in nursery and after school club for long hours, and don’t even get me started on the amount of after school sporting activities DC1 does which don’t really fit with going to work.

DH is a great dad, does his fair share with the kids, does 50% of the school / nursery runs, and most of DC1’s after school sporting stuff (whilst I have the younger two). He could pull his weight a bit more with the housework but gets off his bottom when I huff and puff / nag, and does all of the DIY and garden. Like most women I carry the mental load, doing all the school, nursery, medical admin etc.

I feel like I need to do a real half arsed job of my work on my wfh days to keep on top of the washing / house / kid admin / kid homework (saw a thread on here the other day about that), but workload / conscience won’t let me do that, and that doesn’t solve for the fact that DC1 has football at 5:30 on a Tuesday or hockey at 6pm on a Wednesday and if I finish at 5pm and I’m in the office, those timings don’t work.

We have a cleaner and a robot vacuum, but I still can’t keep on top of all the crap all around the house (paintings from nursery, party bag loot, paper admin that needs addressing, magazines etc), and feel like the kids get given toys / grow out of clothes much faster than I can get sort through the old ones. Result is a massive mess of a playroom that I keep getting half through sorting before the kids mess it up again and there’s nowhere for everything to go.

Don’t talk to me about TOMM or similar. I’m not lacking motivation or direction. I spend hours per week washing and putting away clothes, batch cooking, sorting through piles of stuff, firefighting cleaning tasks (usually when something mouldy is discovered or someone has spilt something somewhere), but no sooner is something done it’s a complete mess again.

So those of you who work a lot of hours and have young kids. How are you managing? Do you spend hours every evening cooking and cleaning (how do you find the energy if so?), and how to you manage the demands of kids after school activities / social lives?

Of course not but it is a reason why OP finds it hard and a reason why some others with 1-2 children will find it easier.

There's just too much to do. Accept that you are both doing the best you can, it won't be for ever, and make things as simple and streamlined as you can even if that means compromising on how you would prefer to do some things. There's a lot to be said for doing some relaxing before the chores.

It'd probably be easier if dad stayed at home or at least went part time.
You don't need to stay on top of housework - let him do it.
You have 4 kids, not 3. You are mothering your man.

Yes, exactly this, OP, it's a bit mad that your day at home is largely taken up by swimming lessons. You need to prune your DCs' sporting activities to something that fits with your schedule.

DH and I both work in demanding FT jobs that aren't 9 to 5,, and we had one child by choice to make it workable. I get that you can't disinvent your two younger children -- I'm just giving it as an example of how two careers involve pruning things somehow, whether that's number of children, or what activities they do.

Personally if I were in your situation I'd ask my DH to drop to 4 days a week as well and for three long-ish days employ a nanny/housekeeper, who will do a lot of the 'keeping on top of the house' stuff and the running around with the DC on those days they're working.

I found it got a bit easier when they were all at school.

If you work full time, there is no cleaning and minimal cooking. Kids social lives happen in wraparound care. Football practice can be got rid of. Dad can go part time.

This. Stop talking about iit as though your salary is responsible for childcare.

If a nanny is not for you that's perfectly valid but you could also have one a day a week. Lots of parents do work 3/4 days a week and it's difficult for a nanny to fill the extra day. Someone who is doing a bit of entertaining your soon to be toddler, who will sort through the toys etc is a godsend.

You have taken a 20% pay cut and are doing the same job. Go back to work 5 days and use the extra cash to make your life easier.

It's hard. Most of us couldn't manage with a strong family support. It's the constant string of days off/ strike/ election days/ half term/ end of term breaks that is a killer. People manage with summer camps etc, but no family support makes it honestly hellish.

Clashing schedules work when you beg other parents and friends for lift/ in exchange for lift back.

Honestly, to keep on top, is to make a decision and sacrifice an entire week - ideally when kids are away with family and just do the mother of all declutter. That annual leave you lose cough sick days if you can get away with them

I promise you the TOOM etc techniques work because staying on top of things is not that hard. Pushing yourself to these 15mn at night and never going to bed in a messy house makes a whole world of difference. But it's being ruthless and consistent.

Forcing yourself to do it EVERY DAY a very little bit but knowing that you are freeing your weekend, and maybe going for a swim or zumba once or twice a week is life changing.

The kid admin is not a big deal if you are again consistent.

I wouldn't manage if I was a single mother, I rely on having 2 adults at home, and one who can stay home with the kids. I never feel worst than slumbing on the sofa, stressed about the mess, stress about everything, but if I go for a run or a spin bike class, I sleep better and I have my sanity back.

The most important thing is that DH and I work as a team and split all child/household chores except if outsourced. We also:

• insist on DC getting dressed before breakfast, and then that they do teeth and so on before any playing;
• now have a cleaner for two hours a week (we did this ourselves until a few weeks ago but it meant we couldn’t go away for weekends easily because the house would be dirty);
• decide what we are eating a week ahead, write up a menu and allocate food that’s quicker to prepare to the nights we get in later;
• get a grocery delivery once a week;
• have DC in wraparound care; and
• feed DC with cold food in the evenings because they have a hot lunch at school;
• do a wash most nights.

I think OP means the household pot. Whatever way you look at it, if the childcare bill is more than the lower wage out of the pair of them, does the family need that person to be out earning right now? If they need the extra cash maybe they will have to look for jobs with alternating shifts so no childcare cost, but to spend more than one wage on childcare makes no sense

I hear you. Both me and DP work full time. House is always a tip. Constantly behind on everything admin wise! Never enough hours in the day. Sorry no help, but I can totally empathise 😵‍💫

Agree completely. I work ten hours a wk , dh is full time. My house looks pretty good but I spend 2-3 hours every day keeping on top of it (I don't enjoy it but I want it to look good) so my week consists of-
Cleaning - 13 hours
Dog walking - 8 hours
Work - 12 hours (inc commute)
Caring for elderly parent - 3 hours
Child care 17.5 hours (just the time dh is out of house)
Exercise- 3 hours
Total hours = 56.6

I'm in a similar position op and it's a fucking nightmare. We have an 8 year old and a 2 year old and both work full time. We have no extended family around. I have no idea how you do it with 3!

I work compressed hours which saves on nursery fees but it's bloody exhausting and makes my job harder.

I'm absolutely exhausted. On a week day, I never get more than 6 hours sleep. Dh and I never get time together without the kids, and very little time to ourselves.

I do think long term needs to be considered as well as short term.

Childcare fees are expensive but how expensive would it be compared to losing someone's earning potential for 4-5 years? Would they ever be able to earn what they did before?

What about career progression? How much would be lost during 4-5 years? A potential promotion? Any bonuses?

Pension is also something to consider.

All potential financial losses which could end up costing more long term than short term childcare fees.

I only have two children (now 8 & 11) but similar challenges OP. I work in the office every day but work 8 - 2. DH does drop off at breakfast club. DS is a talented racket sport player and add a dancer and I do a lot of ferrying to activities.

Are you able to share any of the drop offs and pick ups with other parents?With the academy if you could find another parent you could do every other week and if other clubs are local and you have another parent nearby offer to either drop off or pick up. I gain about an hour and half each week by doing this.

Can DH take all 3 out on a weekend to DD's activity or for the afternoon so you can get things done in the house?

I think you'll always feel like you are not doing a great job at anything because you are always worrying about the next thing of the day but if you can carve out some windows of time to tackle a few things you might feel better.

I barely keep afloat, TBH. We both work full time, the house is a pigsty, we spend the whole time rushing about shouting at each other and/or dumping the kids in front of the TV. It's not working. I don't have enough headspace to dedicate to work, I don't give my kids enough attention, and the housekeeping just doesn't happen. I am reluctant to reduce my hours at work because I can see I would end up doing five days of stuff but be paid for four, and then I would be landed with all the chores on top of all the mental load. And although I went PT for a while, we're not married so it feels risky. At the moment I'm just bumbling along, feeling guilt and sadness that the children's childhoods are passing day by day without them getting much of anything from me.

My house looks pretty good but I spend 2-3 hours every day keeping on top of it

how many children do you have? 2-3 hours a day is nuts! WHO is making that much mess that it takes you that long every day?

100% this.

Have only one DD aged 1 and this is part of the reason I don’t want more. As it is our house is always a mess and I just deal with some of it whenever I have energy, usually do dishwasher and a load of washing on my lunch break whilst WFH. Incredible MIL looks after our DD on a Friday and cleans the kitchen for us while DD naps so that we have a clean kitchen at least for the weekend, we are really lucky in that respect. I could clean all evening and during DD’s nap time on days she is with me but I need that time to relax, I prefer to try and do small amounts of tidying or cleaning while she’s awake and otherwise getting out as much as we can so that less mess is generated.

DH is good in many ways but doesn’t see mess, we got back from a holiday a week ago and my clothes have at least been taken from my suitcase, washed and put in a pile and my suitcase put away, DH’s case is still in the kitchen. I don’t do his laundry any more and the case may still be there at Christmas but annoying as it is I won’t be moving it. He does at least deal with the robot vaccum in the lounge ( emptying etc), does some garden maintenance, all the driving, all the sorting of bills, sorts any IT or home maintenance issues, does half the childcare and usually takes the bin down when he remembers but I do still feel a lot falls to me.

Just here to say I TOTALLY understand. I don't have any good advice though. Honestly feel like I'm drowning. Have a 4 year old and 1 year old...both at nursery 4 days a week. I recently went back from mat leave 4 days a week and have both kids on my day off. House is constantly a mess and I hate it. Work long hours (lawyer). Definitely cannot afford to not work. Have a cleaner but it's a mess within 24 hours. Feel like I'm not as relaxed and present with the children as I'd like to be as it's all pretty overwhelming!

It is tough, yes. I have a 4 and 1 year old and work 4 days a week but office based with an hours commute each way. I’m out of the house 7am - 5:15pm. DH works full time but does get to WFH one day a week.

Eldest is in reception and youngest in nursery. DH does drop off so I can start work earlier and I do the pick up. We have to use breakfast and after school club but that means that the kids eat out of the home so we don’t have to worry about their meals most days. Or if they do need feeding we keep it simple with sandwiches, etc and they can have a cooked meal at lunch at school or nursery. For us, we batch cook or eat quick meals in the week (stir fry’s etc). Pre kids I would have turned my nose up at ready meals but we do use these sometimes too.

We don’t do any activities in the week, it simply doesn’t work at the minute as the kids are tired and need to go to bed early as they’re up early the next day. Swimming lessons and football class happen on Saturday and Sunday mornings. This might change as they get older and need less sleep.

We don’t have a cleaner so I clean on a Saturday morning for a couple of hours whilst DH takes kids out. Standards much lower than pre kids but do a deeper clean every 6 months when DH takes over all childcare for a weekend or two.

After kids in bed, I stick a quick wash on and hang up to dry, empty their bags and get ready for the next day, get rid of any unwanted paperwork and reply to anything that needs a response straight away.

The best thing I have done is to take a day off whilst the kids are in childcare/ school now and again to get on top of the “extra” jobs like sorting out their wardrobes with outgrown clothes or having a toy clearout, or just an all over decluttering. If I can do this every few months it helps me feel on top of things.

We have decided against a third child because we are already stretched with the two we have and don’t think adding a third into the mix would be in anyone’s best interest. I’d love not to work, but I also value my independence and I do have a decent job that I worked hard for. I can’t reduce my hours further, I’ve been lucky to get the 4 days as it is and even though that means I am effectively cramming 5 days work into 4, I wouldn’t give it up for anything. It’s worth it to be able to take my eldest to school once a week and spend a day with my youngest. And I try to remember that it won’t be this way forever. Before we know it they will be grown 🙂

4 and 1 year olds do not "need" swimming lessons, mine didn't learn until 8.

I disagree. They might not "need" sport club everyday, even if most kids are much more enjoyable when they spend enough energy, but swimming is not a luxury. Of all the things to get rid off, I wouldn't put swimming for a 4 year old - even a 1 year old frankly.

@SouthLondonMum22 I get that but if you take into account unpaid time off work to care for sick kids because you need to save your leave for school holidays, plus paying nursery despite the sick child not going, and still having to pay childcare in the holidays for three children when you've both used all your leave, you can see why some families just can't make ends meet, regardless of whether it damages career progression or pension amount

Sorry that should read DD is a dancer.

Lower your standards (further if necessary) and pay for more help. Make sure your DH shares the load. I think you’re doing the right thing not going further part time but it’s hard and I take my hat off to you 😀