To want to escape the ghetto

[N15]

I have name changed for this for obvious reasons.

I live in a part of London that has long resisted gentrification, and has a stubbornly high (and rising) crime rate. Stabbings, and even shootings, are far too common. Neighbours have witnessed shootings, with their children. The local secondaries are seen as finishing schools for criminals, with a lot of gang involvement, and knives carried around.

I really worry about my children when they reach secondary school age. I would sooner home school than send them to the local secondaries, but I don't have the ability to home school due to working. I work as a junior doctor, but the wages are low, especially for London.

Any suggestions for an area with decent schools that doesn't break the bank? I would need 4+ bedrooms. Even open to buying land and building, anything to escape.

The op may not be exaggerating about her current area but the claim below that no one would live anywhere £1m could buy is crazy

There’s loads of places

the only park I know in Turnpike Lane is Ducketts Common (for those who don't know the area, not as big as it sounds) - not that surely? Used to live in a road off it. It and Turnpike Lane was OK then,

I haven’t read the whole thread, so don’t know if this has already been mentioned, but there are lots of 4 bed houses in the “Harringay Ladder” in your price range.

eg. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/136496630#/?channel=RES_BUY

This is very popular with families but perhaps too close to where you already are, so you may have issues with schools if you aren’t keen on your current ones.

Would grammars (eg. Latymer) or scholarships/ bursaries be an option for your children?

OP I'd make a decision on these two options first

Would I prefer to be a GP anywhere in the country and have a beautiful home in a beautiful place, because thats quite easily attainable within your budget, you could do it without borrowing much tbf.

Or

Do I want to stay where I am career wise and get the best house / location I can afford in London, which will be a shadow of the other houses available outside London.

I doubt you want to add a big commute to your day.

Welcome to the world of thousands of professionals in St Albans who do just that every day. House next to the station doesn't get you a secondary school catchment. However, marshalswick does get you a 10 minute drive to the station, a leafy area with good secondary schools, 4 bedrooms and a garden within the budget. Which was the brief. Not quite sure why you're starting a fight on this? I'm sure OP is capable of working out whether it's a compromise she's willing to make, since all options will be a compromise.....

I also lived in N15 until very recently, my child was born and raised there. I didn't recognise Tottenham from the OP's original post, although I did wonder if she was referring to Edmonton.

Gentrification is all over N15, can't move for loft conversions and sourdough, but there were still pockets of hideous poverty, much like a lot of London. Good primary schools, lots of green space, loads going on for kids. N17 changing more slowly, but it's happening. Secondary schools definitely still an issue, but there are some amazing committed teachers trying their best. s

We've moved out of London to be closer to family, but there's crime here too, and I generally feel less safe because there are fewer people around. Deprivation exists outside of London and aspirations are very low.

Come to the Midlands we need doctors

We live in Sutton (the Morden side, so not far from the end of the tube line).
We have a 5 bed house that’s under £800k. We are zone 4 :)

As PP above, what about the Harringay Ladder? Particularly the N4 (south) end? Or the Garden Roads opposite? Decent size, excellent transport links: Manor House zone 2/3 Finsbury Park, zone 2 and overground at Haringay Green Lanes and Haringay.... We're there, and the 24 hr nature of the shops and restaurants here make it feel really safe - to me at least.

Commuter option and well under budget - a short walk from Royston station. Nice heath and Cambridge close by for days out and sixth form colleges. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/136566254#/?channel=RES_BUY

Another, within half a mile of the station - you can get a lot of house here, well within budget. Nice to have a garage, particularly for kid's bikes, sports equipment, etc. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/135726569#/?channel=RES_BUY

Gorgeous old house, also within half a mile of the station (for all of the commuter stations, parking is tight if you aren't on the first trains): https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/125450339#/media?channel=RES_BUY&id=media8&ref=photoCollage

I know a mum who walked her children to and from school and to and from their Saturday jobs every single day. Even walked them to and from their A level exams.

She knew her dc were definite gang fodder.

If you want to stay in London for work, look down the East London / Essex end of the Central line. That sort of money will buy you 4+ bedroom there. Some excellent high schools too.

Try Wanstead, Chingford, Woodford, Chigwell. All got really good schools.

Writing off whole areas as crime ridden shitholes and schools as finishing schools for criminals is fucking awful...No school in London is like that, the majority of kids in Tottenham are law abiding and just getting on with it, like the people who live there.

Knife crime in London is actually relatively low in relation to the number of people that live here, and its not the highest neither, the North East and the Midlands beat us. Places like Hampshire like Gosport and if you bring Scotland into the mix, its clear its a poverty problem,

I'm from a poor area of London and yes, poverty breeds crime , but its never the majority, the teachers in OP local area are doing an amazing job, that teachers at my kids Prep school wouldn't probably last a day. They deserve some respect and dignity, especially from a fucking doctor whose meant to have some compassion, I assume they service the local community, and this is what she thinks of them??

Might be in the catchment for APS though, which is a very sought after secondary school.

I'm not denying what you are saying about loft conversions, and even some places to buy sourdough. But that doesn't change the crime, or the secondary situation. Absolutely, there are lots of very dedicated teachers trying their best, but that doesn't stop children getting involved with gangs and stabbings in secondary. Lots of people move away for this reason: schools are often full in the lower years, but numbers drop off dramatically in KS2 as people move out of London prior to secondary, as you did.

4 bed here, about 600k, Leytonstone, around Cann Hall. Most are about 750k though. Good secondary within walking distance.

One is too many and it is far more than that. https://benkinsella.org.uk/knife-crime-statistics/

There are some bad areas outside of London, particularly in some towns in the Midlands, due to County Lines.

As an example you can get something like this in Harrogate for £465k and your daughters (if you have any) could go to Harrogate Ladies College...0.2 miles away! That will be a big culture shock from how you've described where you live now.

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129752084#/?channel=RES_BUY

Your situation sounds really difficult OP! How old are your children, how long do you have before you need to start applying for secondary school places?

I completely agree with you that moving is a priority. I'm not from London but from nearby, and the area you live in makes such a difference in outcomes. I went to a different secondary in a completely different area of our town than my siblings and I am frankly a completely different person from them. The older 2 both struggle with substance abuse and my other brother (i'm the youngest of 4) would have been claimed too had he not managed to get straight young and join the army.

We had nice parents, we had an income higher than most families in the area, but the surroundings and the childrens' peers are just so influential at that age.

@N15 Op, if you went to the commuter town of Royston, your DC have Cambridge within 15 minutes by train. Excellent sixth forms, lots of activities, food options, etc. A lot of house within budget and walkable to the station. I posted some links above.

Apparently Tottenham/Edmonton is the next up and coming place, due to be gentrified.

Probably because of what they've done around the stadium - and trying to turn it into a proper music venue - and the new meridan water development.

Time will tell though.

I am so.looking forward to tomorrow's Daily Mail

"Junior doctor with four children and a one million pound housing budget cannot find a four bedroom house outside a ghetto".

They will likely run it alongside an article about how much North London NHS Trusts have spent on equality & diversity personnel and initiatives in the last two years.

Doctor's/NHS strike/Stephen Lawrence under the spotlight at present, therefore, this thread may be stoking fire rather than genuine if the op has no former posting history.

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/132310862

17 minutes on the train to Tottenham Hale

Areas I’d think of are where I live - but on road my DM is on the nicer houses in Crystal Palace easily creep up to £1 million and over. Good transport links to Kings College hospital, May Day, St George’s etc.

West Norwood as a pp says very popular but pick roads wisely. Schools around there which she mentions are good a neighbours DD in Upper Norwood goes to Kingsdale and so do other local teens. You can also try for scholarships to Jags, Alleyns etc or Old Palace or Whitgift schools in Croydon.

Have you thought about latymer school?