To be shocked at how much time off sick some people have?

[Enfys1982]

I work in a school and since I started in the sector it’s been a bit of eye opener to me how much sick time some people seem to take, and it always seems to be the same people. Days here and there, sometimes weeks on end then they come back for a bit go off again. As I said always the same people.

The last time I was off was last year when I had Covid, and I was only off because then you still legally had to isolate if positive. I actually felt well enough to go in. Before that I genuinely can’t remember when I was off sick. If I feel bad I just dose myself up and get on with it.

AIBU to think it displays a lack of resilience?

@Balloonsandroses hope things are starting to improve for you

I have come across plenty of skivers in my time don't get me wrong but there are plenty of people who are just unlucky when it comes to illness.

I think I had 2 days off sick with food poisoning pre child (so more than 11 years ago now) and that's the only instance I've ever had in 23 years of working but I also realise that next week I could be struck down with something and need time off, then I could get back and end up with something else not long after, just how it goes.

DD for example made it all way from reception to Year 4 without having a single day off sick, even the school office said it was practically unheard of. Got into year 5 and her attendance is an all time low - she got covid, wasn't long back after that and she had chickenpox, then there was a bout of gastroenteritis and then conjunctivitis just the other week so 4 lots of illness in one year.

I have found the complete opposite in education-colleagues battle on through illness because getting cover is so difficult, and consistency for children is so important . You also have to set all the work and often come back to a pile of marking- it’s less stressful to just go in and teach while ill.

We obviously had to follow covid rules while they were in place, but otherwise people tend to be off for major things like operations, long term serious illness etc.

The issue isn’t so much taking time off sick in itself. If someone is genuinely unwell, they need to be off work.

but yes, I’ve met people who would be off for weeks, back for a couple of days, then off again. The same people who were all over Facebook detailing holidays, nights out and even their second jobs.
we had someone like this who would openly admit she didn’t want to work, and could easily get sick notes. Now thanks to her, our work has decided to tighten up sickness allowance and it’s affecting the genuinely unwell staff.

Also, you're in an environment where you are more likely to be exposed to nasty bugs. Especially with younger children.

I used to think I had a decent immune system... Until I had a child who we dubbed the typhoid toddler for a while. He's trot off to nursery get some bug (of which he would recover really quickly) whisky taking out me and my husband for a few days. With WFH jobs we can muddle through if not too serious... But in a school setting, that's not so achievable.

I work in nurseries and know what you mean. It's almost a surprise to see them at work because they never seem to be there. I don't fully know the circumstances behind it however so I don't want to judge.

Sacked? If you had doctors notes, and proof that you were sick with these conditions, I would have gone to CAB for advice.

When my MH absolutely dive bombed and I had a lot of time off work, I told my colleagues it was flu, or a stomach bug, or a migraine. Because the truth was none of their fucking business. I don’t care what they thought of me tbh.

In the end I had a total breakdown and had to leave my job.

Ah the old money thing! People like you (and sometimes me too, I will be honest - you can usually tell!) talk about miraculous recoveries when absentees are about to go into half pay. I have learned personally that I have to go back at a certain point because I can't afford it.

The reason for my depression is primarily work-related.

"OR is it crap employers, poor management, people being told they CAN'T have the day(s) off that they desire, because there's no cover....loads of work piled on them because there's too few staff for the workload, low pay, and a low amount of holiday days, so that people feel they NEED 2-3 weeks 'sick time' just to get a bit more time off".

That's exactly it! I have a manager who is an extreme micromanager. It really affects my confidence and motivation and they refuse to back off. I found myself in a really bad place, couldn't eat or sleep - I had to get away from them. I know they are not going to change. I know that their manager is worse if anything. I couldn't take the stress of making a formal complaint (which would probably get shut down anyway after taking years to investigate). I am too old to look for another job. I need my salary... trapped.

I bet @Enfys1982 you are still young. Resilience can diminish as you get older, more health conditions, disillusioned and regretful. I do hope you are not in any kind of caring role.

Had a boss like OP. She never took a sick day, even when she was sick as a dog and obviously feverish. She'd infect us all then complain about us being 'babies' when as a result half the unit was out sick or someone had to have a week off with her nasty bug. So I wonder how 'resilient' OP is or if she just goes into work when she should really stay at home out of consideration of her work mates (and their families).

But yes, I've had a few coworkers with what we always called 'Monday- or Friday-itis', especially around 3 day weekends. And also a few who milked the system But by a large none of my coworkers (over my 30+ year career) were leave 'abusers', especially those with chronic illnesses. By and large I found those coworkers to be the most determined to get to work and not be 'defeated' by their illness.

FFS - you don't know the full picture of what's going on in people's lives. MYOB.

TBH I've had three days of over the past two years as I work from home and am happy to return to work once the initial stage of a cold is over. I've never taken much sick leave until I had a freak issue that would only be resolved by surgery and was off for eight weeks while waiting for my operation. Luckily for me they pushed it forward for me or I would have been off for three to six months going by current wait times. Believe me, if I could have gotten it resolved faster I would have.

Oh the naivety. Excessive sickness absence is one of the easiest legal ways to get rid of someone, even when it's all perfectly genuine and certificated.

So much so that the HR support company we use send a "consultant" for sickness absence cases and a "senior consultant" for pretty much everything else.

If you're not well enough to do your job reliably it's easy to be dismissed on ill health capability grounds, unless it's connected to a disability.

I'm one of those people with lots of time off. Currently on long term sick and even when I go back I'm likely to have a fair amount off on a regular basis.

Started out as just "tiredness" and every single bug knocking me over. Ended up as gallbladder exploding and causing pancreatis at the same time I got the cancer diagnosis. I've no doubt that before the diagnosis came in people were sniffing about my resilience.

I've had three ops. I have meds I will be on for life. I have long term side effects. What I actually need is a year or two to rehabilitate and build my strength back up so I don't get knocked out by a sniffle when I go back. However my office refuse to either retire me on medical grounds or allow me to take a chunk of unpaid leave and resigning would lose my length of service so on the sick I stay.

YABU

I used to think like that, until I had children. Before having children/being pregnant, I had maybe 1 day off sick in about 5/6 years. After breeding the little germ bags, I honestly catch everything going and starting suffering with migraines, and adding the exhaustion of being a parent, I cant cope at work like I used to when unwell.

Good for you that you are able too, but you are not everyone else. You don't know what they are going through, or what they are able to cope it

You deserve support, I hope things improve. You are definitely not who op means, I’m sure. ❤️

I voted YABU because you don’t actually know why a lot of people are off sick. My best friend, for eg, has a debilitating medical condition that has required she take a lot of time off over the last few months. Her head teacher knows about it and has approved all the time off (and offered more). My friend doesn’t want to tell the rest of the staff what it is - nor should she have to - but that hasn’t stopped other people in her team repeatedly ask her what’s wrong and where she is. Presumably the leadership team at your school know what’s going on and are ok with it therefore you should probably mind your own business.

The poster I was responding to has chronic asthma. Which is classed as a disability. They should not have been sacked because of that. Where is the naivety in that?

There are lots of reasons that some people take more sick leave than others. To lump them all in together and pretend that it's because you are superior and "resilient" is arrogant and unthinking.

You are very fortunate to apparently have been born into a body that is in generally good health, does not routinely suffer severe symptoms from common illnesses and responds well to medication that allows you to continue your day-to-day activities (and spread your germs to everyone else). That's pure luck. Nothing to do with resilience or you being a better kind of person. Just luck. And unfortunately not everybody shares that luck.

Have you honestly never had the experience of your whole household coming down with the same bug or virus and different family members being affected differently? Some being really genuinely very poorly while another has a minor sniffle? It's really not difficult to fathom.

There's also the obvious possibility that your colleagues are not telling you the truth about why they are absent because it's quite simply none of your business and they'd rather tell you they've had the flu than tell their (judgemental) colleague that they are experiencing mental health difficulties or a long term health condition for example.

Unfortunately people like you are rarely capable of reconsidering their prejudices and preconceived notions about things so, have a medal instead for being such a resilient little worker bee 🏅

Well aren’t you lucky having such good health. Not everyone is as lucky as you - don’t judge people before you know the full story.

Potentially unpopular opinion but if someone is so ill that they are "hanging on by a thread" then shouldn't that be a sign to change jobs, quite jobs or accept they need to be on disability payment? Forcing themselves to work through chronic illness or accepting that their colleagues must always pick up the slack doesn't do anyone's health a favour. Most conditions also tend to improve when give sufficient time to relax and recuperate.

There are also many careers that involve freelance work, WFH or flexible hours where the person can fit work around their schedule. Working in an office or in shifts is an ableist structure by design. You need to physically show up somewhere every day, work, and then commute home while juggling all the tasks like groceries or errands outside of those times.

Oh my god, some of these answers are so rude. Posters calling the OP a ‘pillock’ and similar. What is wrong with you people? Everyone is so intolerant of each other on mumsnet, it’s bloody depressing - I bet people wouldn’t reply in this fashion face to face.

for what its worth, my view on the OPs question is

a) some people have genuine health issues and have to take more time off work sick. That’s why sick pay exists

b) some people don’t have health issues ‘per se’ but just don’t cope with being ill as well as others. Whereas someone else might soldier through, others take time off for what is likely the same level of ‘illness’. Is that ‘less resilience’ or do those people genuinely feel worse? Who knows 🤷‍♀️

c) opposite of b - some people are able to just keep on going, despite not feeling well. Ofte those who either don’t get enhanced sick pay (or sick pay at all!), those who can work from home or those with a lot of responsbility where that cannot easily take a day off.

d) some people take the piss

@MillicentTrilbyHiggins I think that's quite common (people giving different reasons.) I hope you are much better now

I've been a manager for almost 25 years, managed large teams and small. In that time I've had two members of staff who knew exactly what they were doing, 'managed' their sickness so that they never quite went onto half-pay, always stayed just within the tolerances of the sickness policy. The timing of their illnesses was always very convenient / coincidental - team workload pinch points, weeks where they'd been too slow putting in leave requests and had had to be declined as the maximum permitted staff were already off, days they were rostered for the tasks they disliked, that sort of thing. You do get a feel for the type of worker who operates like that.

BUT I've managed far, far more people who were committed, conscientious, came in when they really shouldn't and I had to have the "are you sure you're well enough to be here, do you think you should go home?" conversation; people with chronic conditions who wanted and had it kept confidential, who battled in as much as they could but (rightly) had to take time when their conditions flared, or who had a reasonable adjustment that allowed more sick leave than the usual policy; people who behave like mature adults in that they work when they are well and take time off when they are sick.