We need to start talking about population decline

[user4567890754]

The first signs of it are starting to show in the UK, with primary school closures. Secondary school closures will follow.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/11158f12-0133-11ee-a364-04e704863f75?shareToken=5ef47b2b4776be376153089146c8bacf

Italy is a few years ahead of us.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/01/plunging-birthrate-threatens-italian-schools

Japan shows where every country is headed - towards a crisis where they are on the brink of being unable to maintain social functions.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/13/asia/japan-population-decline-record-drop-intl-hnk/index.html

And yet there are still people who think that we have a problem with overpopulation. It’s the opposite.

Because you are encouraging more people to have children! Therefore minimising the quality of life for everyone with over population, not to mention the strain on the planet and resources. You increase happiness and contentment by increasing living standards, and you do that by having productive, sustainable, stable, safe societies!!!!

Jesus wept

You’ve already said that you have 2 children yourself, so i find it a little hard to believe that you are so worried about overpopulation. If you really thought that then you wouldn’t have had any DC yourself.

I don’t know how anyone can look at the situation in Japan and think that a declining population leads to happiness, productivity and stability in society.

My children were born 20 years plus ago, it wasn’t an issue then.
Since then immigration has exploded.

But really what is the alternative? Even if we decarbonise the shit out of everything and stop climate change ( spoiler: we won’t) , continually increasing incomes in developing and LD countries will mean that current population numbers are unsustainable in terms of food, water, other resources- basically if the whole world adopts even close to a basic westernised lifestyle we are utterly fucked with problems that make “ but who will look after granny?” pale into insignificance. I don’t think anyone is saying that depopulation doesn’t bring challenges - it absolutely does - but making people have kids they don’t want probably brings more. I also genuinely think that AI is the joker in the pack here in ways that previous technological advancements haven’t been. Obviously hard to predict as none of us have an IQ of 10000 with which to envisage what AI will do but I suspect its Plans won’t involve 10 billion humans being allowed to continue trashing everything

I was talking in past tense! My youngest is 16. Weird you feel the need to be so intrusive but I have nothing to hide 🤷🏼‍♀️

I do however still carry first aid boxes, blankets, a spare coat in the boot, snacks in the car. Habit and rural location I suppose. This has nothing to do with over population! Bigger countries than ours can help, we are already over stretched.

I don’t think anyone is saying that depopulation doesn’t bring challenges - it absolutely does

OK, well that’s all I’m saying - there is a problem here and we need to talk about how we can best face these challenges.

making people have kids they don’t want I have never suggested this. In fact I have specifically repeated that one of my concerns is the preservation of women’s reproductive rights.

I also despair for us with thinking like this

But really what is the alternative? Even if we decarbonise the shit out of everything and stop climate change ( spoiler: we won’t) , continually increasing incomes in developing and LD countries will mean that current population numbers are unsustainable in terms of food, water, other resources- basically if the whole world adopts even close to a basic westernised lifestyle we are utterly fucked with problems that make “ but who will look after granny?” pale into insignificance. I don’t think anyone is saying that depopulation doesn’t bring challenges - it absolutely does - but making people have kids they don’t want probably brings more.

Agree with every word. Comment about western lifestyles is spot on.

There was an article in the Times today saying that AI might decide to euthanise the lot of us. I’m not sure I really understand what the danger would be, but Elon Musk is worried about it and he knows a lot more than me. I’d think if we just don’t give the robots guns and build in an on/off switch then it should be ok, but what do I know?

I do think technology can help us out a lot and there are things we could be pushing forward further now, like autonomous vehicles for freight. Chat GPT could eliminate a number of admin support and writing roles. I think there’s an Amazon supermarket now where you just walk in and take your stuff off the shelf and it charges you? So
perhaps we won’t need retail workers in the future. All these things could be part of the solution to the challenges.

Care to elaborate? Your post makes no sense.

Just to be clear : I do not think the human population of the world should increase. I do not think anybody wants that to happen or is proposing that as a solution.

Bingo!

We finally got there.

The issue is not going to be under or over population for much longer - but a complete absence of jobs and purpose as AI develops and most work becomes obsolete.

And dare I say it, a potential huge chasm of those with purpose and viable employment and those that are totally left behind. You think the Industrial Revolution created problems, that is going to be nothing compared to the 4th revolution that is just beginning.

We should be culling birth rates in anticipation, and schools and students should be considering how AI might affect them and future careers.

It is the creep affect, supermarkets now have more and more self service tills, same with fast food outlets, passport gates, car parks, flight desks etc. It’s already happening everywhere.

🤣🤣🤣
Why are you so judgemental?
Who are you to say that the only way living a ’worthy’ life is to pop out kids and waisting rest of your life taking care of them and after other people’s kids?
Are you one of those people who thinks there should be ’a village’ where everyone panders you and your kids?

What does it matter what anyone does, as long as they aren’t problematic (which so many people are).

Care to elaborate? Your post makes no sense.

I was agreeing with your Jesus wept sentiment. Thought it would be obvious from my posting history.

Thank you! 🙏🏻

:-)

That is EXACTLY what you have said op. You are worried about decline. But the opposite is true. 30 pages in - we finally get there. It is a terrible idea for all the reasons listed.

We should be culling birth rates in anticipation, and schools and students should be considering how AI might affect them and future careers

How would you proper to cull them further?

I don't subscribe to the view that AI will take the load of carers etc. That will be only for those who can afford it.

sorry, propose.

You increase happiness and contentment by increasing living standards, and you do that by having productive, sustainable, stable, safe societies!!!!

What's sustainable about a society that is largely older people with fewer resources?