To be sad about what dc have said about relationships?

[bitsadreally]

I have two sons, 14 & 16. I split with their dad about 10 years ago and have been single ever since, as has he. Both dc are adamant that they won't have children and will live alone, which makes me feel really sad, especially the latter part. It also makes me feel guilty - as if ex and I have given them such an awful model of relationships that they have been put off for life. It's not something that's discussed a lot, but when it is, I feel shit.

The relationship while we were together was okayish. We split due to infidelity on his part, which the dc have never known about (obviously it didn't last) but the marriage had fizzled out by then really anyway. They see ex very regularly and, while he's not great, there have been no major dramas. The split itself seemed to go remarkably smoothly as far as the dc were concerned - no tears, no rows and ex saw them daily at the marital home for the first year, which seemed to aid the transition. They never begged us to get back together or anything like that. They stay at his four nights per fortnight now, and I know they get fed up with moving stuff between houses but again, not a huge deal and ex only lives a 5 minute drive away (it's walkable but I do lots of driving back and fore when needed). Ex and I don't get on in that we don't really speak but there have been a number of events/incidents over the years where we have been together and civil and it's fine.

I just worry that in both staying single, which I know is unusual, we have failed to give a positive model of relationships and they think being on your own is normal and desirable. We also don't have a large extended family on either side so that doesn't help either. Neither ex nor I have large friendship groups that the dc benefit from- he has friends he sees through his hobby but the dc are never involved, and I am focused on work with a very small group of friends. We moved just before splitting and had had a larger circle of family-based friends before then, but one was the person ex cheated with and, while it would have been possible to keep in touch with the others after we moved (20 minute drive), I didn't want to as it reminded me of his cheating and they knew her, so I essentially ghosted them all, which I regret now and, again, this feels like I have let the dc down.

Both dc seem to have a goodish circle of friends. Ds1 is part of a large group and has never had what I would call a best friend (or b/gf) but seems very happy and is out quite a lot. Ds2 has a smaller circle and is out less and online more. He's more of a worry but, again, does seem happy.

I just worry that they are both consigning themselves to a lonely life because of us. Does anyone have experience of similar issues and how have they worked out?

This!

So fed up of people equating being single to being lonely.

This is one reason so many people are stuck in unhappy relationships.

You don’t know what choices they will make in the future…but living alone and being single does not mean lonely. I love living alone, have close family/friends and it’s really empowering being comfortably alone and independent. It means I don’t end up in non-ideal relationships because I’m lonely or scared of being by myself. Focus on giving your children the skills to be independent, to know their own mind and that it’s ok to not conform to society’s (or your parents!) misconceptions.

Yes. The OP was really quite insulting about single people.

You are seriously over thinking this but I agree with others, why do you see a 'single life' as being lonely and unfulfilling? Some of the happiest and most contented people I know are single. One of my siblings has (to my knowledge) never had a serious relationship but they are so happy and content in their lifestyle... could afford to retire early to a beautiful part of the country (no dependents to pay for), wide circle of friends, hobbies and interests. What's wrong with that lifestyle?

This, this and this again

That is some serious over thinking, even for Mumsnet!

I’d worry more about a 14 year old who was looking forward to marriage and children tbh. It’s just that this issue hits a worry you already have so it concerns you more. But try not to take it too seriously.

I really didn't mean to offend single people - I've been single for 10 years and it's through choice and I'm pretty happy. I'm sure they would both have lovely fulfilling single lives, it's just sad that they are so dead against the idea of a relationship. I suppose I'm more influenced by society's ideas about marriage/couples than I thought. I remain the only single person in my department of 12 and I can count on one had the number of long-term singletons in my organisation of 60+. I do feel out on a limb at times and don't want that for my dc, but hopefully they have more self-belief than I do. I think they do.

DH are happily married and both my teenage daughters have said they are never getting married or having kids. It does make you die a little inside and feel like you've failed (such is parenting). However, I just say it's normal to not want to have children when you are still a child yourself and remind them that I didn't want children and now I have 3DC whereas my sister desperately wanted children and hasn't got any. Life doesn't always happen the way you plan it as a teenager.

They haven’t fallen in love yet. My boys are slightly younger teens and (quite naturally!) can’t get their heads around being fully independent or having wives / children.

I do tell them however that they will be great husbands and dads when it’s time because I think it’s a nice alternative complement, and a way of both getting them accustomed to the idea and to value the notion of being a good husband/father.

Give it time OP.

They are 14 and 16, I wouldn't he worried at this point. When I was early 20s I was adamant I wasn't ever having children, I now have 2.

They are young. Ideology is just a phase in my opinion, but what they're really expressing is a deep hurt about not having their parents together. It might be worth talking to them sone more about why thry feel the way thry do so you can help redirect or challenge their ideology.

When they meet someone they like who likes them, it'll help change their mindset. Don't fret. Lots of kids from with single parents get married and have kids.

When I was 14 I told my entire family that I was going to become a professional ice skater.
I'm 36 and I've ice skated once. When I was 11.

Trust me they don't mean this, wait till they get their first girlfriend/boyfriend , then you'll be worried about quickly they all of sudden want to settle down😂

They are very young. They have no idea how they will live, long term. Right now, yes, your influence on them is high because they are still at school. Watch them change beyond recognition once they hit 18 and go out into the world, to uni or work. My Dc have both changed their attitudes about how they will live several times in the three or four years since leaving home.

Did you ever see that TV programme which tracked children's lives with a gap of a few years between each episode. I remember one girl, about 16 years old, saying she adored her little village in UK and would never leave it. Next programme she was teaching in China!

Couple of thoughts:

• You and your ex have obviously modelling positive things about being being single / independent - I don’t think that’s a bad thing, as learning to rely / be by yourself is a huge life lesson. Having a partner or spouse is meant to add to your life, not be sole focus, so learning to be yourself first I think is very positive.
• They’re at that age where they will start to be less influenced by you and your ex, and more by their peers. It may be that once they see their friends entering into relationships, they may change their mind. - they may be swept of their feet!
• Not everyone finds someone worth the risks and downsides of being in a relationship with. And that’s okay.

suppose I'm more influenced by society's ideas about marriage/couples than I thought. I remain the only single person in my department of 12 and I can count on one had the number of long-term singletons in my organisation of 60+. I do feel out on a limb at times

You're projecting your feelings about relationships onto your sons.

All of these people who are married and coupled up at your workplace - how many are genuinely happy? How many are fucking around behind their partner's back? How many feel depressed and lonely and trapped ? How many experiencing DV? How many are married to someone they despise in a sexless relationship? How many have become parents and wish they hadn't?

Why should being on your own be seen as undesirable though? What is the problem with not wanting kids or marriage? I have a child but I have no desire for a relationship at all and I'm certainly not lonely. Why should somebody have to be in a relationship just because it's what society expects?

A good loving relationship can of course be a wonderful thing but there's absolutely nothing wrong with choosing a different life path. Weird thing to be sad about honestly. My DS is also adamant that he doesn't want kids, he says he wants pets instead although he could change his mind of course. I think that's smart of him in today's society honestly.

My ds of a similar age says he wants to stay single and have no children. I’m glad he isn’t focusing on a relationship and needing someone else to complete his life. I also think he is likely to change his mind when older. I’m not with his dad any more and neither of us have another partner but that’s completely ok.

Sounds like this is more about you feeling guilty about splitting up?

If one of your DS’s is more introverted please don’t see that as a bad thing. It doesn’t mean he will be unhappy or lonely. ThT comes from trying to force ourselves to be someone we’re not, not from allowing ourselves the down time and alone time that we need.

Not your fault its a generational thing, there is a climate change induced moved towards not wanting children. It's societal.

Also they are teenagers, just spouting something, they have heard somewhere else. Individualism is on the rise, or at least giving up the cult of busy and replacing it with the cult of virtuous climate protectors.

I ld take it all with a pinch of salt. Don't overthink it.

If their default setting is single and childfree, hopefully that means that if they end up with somebody it wil be somebody they really love who is worth it, rather than just having to be with any old person because that's what you do. Ditto children- if they have them it'll be because they really want them, not because they feel beholden to what everybody else wanted them to want.

I'd take that with a pinch of salt. I had a friend at school who grew up with her parents together and happy who was adamant she'd never have a relationship or get married. She got married

Who knows what path they will tread but I wouldn’t take to heart what 14 and 16 year olds have to say about relationships they haven’t been in one.

A decent LTR is wonderful for two reasons and that is better economic viability and sharing a workload. Unfortunately men especially seem a bit shit overall looking at purely anecdotal evidence but a sample of all the couple I have known for at least twenty years I would say 30% have what appears to be a very decent relationship. Not a great hit rate.

They are teenagers.

My cousin who swore he always wanted to be alone has his first girlfriend in his mid 30s and they've just moved in together.

Far too young for them or you to assume anything about what they might want in future.

My parents had an awful marriage and they were pretty awful parents. I have a really healthy relationship with dh - my parent's marriage was my inspiration for what not to do, what not to put up with, and how not to parent. I'd have chosen to be alone rather than be like them.

I always said i'd never marry after my parents went through a painful split. I had made it so clear that's how i felt that when i changed my mind, after meeting my soul mate, i had to propose as he had no idea i would then want him to. Been married 30 years now. Try not to worry, things change.