Male victimization / Female perpetration

[Freefall212]

The other thread is rightly not the right place for this conversation but the idea the 99% that men are perpetrators 99% of the time and women are victims 99% of the time is as much a rape myth as any other myth. It confirms a bias and ideology that woman believe is true but isn't supported by actual research. There are many issues in who reports what and how it gets into statistics but when you look at broader population studies, the numbers don't support these 'myths'. That doesn't mean there still isn't gendered violence but the actual statistics are not accurately portrayed in most fact sheet / website style information.

This was a bit of a landmark study from a few years ago in the USA
https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/abs/10.2105/AJPH.2014.301946

Part 2 of it: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1359178916301446

This research has led to hundreds of additional articles.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1097184X16652656?journalCode=jmma
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ab.21482
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1079063213503688?journalCode=saxb

Report on IPV - https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/nisvs/NISVSReportonIPV_2022.pdf

Even this research on desire shows how gendered social norms override reality
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-022-02525-y

There are lies, damned lies, and statistics!

The problem here is that sexual assault as a category is underreported, Both male and female.

And extremely difficult to prove.

Women are unlikely to be believed (#metoo) but so are men. The societal view is that men cannot be sexually assaulted against their will because they are taller, stronger, etc etc and it is this latter assumption which the OP is trying to challenge.

A small woman can do a lot of damage, with sharp objects, etc there is nothing stopping her from throwing herself into a man and bear in mind that even if a man COULD use force he might not want to, for fear of hurting her.

The ONS stats are recorded by police. There are many, many reasons why male victimization never makes it into police records. While many female victims also do not report, almost no male victims report to police. Police statistics are a highly skewed sample. The IPV report above gives statistics on males vs females who report being sexually victimized in a relationship. There are also campus wide statistical reports on being sexually victimized (the ACHA-NCHA in the USA). About 1 in 9 men and 1 in 3 women report being sexually victimized at some point - although this does vary depending on the population being studied or surveyed.

@jeaux90 , could you post a link to that statistic, I've tried but haven't been able to find it.

Where did I say that?
The statement is literal. I wondered if she'd spiked his drunk with something else too. Maybe Viagra?

X-posted.
Also female sexuality isn't openly discussed. It's.still some sort of hidden secret, for whatever reason and it's assumed that we don't get horny.

While it is Easier for women to find a willing sexual partner compared to men, it is still difficult to find one that she actually likes.

So people don't believe that women could commit sexual assault because well, why would we? We can have dick any time we want!

$arcasm obviously

Well done for starting your own thread rather than hijacking one about male violence which is what usually happens.

www.ons.gov.uk/file?uri=/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/datasets/sexualoffencesprevalenceandvictimcharacteristicsenglandandwales/yearendingmarch2022/prevalenceandvictimcharacteristicsfinalv3.xlsx

This shows the reported assaults on men and women very evenly split.

Check out the last link I posted. It is a very recent study and found that sexual desire in women and in men is not that different. While in some situations, men have stronger sexual desire, much of the time, it is similar with similar patterns.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-022-02525-y

Yes, this is what I was saying.
Study or otherwise that's not what the general public thinks. You only have to look at some of the threads on MN

The statistic on the perpetrator sex is also in the report.

Perpetrator of rape / attempted rape can only be men based on definition - is that correct? That is what I have read in other threads.

This.

It's men.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=kar.kent.ac.uk/id/document/15660&ved=2ahUKEwjS4ufMptz_AhXFi1wKHZsBCEgQFnoECA8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw1VNdHcK6SkoFM7T-V5w7qb

This paper summarises many of the issues with collecting statistics and summarises some of the studies which have been carried out. Several of the studies show about a quarter of men have experienced sexual assaults/forced sex, about 20% of women said they have used verbal violence to have non consensual sex with a man and about 1% of women have used physical violence.

This is a literature review, so obviously the original sources would need to be read to understand the stats properly.

Thanks, I did find this ONS study, I still can't find he 98% Statistic.

If the reported assaults are closer to 50:50, I think @Willyoujustbequiet 's assertion that it's just men needs much more substantiation to stand up as anything more than unsupported bias.

As other posters have said it's the ONS stats. 96% of defendants at trial are male.

I'm a SA and DV survivor and also have both professional and other personal experience in this area. Women make up the majority of the victims but also overwhelming men are the perpetrators. The support groups I've been involved with are full of women and the perpetrator courses ordered by the courts are full of men.

It's a gendered crime and I'm sick of the whataboutery.

I haven't looked at the statistics, but I do think it's very important to raise awareness of drives to sexual aggression, paedophilia and other taboo instincts in women.

The main reason it's important is that much of the oppression of women throughout history has been predicated not just on men's greater physical strength, but on false premises of gender essentialism, especially the myth of male higher sex drives and needs and the assumption that male aggression is biologically innate rather than cultural.

The more people are aware of how much evidence there is to the contrary and how much research there is showing cultural origins of gender constructs, the better.

P.s. I'm not saying violent crime and abuse aren't predominantly committed by males, but that gender essentialism often uses the idea that this is a biological inevitably as an excuse.
Looking at how much it is culturally formed is important as it counters that and provides scope for social change.

Just because the people who are directed into support groups are women and the people who are directed to perpetrator classes are men doesn't actually mean that is representative of what actually happens to people in their lives. Do the support groups you attend welcome male victims? Do they have support groups for men?

What gets reported, what gets charged, what gets prosecuted, what gets court ordered - is all very gendered as well.

The people directed to the support groups were women because the vast majority of victims were women.

I would imagine they weren't open to males given that the clients had been traumatised by men who raped them. It is their right to a safe space.

I was aware that male victims had a right access support separately however the demand was not there.

Yes I agree that the justice system is gendered. The conviction rate for rape is appalling. Women don't matter. Rape is basically legalised at this point and its abhorrent. Men are free to rape with impunity.

The US statistics are shocking too. 1 in 5 women will be raped compared to 1 in 71 men..
91% of victims are female.
96% of child sexual abuse is perpetratrated by men. (National Sexual Violence Resource Center)

As I said. Its men.

I don't think the argument about the clients of support groups is valid. The victims of domestic abuse are about 2:1 female:male but the refugees and support groups are overwhelming exclusively for women.

Society doesn't acknowledge the real issue of female violence against men.

I agree OP but get your hard hat on, I see the insults have already begun. It's not a sentiment we like to share here.

The cases I have seen of women “raping” men usually involve date rape drugs being used to incapacitate the victim, and then he is immobilised by handcuffs, rope, duct tape.

I think nonconsensual sex is a good neutral term because under English law you need a penis to rape someone. It’s not just penetration, it’s penetration with a real penis (a dildo doesn’t count).

I quoted stats for SA not DV. The victims were overwhelming female.

Wikipedia is obviously not the most reliable tool, but at least it references sources. This section suggests tape isn't exclusively a male problem.

"In 2011, a study supported by a research grant from the Department of Education and Science of Spain found based on a "convenience sample of 13,877 students in 32 nations" that 2.4% of males and 1.8% of females admitted to having physically forced someone into having sex in the last year"

So from that study, a woman is only 25% less likely to be a rapist than a man.

Female violence against men is a real issue which society refuses to recognise.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_by_gender

Confirmation bias is strong here.