AIBU to say private school children are much sportier & better musicians?

[Denimrevival]

Just on the back of comparing with friends & family with dc in private schools. The kids & their families are all naturally sporty & outdoorsy anyways but the school provides a vast range of sports with it's own pool & swim team.
Musically their kids all play 2 or three instruments all at least grade 4 or 5..
How do these private schools do the academics, music & sports to such a high standard? Do they also have a very good base if the kids are having sport & music reinforced outside school through their families lifestyles?

Who's going to stop it? You? Bad luck. She's just graduated with a first and gone into the NHS, so you'll probably benefit from the decision somewhere down the line.

They don’t do it in school. They do most of it out of school and the school takes the credit.

Comes down to the parents mostly.

I think that's a bit of an assumption. I live round the corner from a prep school - I live in the home counties. I feel pretty confident in saying that I'm not sure there would be much of an exposure to 'the arts' in many of those households😅

What about people who go to private school that experience unconscious (or conscious) bias because of the race, sex, sexuality etc in all aspects of life?

Does a white, straight, male from a state school in a middle-class area with engaged and financially comfortable parents from a happy family life have more relevant life experience than a non-white, female, gay student that went to private school?

Some of the generalisation and inverse snobbery on this thread beggars belief.
I went to a state school.

I would like to do away with private schools.
Not because I begrudge the children there those opportunities but because I feel really strongly that all kids deserve those opportunities. I’d love to think that not having private school would throw some more opportunities open for all the rest (I know, cloud cuckoo land..)

I hate the fact that we are scrabbling round trying to stick work in with no functioning glue sticks because we can’t afford any, while the school down the road is offering instrument lessons and swimming lessons as standard.
The children in my class don’t deserve the dregs of what is left, they deserve the best. All the more so because some of them have not had a good start.

I don’t hate kids going to private schools as such. I hate that I can’t give the same opportunity to every child because they all deserve it, not just a select few.

Are those at private school better than the children I’ve got? Inherently, no. They aren’t. But with all the extras mine haven’t had? Yes, they probably are now. Because they grew up going to clubs and lessons. Not sitting quietly in a corner of someone else’s house because mum is a cleaner and had no one to leave them with. Or looking after three younger brothers every night. Or not reading because mum can’t read and so can’t help. My children are the bees knees but it’s stacked against them and I really feel the unfairness when I see kids who already have a lot going for them getting far better chances than my lot.

Rant over!

I don't think it really matters what the sport is.

If it's to increase fitness/stamina/skill, help you to learn to win and lose gracefully, work as a team, not give up, help you to think strategically in a high pressure environment etc. then you can get that equally well from lacrosse or football.

I think it's partly about expectations.

My DC went to a school where all children in year 3 were asked which instrument they would like to learn, not whether or not they would like to learn a musical instrument. The local music shop, which hired instruments, would bring in a selection for the children to try, which led to custom for them. There was a charity that subsidised families who couldn't afford the rental and even lessons, but there were group lessons, in school, which kept the costs down. The school had several orchestras to suit all abilities and any instrument-playing parents were asked to help. It was wonderful to watch young children concentrating so hard in a performance so that they wouldn't get their part wrong.

This was a state primary.

I am the least sporty and least musical member of my comprehensively schooled family and I have grade 4 on one instrument and grade 5 on another and swam for my county. People are just different.

I don’t think that privately educated children are necessarily naturally better at sport and music, but they have more opportunity to become good if they have have natural talent. For example, at private primaries children often have specialist music and sports teachers even at pre-school/reception level. Natural talent will be spotted thanks to small class sizes, and parents will often have the resources and drive to encourage that talent.

Private schools, certainly at secondary level, have many more hours per week dedicated to music and sport. Around 8 hours of timetabled sport per week wouldn’t be unusual, including Saturdays. Pupils will often do additional training on top of that. Not everyone at private school will be sporty or musical, but any hint of talent will be encouraged. State schools don’t have as much time or resources, so potentially talented children will go unnoticed.

Private schools often have better sports facilities too which obviously helps.

I’d love to think that not having private school would throw some more opportunities open for all the rest (I know, cloud cuckoo land..)

Babybythesea what sort of opportunities would come about if private schools were abolished?

Mine aren’t either sporty or particularly musical - but then I’m not either. I do see that there’s a lot more opportunity if you show any hint of skill though - the sports teams travel around the county playing other similar schools every week and there’s all the resources for music.

I know it’s not fair (but, obviously as my children go to one) I don’t think shutting private schools is the answer - bringing state schools up to the same level so there’s no advantage should be the aim. (And yes, I’d happily pay more tax to help with that).

My dc is at a good level because I am able to send him to lessons and have done since he was 5 because he was very clear from 4 what he wanted to play and very focused. I don’t have money for private school but I am still fortunate that I can send my children to extra activities. I have noticed a lot of the children who are on group courses my ds has attends attend private school. It’s about opportunities and music should be more accessible.

If the child is totally without talent no amount of tutoring can make them shine no matter how much money you throw at it

@mewkins I am one such parent with a dc at a prep in the Home Counties. Our entire cohort are well advanced of the average local parent and the prep parents know exactly what their dc will be doing with regards to learning instruments etc before they even start school. The school also likes to take a lot of credit for outside efforts too. Our dc learn instruments and train for sports outside of school on top of what the school offers. Schools likes to make them the poster dc for their school. This is our second prep. They were both the same in that matter. What you see in the schools PR brochure is more representative of parents efforts generally.

@babybythesea I'm interested how shutting private schools will help those in state schools play instruments or do more sports?

Actually, I'm afraid the 7% figure is the percentage of children in Britain that got to private school so, yes, that include those on Bursaries and as well all know those are handed out like candy and cover all the fees?? So yes, if you got to private school however 'average' your income is, private school is not accessible to or is not accessed by 93% of the country- are a majority of these people loaded but choice not to do the best for their children.

Some of these arguments are laughable, going to great lengths to point out how disadvantaged the poor private school children are. If you go to one of the biggest comprehensives in the country and it is south London, yes, regardless of your middle class credentials, believe me you very much do experience 'real life'. Anyone who can argue that the private pupils are the poor unfortunates and life is going to be more challenging than attendance at a huge London Comp is deluded and has evidently only ever known privilege.

More opportunities and often great facilities

then more teachers who just teach those subjects

money can make talent

I think family can be just as impactful as school tbh. I went to a state school - played 4 instruments; played sports both inside and outside of school; attended dance classes; and volunteered in the community.
Our friends' DCs are in state school. Both had represented their country (junior teams) in their chosen sports by age 14.

Oh and the only professional orchestral musicians I know, also attended state schools.

I don’t think anyone is saying you do not have exceptionally talented In state school

in private school the average child the facilities, small classes, more teachers, schools not having to deal with disruptive pupils that impacts classes allows for children to more likely reach their potential

*talented children in state school

The OP did say private school pupils were sportier and more musical. That was exactly their point.

Its also inate. I am a prof singer. I sounded like a prof singer long before I had ever had a singing lesson ( to non experts at least). I also teach singing.

Lessons can't give you a voice or musicality they simply refine what you already have.

However with respect to the OP, music and sporting success in school is largely due to opportunity, expectation and quality tuition.
State schools will have the same proportion of kids with potential talent. They just won't have the same opportunities to develop their talent. They might even go through school and nobody ever notices their spark.

Makes me angry really.

Nah I think it's the parents in most cases. I'm a musician by trade, starting piano lessons after school age 6, was in an orchestra throughout primary playing flute too, then also had violin lessons. Went state school initially.. it was funded and supported by my parents. Once my school saw it, the state school funded and brought in a teacher on my lunch breaks.

I almost quit many times but my family encouraged it, they wanted my brother and I to have a hobby.

I had a family friend who went to a top private school and he completely flunked. Point blank refused to engage.

You can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink.

Having supportive parents is a deal breaker alongside a child that wants to do it. Not all children will engage themselves, depends where their interest rests.

Plus I find state schools all so different. There is one notorious around where I live for bullying, it's still rife now 30 years on.. but then I've seen some state schools that have a pool and facilities. Likewise with private, there are some amazing ones and some awful ones.

Well, if she was capable of getting a first, she was capable of getting into a decent university without a lower offer due to being good at clay-pigeon shooting, or whatever. So, we’re good to do away with lower grade offers based on one’s ability to, say, get a horse to jump over some stuff.