To yell at my husband for being miserable

[Anotherfarmerswife]

I’ve NC for this as it’s possibly outing although I’m sure there are thousands of miserable, depressed farmers out there whose wives might be similar.

My husband is a farmer, he’s in partnership with his (elderly) father of a family farm which has been in the family circa 250years. The job is hard at the moment, not enough staff, volatile commodity prices and soaring costs, it isn’t what it was when his father was running the job in the 70s when they were pissing shit hot chemicals into water courses and basically decimating the countryside, but my husband does a brilliant job.

We live a beaut life (this is in relevance to my post, I’m not gloating). Three young children, a really beautiful place to live in more space than most people dream of, dogs, horses, I work part time as a fee earning professional and honestly through my eyes life is awesome, apart from him.

Everything sits heavy on him. The farm is, as he describes, the millstone around his neck which he wishes he didn’t have - the pressure to make it work and to carry it on, something he can never walk away from. It plagues his every day, every trip away he’s light and the moment we come down the drive the black dog descends.

The house is a constant stress for him. It’s a big old listed farmhouse and to be fair it constantly shitting itself one way or another but for me like most rationale people, it’s a nice problem to have. I see a nice home to bring up our children, I don’t know what he sees but it’s all dark.

The gardens are endless and there isn’t enough time to sort them all out, something always needs doing - I feel like this is the same for anyone who takes an interest in gardening, no matter the size. It bothers him, to the point sometimes he comes home and cuts the pissing lawn in the dark.

I do everything with him, I share the burden physically and mentally of the farm and at home, plus I carry the weight of all the childrens admin because I always have.

He goes in cycles, sometimes he’s jolly as fuck and living the dream we actually have. This week is another pit of sorrow, rejected loads of wheat, deductions, a massive invoice from the fertiliser company and four new tractor tyres at fuck knows how much. He’s sulking and miserable and I know he suffers with depression, he gets inside his head and he can’t cope with everything and his mood just spirals.

I have asked him so many times to seek help but he has a shotgun licence and his solace is the odd day clay shooting with his friends, apparently seeking mental health support means his guns would be taken and so that is not an option.

I don’t know what to do anymore, I’m in my mid 30s, I want to laugh some more, I know he’s struggling but I feel like he’s pulling me down with him. We’re going away next week which he’s moping about (despite it being his suggestion). I’ve organised everything from the kids to the house sitter to the animals to the farm relief, he hasn’t had to think about it.

Tonight I just lost my shit and told him I was so fed up of him being such a miserable twat when he’s surrounded by so much good. I know depression doesn’t work like that and I understand it’s hard but fuck me we literally have the world to go at and he’s stalking about upstairs making his problems worse in his head, he doesn’t even speak to me about it, just shuts down until the cloud lifts.

I don’t know what to say to change things? I don’t know what to do next? I love the bones of him and I want to help but I can’t go through another cycle of elated-calm-down-desperate-distant again, I’ve just run out of steam. I don’t know what I’m asking really, am I being a dick? What should I be doing to help him, we just bugger along getting from one of his breakdowns to another, it isn’t normal but so many of his friends are also farmers in the same shitstorm I think he thinks it is?

My husband isn’t an abusive arsehole, he’s not volatile, he’s just struggling. He’s never once been in any way aggressive or confrontational to any of us, that isn’t what is happening here.

Part of his problem when he gets into his more dark headspace is that he realised he has a good thing and he can’t always enjoy that and it’s frustrating for him that he can’t just be happy and let his troubles wash over his head a bit more.

Im not genuinely going to leave the man I love, who loves us, because he’s struggling- that categorically won’t help any of us at all. He isn’t a threat to any of us and I know it’s difficult to comprehend from the outside but this isn’t the situation you’ve described with your ex.

I think the drain for me is that I know he needs to always talk about his issues because as @Scrowy stated, I’m the one he sees every evening and he needs to offload. When he’s quiet and brooding it’s a difficult subject to broach and last night particularly, I just wasn’t in the mood. I’m a solicitor with three young children, I carry my own work stresses and my own home stresses and also carry the worry that my husband is struggling and it’s trying to find a way of helping him without throwing him under a bus.

Ah thank you that’s very kind of you. I write a lot of very boring reports as part of my job but I’ve never considered I had a particularly interesting writing style!

Sounds like he's got a lot on his plate, I'm feeling stressed just thinking about it.

Can the garden be simplified? Completely grassed over so it just needs a mow every other week? Can the horses and dogs go, that's a lot of work. Pick the horses back up when the kids are old enough to genuinely share the burden.

I don't think this is really a mental health issue, he's genuinely overwhelmed with graft. The house and farm sound essential, everything else can be scaled back.

My heart goes out to you . I also lived with someone in a black cloud of despair and he dragged me down. Like you I tried to do everything to lighten the burden , we work in similar industries and I even worked on my mat leave to try and ‘fix’ things but it could not be fixed till he addressed the depression . I do not blame you for snapping and it didnt happen over night. Take care

I'm not picking holes in your story, I'm trying to offer something useful.

He probably doesnt need a shotgun and licence for clay shooting, he can probably use one on site.

It may be that he needs one for pest control on the farm and you didnt want to say that because people might get upset but if he doesnt do that himself then he may be persuaded to seek mental health support if he can be persuaded that he doesnt need a gun because he has other options. X

OP I'm not a farmer at all but this sounds like a classic family business transition story to me. Have you thought about getting help from someone who specialises in that, not for farming (as it sounds like you all know perfectly well how to run a farm, between you, DH and all the agribusiness consultants/agents etc) but for family business itself?

I'm not in farming but my family has a similar setup and it was really helpful for me to take a class on this topic. It wasn't really a class, more like a group discussion/experience sharing facilitated by the instructor. Lots of similar themes to what you are talking about (e.g. feeling simultaneously lucky and burdened, guilt at considering other options, how to take over from elderly family members, etc).

I wonder if this is something you could suggest to your husband that wouldn't be seen as "mental health support" but would give him a structured forum for processing?

There may be practical solutions ahead (e.g. maybe you take on more of the responsibilities directly yourself, explicitly having FIL hand over the reigns) but getting to grips with the emotional undercurrents will be important.

I think you are right - it is down to the amount of work he has on and I’m careful to throw the word depression around, most of the time I would agree it is just a hard workload but sometimes like yesterday I do think it could be more than that, and we have lost friends in similar situations so I suppose I’m just aware it could be more than that.

Work wise after suggestions yesterday I have decided I think we need to look for someone to do some gardening each week to reduce that burden.

The dogs absolutely can’t go, we all absolutely adore them, they are our family and are working gundogs so a necessity in the winter. The horses, I have previously spoken to my MIL about as she has horses, is a couple of miles away and could take the ponies on, I need my horses for my own sanity - they are my peace and harmony, as odd as that may sound with the work they bring.

We’re in a much brighter place this morning, sometimes his coping mechanism is to shut me out and actually after a long discussion last night, everything is better again.

I know I complained last night that I have to carry a lot mentally and I shouldn’t really have to, but he’s a brilliant husband and father and he’s struggling so that’s what I have to do to get us all through the bad bits - I know if I were struggling I could lean on him in the same way, I know that. I was a twat for yelling at him, that didn’t help anyone, thank you for everyone who has offered support and advice, I really do appreciate it.

Could you move farming type to an easier one? I know lots of farmers near me are moving to dry stock vs dairy. Far less time consuming. Help him review the finances to generate some passive income. Lease some fields that don't generate enough income to be bothered with? Is there an old cottage or outbuildings that would suit an Air B&B type deal? He seems to like outdoor pursuits, could you do something with that - paintballing, etc etc

https://fcn.org.uk/can-we-help-you-or-someone-you-know/

Until he cuts ties and gets out he'll always be like this. I hate family businesses- dh runs one and it's a fucking millstone.

Yes sorry I had been deliberately vague because it’s MN - we shoot game in the season and he does also use for predation control so he needs his own licence.

Are your children going to have to carry this burden too when they grow up? I have no experience of the farming world but it does sound very intense. It seems more of a millstone than a blessing to have this farm in the family for the generations to come. How old is fil? Is there a scenario in the future where the farm could be sold and a new chapter started or is fil likely to be around for a few more decades?

My husband isn’t an abusive arsehole, he’s not volatile

errr, I never said he was. All I said is I couldn't live the rest of my life with someone miserable who puts a downer on bascailly every element of my life (which your OP said your DH did - now it's jsut offloading apparently, I mean, I can only answer what you wrote). If that's not the case then great, and I am not sure why you wrote the things you did originally.

And you are kidding yourself if you don't think that you that the negativity will rub off on your kids.

Hi 👋

I haven’t read the whole thread, just your posts but wondered if you’d come across https://fcn.org.uk ? Might be a good place for you to offload even if you can’t get him to do so himself!

Farms near us are all about the diversification these days - all the pick your own stuff you mentioned including wildflowers, sunflowers and pumpkins. Hay bale scarecrow and Christmas trails, father christmas tractor rides. Campsites (I think this one is a pain in the arse though!). An education centre for homeschooled / excluded children.

My cousin married into a farming family with a similar FIL (sounds like all farming FIL’s are the same!!). Her and her husband have ended up focusing on building the diversified side and basically leaving FIL to control the rest of it. They know when he becomes incapacitated/ passes it will be hard but they tried to do it together and it was really detrimental to everyone.

oh and they also use farm labourers for mowing / pruning the garden. Sanity saver!

We’re not livestock thank fuck- my parents are dairy farmers and they are really really struggling - I actually think sometimes my husband holds back on talking about his issues because financially my parents are in a much harder predicament in terms of their farming business.

The finances aren’t quite as tricky here, we do make margins but it’s all big outlays in terms of crops, machinery and labour because a lot of the business is veg - there is a huge time and cost pressure to get it out of the ground, into ambient store and off to the retailers within a specific timeframe and that is what he finds hard, mentally. We do have some diversified income and other options in the pipeline but again, limited because this is absolutely not a touristy part of the country.

Last night we discussed an option to diversify into something specific which would interest and occupy my FIL and if it was viable, it would take FIL’s focus away from the farming side of the business, which is really where the hindrance lies.

I agree with a PP - family businesses are often a poisoned chalice. Luckily everyone rows together most of the time, other than my FIL.

No, our children will be discouraged from any involvement - my husband was expected to take on the farm, there will be no expectation from them and honestly I have no idea what agriculture will look like in 20+ years.

The thing is, when you have children everything has an impact on them. My husband is struggling and sometimes when it comes to a head such as last night, it weighs heavy on me to the point where I snap.

My options are either to keep supporting the man I love and hope that in time, things come right for him, or to leave him. Either of those options impact my children and there isn’t anything I can do about that. In my opinion, leaving their father and a man I desperately love, when he is so low, is the much more destructive of the two options available to me. A) because from a practical point of view it will be so much physical disruption and upheaval for my children to be away from their daddy and B) because if he really is struggling and ends up taking his own life, that is a life changing event for all of us to carry with us for the rest of our lives.

He isn’t aggressively taking out his issues on us, he is mentally unloading to me because I’m the only person he has to lean on at the moment. To leave him now because I don’t want to carry the mental load would ultimately be very selfish considering how much I do love and care for him.

MN always tells people to LTB OP, just ignore it :) life & love comes from the hard times not just the easy times. It doesn't sound like he's abusive at all.

@Anotherfarmerswife if it helps I absolutely lost it at my dh this morning and we are in a similar position (not farming though). I think the constant misery and stress really takes its toll. I know I will be the one made yo feel bad about it later as well, as because he's going through so much stress at work he thinks he's untouchable and anyone who gets cross with him for being moody and unhelpful is in the wrong.

I wonder if the depression is caused by his powerlessness re his father.

If he could wave a magic wand, what would he want? If he would want to continue farming, then it’s the relationship with his father that needs solving.

If not, then some radical thinking is needed.

Sometimes it’s not having solutions to problems that causes most mental stress.

Does he let you in to help problem solve the big issues?

@Anotherfarmerswife I don't have any advice really, but there is a foundation in Wales, I don't know if you've heard of it it's called the dpj foundation and they were specifically founded to support the mental health of those in agriculture and rural communities. They may have suggestions and they also have a helpline much like the samaritans but again more specific with. Better understanding of the challenges faced in agriculture https://www.thedpjfoundation.co.uk/

I also didn't say you should leave him now. But ok.

I agree with others that finding a way of making the farm work with your FIL(or despite your FIL!) is key. Your idea of starting up a sideline which he is responsible for is fab.

As someone who has suffered with depression myself I'd really not take the risk of the shotgun being in the house extremely seriously. I know having a shotgun is the norm in farming families and rural communities, but please don't let that put you off getting rid of it if at all possible. Alternatively, could you have the key/code to the gun cabinet so you are in control of his access to it?

Lots of people who have depression will have moments where they feel absolutely desperate and might consider hurting themselves. Your husband has access to shotguns and farm machinery, if he does have one of those moments where he feels desperate he has the means to hurt himself or end his life. This makes him at a much greater risk of suicide.

I hope things improve for you all soon. 🌺

FYI I have had a shotgun licence since I was a teen. I live with my parents. I’ve been struggling with my mental health and my GP is involved.

My GP told me to contact the local firearms licensing dept. The firearms guy was very friendly and said he doesn’t want to take away a hobby or outlet that people have.

My guns are now in my Dad’s name and still in the same gun cabinet as before, but Dad keeps the keys in a place only he knows.

If you could apply for a shotgun licence and have the guns transferred to your name then that could potentially be a compromise.

The firearms officers are well aware people don’t come forward for fear of losing their licence, however I found that they are very reasonable in their approach.

I've really resonated with your posts OP.

I just want to ask you to think about the liklihood that not only are you most likely doing the 'second shift' that lots of working mothers do, as a farmer's wife you are almost certainly going to be doing a third shift as well.

It's too much to do as it is, working in a professional role, being a mother to young children and trying to have some semblance of hobbies etc. Add into that your extra shift doing the farm paperwork, contributing to the decision-making, the negotations, the emotional and financial burdens, as well as all the other farm-wife expectations that exist in the industry still.

What other job expects the 'employee's' family to also give everything they have as well?

Your love for him is etched into every post you have written. But make sure you don't set yourself on fire trying to keep him warm.

If shouting at him a little bit every now and then reminds him that the farm is important but its not everything then... I don't think you have done much wrong.