MIL excludes me from conversations

[Gemmabw]

My relationship with my MIL is starting to make me feel stressed and unhappy and I dread seeing her mainly because she completely excludes me from conversations by speaking in her first language with my husband even when they are talking about me or my daughter.

Some background: MIL lives in the UK and has done for 45 years. Her English isn't perfect but she can sustain a conversation and understand as long as people aren't speaking very quickly or with a lot of slang /accent she doesn't know.

She has always just spoken to my husband in her first language (he was born in the UK and is fully bilingual) and makes very little effort to speak to me in English. I have a very basic level of competency in her language - not enough to follow or join in with a natural conversation.

Before we had a baby I didn't really care all that much as she lives about 3 hours away and we used to visit a couple of times a year. I'd grin and bear it and accept that it was her home, her right to speak whatever language she chose and it would just be a long and not very fun visit for me. We were together for over 10 years before baby and I rarely saw MIL so it was no big deal .

Since DD arrived a year ago, she has wanted to see her every 4-6 weeks and has started coming to visit us (she never did this before).
She'll be polite and greet me, ask how I am etc. but mainly ignores me for the 2-3 days that she stays with us and only speaks to DH. When she plays with DD she speaks to her in her own language.

What's upset me is that now the visits are much more frequent it seems like it's more difficult to just grin and bear it. I know that the conversation is often about DD and I frequently hear my name and my daughter's name come up. I love taking about my LO (who doesn't!?) and it would be such an easy way for us to build a better relationship but she doesn't say much back when I start a conversation and addresses all questions/comments to my husband.

When I've tried to broach this with DH he gets very defensive and says it's no different to me and my mum having a conversation about something from my childhood or someone he doesn't know or a topic that interests us but not him. I don't feel it's the same because he understands everything we are saying and has a choice if he takes part in the conversation.
I now dread her visits and DH says I just don't like her.

Am I being unreasonable or is MIL's (and DH's) behaviour just rude?

This woman is staying three days every four weeks?

I’d tell my husband that due to her rudeness towards me, she wasn’t welcome any more frequently than every three or six months. And I think even that is too frequent.

As the baby gets older, he can take the baby to visit his mother and you can stay at home.

YABU, it would be to your daughter's benefit for.you to learn the language. If you stop your husband and your MIL talking in the language it may limit your daughter's chance to learn the language.

100% this. Learn the language - you've had a decade.
But let your daughter learn it. A second language is invaluable.

MIL has had FOUR decades to learn. If she had, she could teach her granddaughter. That would have been a lovely thing for her to do and would have been a nice shared activity for the granddaughter to learn about her grandmas childhood, experience of growing up in another culture and a different lifestyle. OP cannot give her that as she doesn’t have experience of it.

I think it’s unreasonable to demand she speaks English 100% of the time but of course she should make the effort with you while she’s staying at your house. Your husband should be the one translating, it sounds like he is the main issue. Is he dismissive of your feelings in other ways?
Your DD won’t learn the other language unless her dad speaks it to her too.

Hm, as a mother to bilingual children living where English is the minority language, this is kind of how I feel, I'm afraid.

For bilingualism to work, it's important to have consistent input in the minority language. (I assume your dh speaks his language with your dd?) It's actually a good thing that she has another regular-ish source of that language, as it it easier to raise a truly bilingual speaker if you have more than one speaker's input.

I certainly wouldn't be doing any putting down of feet. I might ask, when your name is mentioned, 'oh, what was that?' nicely but directly. In a genuine three-way conversation, not just you overhearing what she's saying to your dd while you're there, obviously you should have the means to understand.

Do you think she's being unpleasant about you?

I live in Spain and my spanish is OK but not fluent. If I was talking to my child I would use my native language as its easier. It's exhausting speaking in a different language if you aren't fluent.

Have you asked her what she has just said? Perhaps she needs reminding that you don't understand

It’s deeply unnatural to speak to someone in a language you don’t usually speak to them in, even if you’re fluent — I speak fluent French, but know my closest French and Swiss friends from an Anglophone university environment in the UK, so we’ve always spoken English together, whatever country we’re in. To speak French with them would feel all wrong. And for whatever reason, timidity, lack of exposure to English speakers, poor at languages etc, your MIL is far from fluent in English.

I do think this encapsulates a lot of the attitudes on here. There's definitely a sense of English 'naturally' taking priority in some of these posts, and a lack of awareness of bilingualism as a concept and indeed as something desirable. People can in fact have more than one first language - as the OP's dh does

@swayingpalmtree OP has also had a decade to learn, and OP's DH has been learning his whole life. What OP's MIL has or hasn't done should have no bearing on their daughter's opportunities

It's rude of your mil

It's crap of your husband not to include you

I would probably use the time to go and do something for me if I was being excluded

What happens if you say, what are you talking about? Or you just start talking in English?

Hi OP
I’m going to give you my experience with this. My husband has lived here for 15 years roughly and we’ve been together for 8.5. No children yet. We used to live with his family for 4 years and we all got along well. We house shared with some of his family who all spoke English fluently for many years.

The issue was that they would always talk in their native language to eachother. I would hear my name pop up and it really upset me as I didn’t know what they were talking about. They have lived here for 25+ years. It’s just more comfortable for them to communicate in their own language. But when I was in the room, seeing as we are in England and they chose to come and live here, they should have tried to make me feel included. Now… if I had moved to his country, I would never expect his family to have to learn English. It wouldn’t even enter my head. So in my opinion if there is an English speaker in the room, and you are also fluent, and in that country it’s only polite to try to speak in that language.

My in-laws do this, maybe a mixture. For example, if we are all meeting for coffee, there will be mostly English speaking as they have invited us both out for coffee, to sit there and exclude me would be rude… however, if his family are visiting from abroad (who do not speak English or very little compared to someone who is fluent) they will always communicate in their home language. I always want to make people feel welcome, so if we have a visitor I understand that the chat will not be in English but every now and then my husband will translate what they are talking about which helps me to feel included too. I never expected it but it’s nice of him to do so to include me.

It can be difficult spending time with my parent inlaws because they are lovely people but unfortunately we can barely communicate. I’ve asked my husband to help me learn his language because it’s not a well known language and it’s not available on any of the online learning courses. He finds it hard to teach me. So I can say basic things such as hello, how are you, good morning, good night etc. I’m good with words but find it hard to learn full sentences. I don’t know anyone who married someone from their country who has learned their language apart from the odd phrase or word, it’s just too difficult as their language is not popular, so there aren’t many resources to learn.

So my sister in law demands everyone speaks English and she will remind them if they all forget, I think a nice balance is good. I always go by the rule that if you invite us out for dinner, assuming everyone at the table speaks English, then they should all speak in English otherwise there really was no point in inviting me too. If there is someone at the table who doesn’t speak English, we do 50/50, so it is fair for everyone. I would suggest that it’s obvious your MIL is doing this to be rude. A nice balance would be respectful, especially in your house. Asking her son the odd quick question in their language isn’t the issue, but chit chatting long term while you are also in the room, and you are all fluent, tells me she’s not even trying to make an effort. If my in-laws COULD speak English they would love to get to know me better. It’s obvious she doesn’t care, I’d stop making as much effort to accommodate her so much. If it’s going to make you feel awkward in your own home. I suspect when we have our own children it will allow me to learn more, as I would also want to encourage our child to learn.

I disagree that it’s deliberately rude.

Your DH and yourMIL are speakers of the other language. it doesn’t matter that he speaks English as well, his natural language to speak to his mother is the other language, so it stands to reason that when they’re together they will speak in that language.

And English isn’t your MIL’s first language. It’s unrealistic to expect someone to speak in a language which isn’t native to them for an extended period of time. Having an understanding of a language isn’t the same as speaking it as a native.

I speak English and Afrikaans both on the same level. Am English but grew up in an entirely Afrikaans speaking environment, went to an Afrikaans speaking boarding school, so essentially lived in that environment. My Afrikaans is as good as and was in fact better than my English when I still lived over there. I could conduct a conversation equally in either language, as, I’m assuming, can your DH in both the languages he speaks.

My sister however went to an English speaking school where Afrikaans was taught, and although she speaks it, she by no means speaks it on my level, and although she could have a conversation, she absolutely couldn’t spend a weekend in the company of Afrikaans speaking people and be expected to spend the entire weekend speaking Afrikaans.

This is no different for your MIL. And for your DH, he has grown up speaking that language, it’s not natural for him to suddenly start speaking to his mum in English. In fact it likely won’t stay natural for him to speak to his DD in English either if she’s going to be bilingual.

I genuinely think that if you marry someone who speaks another language then you should learn that language in the same way that they should be able to speak English.

And I think that if you have a bilingual child, then it’s unwise to exclude yourself by not being able to converse with that child in either language, even if it’s only on a conversational level.

Even though your MIL has lived here for a long time that doesn’t necessarily mean that she likes it or that speaking English doesn’t make her head hurt.

It is very rude when people exclude the one person in the room who doesn’t speak the language. But there may be an element of you get to speak your language everywhere you go. How many people does your MIL know who she can speak to in her language?

Your child will benefit if they can grow up bilingual. In future you may find your child speaking a language that you don’t understand.

The only solution really is to suck it up and learn the language. You don’t need to be fluent. Just focus on increasing your comprehension level and telling your MIL that she can speak to you in her language but you will need to reply in English. Switching between languages is common in communities where people speak several.

I would suggest finding a language learning app such as duolingo. If you feel left out and they’re chatting, go within earshot (but not too loud) and start learning the language. She may pick up on the sounds of her language coming from your phone and respond to your interest.

I love that people are saying ‘learn the language’ like it’s the easiest thing in the world. It’s not. It’s especially not with a baby. It’s especially not with young kids and a job. It’s much easier if you’ve been in the country for years and years, with grown up children, like, oh, your MIL.

Its rude to exclude someone in this manner.

Of course it does if she is talking about her in front of her and noone is translating. Irs rude AF

My H is not British and speaks another language. My MIL lives abroad and cannot speak english. I dont expect her to because she doesnt live here. However, whenever we are together, H translates and Ive tried to pick up a bit of the language. I would find it incredibly rude to be left out of long conversations where I am mentioned and DH always tries to translate to ensure I am included. Equally, if I am talking to DH he will translate for MIL. If he didnt do that I would feel just as pissed off.

I think it is rude and your husband is very dismissive.

She is visiting very regularly and this will not work if this continues.

Be wary of a husband who cares so little for making an effort to include you.

This is your home too, but it doesn't sound like it.

It feels like you're all using language as a weapon (within OP's family) tbh. You and your MIL (and possibly your DH too) are using it as a passive aggressive way to signal that each of you is unhappy about someone else's attitude!

Yes it's rude to have conversations in your hearing that you can't understand (wouldn't be rude to do it sometimes but it is rude to do it 99% of the time). But it is also rude and passive aggressive of you to have made no attempt to learn your husband's family's language.

The couples I know who speak different languages from birth have all made serious efforts (night schools, language courses, speaking the other language exclusively on holiday etc) to become properly fluent.

And yes it's a huge boon for your baby to learn a second language from birth. Massive, massive plus for their cognition and facility with language as they grow older.

Put some serious effort into learning their language and then show them the results. And then (maybe in their language!) tell them you'd really appreciate it if they met you halfway when they're in your house.

The husband is bilingual. He has 2 languages. Not simply English.

Op I'm bilingual i rarely speak my native tongue when dh is around (who doesn't speak it at all)

I am in 2 minds here if the intention is to bring up dd bilingual then she needs to hear the minority luange spoken. However I feel your dh is not supportive here. I translate to dh if he is spoken of in my birth language to keep him included. Could dh do this?

Of course it does if she is talking about her in front of her and noone is translating. Irs rude AF

I think it's rude AF to marry into a family that primarily interact in another language and make no effort to learn it to be able to communicate with them

You have a husband problem. If DMiL speaks to your DH whilst you're in the room, he should respond in english or translate for you. Deliberately excluding you from their conversation for 3 days in your own home is downright rude.

I would start asking your husband to translate every single thing your MIL says, on the pretence of wanting to join in and be friendly with your MiL. He’ll soon get totally fed up with the situation 😆

It's so strange that people are saying you're wrong for not learning the language when your MIL has had almost half a century to learn English and she bloody lives in England! It's very difficult to learn a language to fluency or even conversational level when you are not immersed in it. MIL is obviously rude and stubborn if she has lived in the UK for so long and still can't be bothered to include you. It speaks to her character.

What country is she from - anywhere nice? Maybe book yourself a language learning trip there the next time she comes to your house to get away from the horrible cow!