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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Do you find this offensive?

659 replies

Meeting · 25/05/2023 12:55

The Theatre Royal Stratford East is putting on a show and have blocked out 2 dates as "Blackout" nights where they encourage (but I don't think plan to enforce) that only black people may attend these performances.

I saw them discussing it on Piers Morgan and neither of the guests advocating for it were able to convince me that this type of segregation was at all beneficial.

Does anybody think this is a good idea? Personally I think segregation based on skin colour has no place in society, no matter who benefits from it. But I'm interested to hear from others who might away it differently?

OP posts:
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8
Hadjab · 25/05/2023 16:56

CampervanKween · 25/05/2023 15:20

And yes, my son keeps sending me adverts for job applications he would have been interested in applying for except the criteria specifically states he is not allowed to apply.

I'd be interested to see these jobs he's applying for. Are they specifically saying he's not allowed to apply - which I'm sure is illegal - or are they saying they welcome applicants from X, Y & Z groups?

StayingZenInTheVipersDen · 25/05/2023 16:57

Doesn't affect me at all. I assume there's a reason for this and it doesn't bother me. (I'm a white woman fwiw)

Ponderosamum · 25/05/2023 16:58

JustBeKindItsEasy · 25/05/2023 16:17

Well I’m glad to hear I’m not the only black person with this opinion.
A PP assumed I was white because of my thoughts on the subject. Which I find rather sad.

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This. if this were reversed it would be flamed completely as racist. It cust both ways in my opinion.

Hadjab · 25/05/2023 17:02

Babdoc · 25/05/2023 15:35

Many couples in the UK, and especially London, are mixed race. How black do they have to be to be acceptable on the blackout night? And if one of them is white, do they have to go to the theatre on different nights? The organisers don’t seem to have thought this through for a multicultural society like Britain.

Oh my life! You are being deliberately obtuse, aren't you? It's one sodding night out of thirty, no one is saying no whites allowed, at any point! And if the couple is mixed race, presumably one half wouldn't be blind to their partner's experiences, so they would probably go to support them anyway.

FFS

NewPinkJacket · 25/05/2023 17:02

Meeting · 25/05/2023 13:02

Something to do with the context of the show I think

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I'm embarrassed for you that you were in such a rush to be offended, you didn't even research it properly so you could answer this very simple question.

Hadjab · 25/05/2023 17:06

Babdoc · 25/05/2023 16:45

So if my white sister and her black African husband were only able to see the show on a blackout night, she’d have to
miss out on it in order to not spoil the black audience’s enjoyment of their freedom from “white gaze”? Or go along, and feel uncomfortable knowing that the organisers preferred her not to be there?

Your white sister could go along and feel uncomfortable that her black husband and people like him have been subjected to the sort of shit that has lead to this point, and maybe be an advocate for change.

JustBeKindItsEasy · 25/05/2023 17:11

Hadjab · 25/05/2023 17:06

Your white sister could go along and feel uncomfortable that her black husband and people like him have been subjected to the sort of shit that has lead to this point, and maybe be an advocate for change.

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But this isn’t about advocating change. This is regressive.

JustBeKindItsEasy · 25/05/2023 17:13

Sissynova · 25/05/2023 14:41

Can't you just be racist without being called a racist these days??

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I think if you’re racist you’re racist whether you’re called it or not.
Or am I not understanding your comment ?

bryceQ · 25/05/2023 17:13

Babdoc · 25/05/2023 16:45

So if my white sister and her black African husband were only able to see the show on a blackout night, she’d have to
miss out on it in order to not spoil the black audience’s enjoyment of their freedom from “white gaze”? Or go along, and feel uncomfortable knowing that the organisers preferred her not to be there?

🙄🙄🙄

As another white woman with a black husband I would hope I have the insight to see that supporting spaces so that black men and women feel comfortable is progressive. I want my black friends and husband to have spaces free from judgement and I wouldn't centre myself. Seeing the absolute bullshit my husband deals with on a daily basis, anything that helps him feel comfortable in a setting like the theatre I am massively in favour of.

ancientgran · 25/05/2023 17:16

ocs30 · 25/05/2023 16:33

I would imagine that Martin Luther King Jr. would be more concerned with the amount of systemic racism and the rising tide of fascism in the world than a night at the theatre.

As a white woman, I don't tend to comment on these threads, but I do think it's very telling that whenever someone posts on here asking if something is racist, there's always a pile on of people shouting that it's not, and the poster is oversensitive (before rushing off to the feminism forum to rant about men taking over women's spaces).

Gives me a clearer understanding of why a safe space might be desirable in this instance.

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Do you think black people don't go to the theatre because white people do? I don't really understand that, my black husband does well he did before he was disabled, my mixed race kids do.

thedancingbear · 25/05/2023 17:16

Women-only spaces - vital

black-only spaces - offensive and discriminatory

cheers for clarifying, MN.

Iwasafool · 25/05/2023 17:18

thedancingbear · 25/05/2023 17:16

Women-only spaces - vital

black-only spaces - offensive and discriminatory

cheers for clarifying, MN.

Not all of us think women only spaces are vital.

MoggyMittens23 · 25/05/2023 17:20

This night sold out very quickly didn't it? So whether white people deem this necessary or not, clearly it is! It is obviously something that is wanted by black people. And that's OK.

Skinnydogz · 25/05/2023 17:23

But white people are banned are they. . .

Skinnydogz · 25/05/2023 17:24

Oops I mean aren't banned

afaloren · 25/05/2023 17:25

No, in the same way I don’t think women-only events are offensive.

Ohalpro · 25/05/2023 17:31

It offends me that anyone would watch well known misogynist and phone hacker Piers Morgan, let alone take what he has to say as anything but a cynical publicity stunt trading on lies and hate. You’ve been played, op.

Original poster
Meeting · 25/05/2023 17:32

Well my mind remains unchanged. I still think it's divisive and creates a feeling of "us and them" that people have spent years trying to get rid of.

OP posts:
Gtsr443 · 25/05/2023 17:34

Meh. I see nothing wrong with this.

Whatever gets bums on seats.
But a cynic would say it was designed to show funding bodies they're meeting their diversity obligations. Despite their local demographic Stratford East's audiences for live theatre are very white and funding bodies really don't like that.

BadNomad · 25/05/2023 17:37

Meeting · 25/05/2023 17:32

Well my mind remains unchanged. I still think it's divisive and creates a feeling of "us and them" that people have spent years trying to get rid of.

As long as you don't feel left you, it doesn't matter if they miss out. Is that what this comes down to? Your feelings are more important?

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 25/05/2023 17:39

MasterBeth · 25/05/2023 16:06

Segregation was the forced enactment of US racism under the law. Black Americans were forced permanently into inferior schools, hospitals, housing etc. They were not allowed to share the same bus seats or theatre seats at all. They were denied a full vote until 1965.

This is a voluntary gathering of black people to watch a play that reflects their experience of racism. In every other performance, mixed audiences can watch and learn together. In one performance, white audiences are asked to voluntarily abstain from the show so that black audiences can watch it in a different context.

These things are not the same.

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This.
Not the same in the slightest , don't know how people aren't getting that.

MrsAnonstrikesagain · 25/05/2023 17:43

Are they going to make sure that the black people attending, actually have the correct heritage pertaining to the show?

Because if not, the whole thing is a farce.

My DIL is black - she was born and raised in India. She has zero in common with the characters in Tambo and Bone. Totally different heritage. But she is certainly black.

I am white - I have no shared heritage with literally millions of other white people, who are from other cultures.

Black and white is a skin tone - it does not mean that you are from the same race, culture or heritage.

mainsfed · 25/05/2023 17:44

I saw them discussing it on Piers Morgan and neither of the guests advocating for it were able to convince me that this type of segregation was at all beneficial.

It’s not segregation, there are eleventy billion days non-black people can go.

They’re after the black pound, just as many companies are after the Muslim pound.

It’s good old commercialism and I’m fine with it.

mainsfed · 25/05/2023 17:45

Meeting · 25/05/2023 13:12

I'm a gypsy and I can't count the amount of times that I've been refused entry or service due to my race. I don't want 'gypsy only' nights. I just want to be equal.

But you can pass for white, black people can’t.

You have privilege.

BadNomad · 25/05/2023 17:48

My DIL is black - she was born and raised in India. She has zero in common with the characters in Tambo and Bone. Totally different heritage. But she is certainly black.

Is she being forced to go to the Blackout showing? No. So whether she is black or not doesn't matter. If she doesn't feel like this would benefit her then she doesn't have to go. They're not saying black people can ONLY go on these two nights.