To be shocked at how much time off sick some people have?

[Enfys1982]

I work in a school and since I started in the sector it’s been a bit of eye opener to me how much sick time some people seem to take, and it always seems to be the same people. Days here and there, sometimes weeks on end then they come back for a bit go off again. As I said always the same people.

The last time I was off was last year when I had Covid, and I was only off because then you still legally had to isolate if positive. I actually felt well enough to go in. Before that I genuinely can’t remember when I was off sick. If I feel bad I just dose myself up and get on with it.

AIBU to think it displays a lack of resilience?

Again very narrow minded. You are equating taking sick leave with being lazy, entitled and unreliable.

There are many workers who are in work every single day and are absolutely lazy, entitled and unreliable.

There are many like myself who have had periods of several weeks off other the years due to disability and health conditions which require a lot of work to manage on a daily basis.

I would have you know that I am the precise opposite of lazy, entitled or unreliable.

I am an absolutely exemplary and dedicated worker. I don't think being disabled makes me any less so. I am leaving a job shortly and there are 4 people being hired to replace me. And yet I am sure that there will be some in the business (no one who knows the work I actually do) who will assume that I am lazy and entitled due simply to some periods of sickness absense I have required.

This is the kind of attitude that makes workplaces hard for disabled people. We make a huge contribution. If no disabled people were allowed to work due to this obsession with presenteeism, I think you would feel our absence very strongly indeed.

Hmm, interesting thread.

It's interesting to see which groups have the highest sickness leave and who their employers are. The link between generous sick leave and high rates of sickness leave is crystal clear.
The NHS has sickness absence rates of over 5% (2022). That's way too high. With Anxiety/stress/depression/other psychiatric illnesses the most reported reason for sickness absence.

I've seen threads on Mumsnet where posters are encouraged to take very long amounts of time off for bereavements and depression etc. All of which is understandable but I wonder if it could be managed differently.

The NHS has sickness absence rates of over 5% (2022). That's way too high. With Anxiety/stress/depression/other psychiatric illnesses the most reported reason for sickness absence

Sickness rates are usually a barometer for working conditions. Which are shit in the NHS and teaching. This is why they have such high sickness rates.

@Florenz this was my question

There has to be a happy medium. Of course, no one should be expected to work if they are too ill to do so and I am sure that we all have every sympathy with people who have serious illnesses. However, the op is not talking about these people but those who call in sick for every minor cough or sneeze. If someone has a streaming cold it makes sense to take a day off work so that you don't infect everyone else but most of us are more than capable of working through a tension headache (with painkillers) or the average cold. I am self employed so have long learnt to carry on regardless unless it is really impossible. Resilience is a good thing to learn. You can tell who had parents who kept them off school for the most minor ailment and those who told their children that they would feel better when they got there like l and my mother did. It generally works.

I think the underlying issue is that services like the NHS and other public sector services are severely underfunded, and also often dealing with extremely stressful and critical work with limited resources.

What we do not need is in-fighting. We should be supporting our colleagues to maintain their health and continue the valuable work that we do.

Put the blame were it is due.

Personally I'd use my insurance.
It exists for just this sort of thing!
I deciding to take responsibility for myself.
People should try it.

What insurance are you referring to?

I would be surprised if a GP had signed off multiple weeks of sickness absence due to coughs and sneezes...

I don't care what they do. But if they are being paid to do a job, they should realise that that is what the money they are being paid for their employer is for. Too many people have lost sight of that, they just think they are entitled to the money that magically appears in their bank account each month.

@SparklyShark
I think the underlying issue is that services like the NHS and other public sector services are severely underfunded, and also often dealing with extremely stressful and critical work with limited resources.

What we do not need is in-fighting. We should be supporting our colleagues to maintain their health and continue the valuable work that we do.

Put the blame were it is due.

I haven't put the blame anywhere! I wondered if the extremely high sickness absence rates in the NHS could be managed better.

Apologies the first bit of my response was to you, as you mentioned the types of work which have high sickness and I was giving my thoughts on why that is.

The second half of my comment was a more general response to discussions in the thread.

@SparklyShark
Ahh I see. No worries.

Wrt to the OP I think she was talking about how much some people - a small minority- do get away with taking the piss. I've worked with an assistant manager who would ring in sick at the slightest sign of a sniffle and stay off for days- but would be incredibly unpleasant to and about staff ringing in to report any sort of sickness including viruses, food poisining, and someone we knew occasionally had migraines as it might cause her 24h of inconvenience. If we had been like that towards her she would have accused us of "bullying".

The rest of us would stay off if properly sick as not spreading your germs is one thing and the right approach but she expected one set of treatment whilst meting out another and as we all knew she liked to duck work anyway, yes, I did view it as a piss take.

I don't care what they do. But if they are being paid to do a job, they should realise that that is what the money they are being paid for their employer is for. Too many people have lost sight of that, they just think they are entitled to the money that magically appears in their bank account each month.

Maybe you have met a lot of people like that, but I think they're in the minority. Over 22 years in the workforce I personally have found most people to have a better work ethic than the one you're describing.

Your first sentence is very telling though.

Exactly. As the ‘reliable’ person at my work I’ve come to resent the sick leave pisstakers. It’s exhausting always having to pick up others people work, especially as I work somewhere where the work can’t just wait until people are back. A few weeks ago I was burnt out and had to take a day off due to sheer exhaustion. Once upon a time I would have felt guilty for doing that but no more.

Part of the issue at my workplace is that there are underlying culture problems and staff leaving in droves. This means we’re short staffed before any sick leave so some people end up taking sick leave to have from the tension which of course means the staff remaining after that are under even more pressure.

YANBU

Except you can't 'easily pick those who have genuine illnesses' as the pp put it, because not all illness is visible.

Oh and the attitude that a single day off is probably dodgy is completely wrong. I try not to take time off sick but I do get migraines and usually a day off is enough. There will also be times when I’m not 100% and will make it in most days but there might be a day or two when I do need a day off. Would workplaces rather everyone take a whole week off every time they are unwell at all?

Sickness rates are usually a barometer for working conditions. Which are shit in the NHS and teaching. This is why they have such high sickness rates.
This.

It's also why teaching is haemorrhaging teachers, especially experienced teachers.

No career is worth sacrificing your health and family for.

If you have good health it may be tempting to feel this way, but I had a few months of illness when I could literally only work or rest. I didn't take any time off as you drag yourself in don't you, but I only endured this for 3 months before, thank God, it suddenly got better. As a family with primary age kids we could not have managed any longer - primary school aged kids cooking supper because partner working a late shift, sleeping on the bench in the swimming pool changing room once the kids had gone in for their lesson, setting an alarm to get out of bed mid evening to collect from Brownies etc was not tenable long term. I would have had to go off sick and would have eventually lost my job, we would have lost the house etc I live in dread of recurrence and have huge sympathy for people struck down by fibromyalgia, ME, long Covid etc. Before this happened to me I was a bit sceptical like you.

I used to think like you until my DD developed mental health issues, and honestly I have seen first hand now that she would not be capable of working when going through a bad patch. She can barely get dressed or leave the house. It has shocked me, because I always wrongly thought of myself as brave and resilient and others as a bit flakey, but I now just appreciate how healthy I have been.

I’m equating those that take unnecessary sick leave becuase they are lazy and entitled, their attitude is shown in how they work

the list of excuses is endless yes the are lazy yes they are entitled when they are at work yes that are selfish

how has it become acceptable to be this way they know they can get away with it and they dorn give a shit

this isn’t about those who genuinely struggle it’s about those that absolutely take the piss becuase they can. It’s rife in the NHS

I remember someone commenting on me taking a single day during the middle of the week whilst at school. I didn't know that I was lactose intolerant and had some milk. I'd ended up with such a painful stomach that I couldn't walk.

Completely agree. I go back to work as soon as I am able (admittedly it's easier because I wfh), it wouldn't occur to me to take a second day off for reasons of plausibility if I felt well enough to work by then.

Also with chronic conditions, being too unwell to work one day but able to the next is very much a thing.

Sickness rates are usually a barometer for working conditions. Which are shit in the NHS and teaching. This is why they have such high sickness rates

Ok, _I'm playing devils advocate here but are sickness rates also a barometer for work environments where there is generous sickness leave pay and which are heavily unionized?