Work and teenagers

[JollySmartie]

I didn't want to derail another thread, but I'm wondering about both parents working full time when their kids reach 12+.
On one hand we read threads asking how at what age can kids be safely left at home, and on another I've just read about a mother being jumped on for not 'just leaving her kids to get on with it' so she can work full time. Kids aged 12-15.

In my experience young teens can get into all sorts of trouble if there isn't a sensible adult around, and so I want to ask what other MNers do with them in the holidays.

It's easier when they are young enough to go to a child care setting. How old are they when this stops? I did a lot of juggling when mine were this age (single mum at the time and with a very unhelpful ex so mostly down to me)

I guess I am asking if I am unreasonable to think it's a lot to ask of teenagers to be totally responsible for themselves and possibly tween-age siblings whilst their parents are working full time.

And what do/did other parents do really. I'm curious but also a bit shocked, especially when youngsters do get into a pickle, and people are all outraged and saying 'where were their parents?!)

I work full-time, single parent. Two teens, 1 pre-teen.

It is much harder at this age when they were younger. Back then, I paid for childcare / clubs & that was it - and of course engaged with my kids & their lives after work / weekends.

Now, I feel I'm dropping the ball a lot. They are so busy with sports, competitions, parties, trips & trying to keep up with all of that is hectic. There are friendship & emotional issues, school matters, study & subject choices, p/t work arrangements ... 😩

All that said, I need to work, I like to work, full-time is a necessity, so I just keep going & hope I'm doing enough. Undoubtedly they need you more at this age though.

In the holidays they did schemes arranged through their school - mainly sports. This carried on through to A level age. Both are very keen on sport.
We don’t have family living in the uk but DT’s visited our families in Belgium, France, US and Canada regularly during school holidays- good chance to see grandparents and cousins.

I'm a lone parent, so not working is out of the question. We don't have the luxury of choice. If I stayed home on benefits I'd get slagged off for that too, so we can't win.

I have a 15 year old. In answer to your question about the holidays, I work from home on Mondays and Thursdays and my mum has Tuesdays off so she comes over to mine just to be present. I usually work longer days Monday to Thursday so I can then finish at 1pm on Fridays to be home earlier. So he's only really home alone for a full day one day a week on Wednesdays. Been doing this since he was 13, I sent him to holiday club on Wednesdays before that, he hated it but needs must.

@JollySmartie I would always advocate some work of some sort for financial resilience, pension, career post kids and general well-being and self esteem!

Taking 20 years off really penalises (mostly) women and leaves them vulnerable should they become widowed or divorced or if the sole earner loses their job etc.

Dd had been doing sailing camps since age 6, started out as 1 week (among many different camps) over the summer and expanded to 4+ weeks most years. By the time she was a teen, we had joined local yacht club and she spent a lot of time there with other friends.

She had 10 days away at Scout camp.

She also did 1 or 2 weeks of hockey camps. Although there wasn't scope for hanging around so much with those as they tended to be much more fluid " meet at this camp and never again" groups.

Initially she also spent a week visiting DGPs, but that faded away due to covid.

We also had 1-2 weeks of family holiday.

So she really only had the very first week and very last week of hols to fill. 1st week she spent a lot of time sleeping and quietly changing from school to summer routine. Last week was all about sorting herself for new term and catching up on video games, some extra sleep etc.

Last year, she didn't do much in camps, a single week in Netherlands at a hockey camp (she doesn't do languages or she'd have done a residential for 2-3 weeks). But she had twice weekly hockey training and a fitness programme to follow. She was going down to yacht club a bit. And needed a chance to unwind after the year.

This year, she has 1 week hockey camp booked (back to Netherlands), but has found herself a job in the city teaching water sports the rest of the summer.

She's now 17 and I had been back at work pretty much ft since she was 4 months old (stat Mat leave at the time), but while I have had a few summers where I've taken 5/6 weeks off using parental leave, she still wanted to do the camps and clubs so she'd head off every morning to those.

I went up to 4 full days a week when DS was about 10. It was tricky for the summers aged 10-12 as they aren't old enough to leave alone, but a bit too old for organised holiday care.

Post that it gets a bit easier in the holidays, but still a bit of a juggle for needing dropped off somewhere during the day.

I'm still 4 days - but may have to change soon as work have decided to get rid of any perks - and I find it helpful to have a bit of breathing space for when he wants to talk to us ( age 17) or needs input for researching open days or practicing driving.

Oh and during school year, she had gone to after school in primary until 5th class when a bullying issue meant we had to change. So for 6th class, she would do extra-curricular activities every afternoon and come home herself at 4pm, I'd be in around 6. We built up to that but she did homework, cooked herself a snack and watched tv mostly.

In secondary, she did sports in the afternoons or study. She asked on early 2nd year to have evening suppers in school at 6 and stay on for supervised study. Which she did every year since except 4th year when the transition year programme meant no need for study. This year, it's been a combination of sports and study in the afternoons and evenings (ladies hockey team trains twice a week in school), and 1 evening she comes home after supper and goes back out to the gym.

You can do either

• after school/college
• when you randomly take the afternoon off after school/college
• when you sleepover a friend of the same sex house but you don't spend your entire time there
• etc

Teens who want to get up to no good are inventive.

I have a nearly 16 year old and 12 year old. I have a hybrid situation so WFH some days, my DH can WFH but has to work away quite a bit in the week so it is a good job I have the flexibility I do.

My DS is currently sitting the GCSE exams that he is pretty good at either revising for and he's got a good memory so perhaps doesn't need to revise as much as some. However, this week it has been getting him up for the 8am free pastry breakfast at school and quick revision session before 9am. He is pretty bad at getting up and I'm not sure he would have got to the 8am breakfast which has been helpful to him.

I do rely on him a bit after school to be with my 12 year old until I get home from work on the office days but it is not usually beyond 6.30. I feel even WFH it is not that helpful on the holidays as DD wants to do things but sometimes I'm working. The plan for summer is a 2 week holiday and one week summer drama group run by her weekly theatre school. However, that leaves about 3 weeks where I am around but can't take her out for the day. She can and probably will get the bus with friends in to town and to the beach but that worries me even more as I don't want her to go swimming in the sea without us nearby. DS is going to get a summer job so he won't be around to take her out.

Teens who want to get up to no good are inventive

They don’t need to be though when they have an unoccupied house through the day.

I totally agree. I never said anyone shouldn't work. I just said it's a shame that it's not possible to go part time for many families.
However I do think that if full time work is purely for luxuries or just to stop 'poor DH' feeling hard done by, it's equally possible to be a bit more inventive about living a simpler live and being more frugal, if that's what suits a particular family best.

I can't drive. No taxi service here. DS uses his feet, the bus or an uber.

I think it can be a chicken and egg scenario though as IMO the holiday activities that are a week long, like my DD's theatre group or a tennis/sport activity week, tend to be expensive and you need to be earning good money to pay for these kind of activities. I had a term time job until my youngest was 10 as it gave us freedom in the long summer breaks to see my Mum who is 4 hours away but lives in a beautiful area and they just wanted to play still and things were pretty cheap, paddling pools, water fights, big parks still but the things that are of interest to them now not material objects but activities like the summer theatre workshop are not cheap and they don't want to just sit around at home so I have to work full time.

It's the same in term time, I'd rather my DD took part in the theatre group every weekend for 3 hrs and that she has piano lessons and that DS has guitar lessons as IMO it is a better use of time than always being at the shops or not doing anything particularly productive. I'm lucky in that my DC love playing instruments, in fact I need to stop DS going on his guitar to get him to revise for his GCSE exams, so it is not forced as DD desperate to do the drama group and she has talent but it costs money, quite a bit and there is no way we could afford these things with me not full time.

That's a very interesting perspective @Goldenbear, thank you!

@Beezknees I apologise if you thought I was slagging you or anyone off. I hear you, and understand the difficulties, as I faced the same 💐

@Parker231 i think having two the same age makes this easier …. I have twins and it was a comfort to think they were together when travelling to school/home alone.

I'm very happy to read all the replies. They have given me a lot to think about.
I've noticed that governments are now busy encouraging women to have more children, as they now foresee disruption to civilization as we know it, as birthrate has dropped. I think this pleases many people on an environmental level, but its less good in terms of an increasing population of elderly people.
So with costs of living/childcare/summer activities etc, it seems that there will need to be changes made. If I was starting my family now, I would consider having one only. Of my own children, only one wants children of their own. It's a very interesting conundrum.

I think a 12 year old should be able to be left alone for the few hours between returning from school and coming home from work. Leaving them all through the summer holidays isn't ideal, although I did it for quite a few of the weeks at that age and a bit younger. I remember sleeping late and watching a lot of films.

Yes, all of this was what I was aiming to get at in my first post. Thank you!

It’s less of an issue for the sporty, musical, drama etc kids who spend their time after school doing those activities locally (and travelling independently) or attend a school where those activities are readily available to all.

Its the many, many other teens - what’s their exp?

@dameofdilemma yes, it goes back a bit to the chicken and the egg situation. I'd like to know the answer to your question too.
Certainly more than ever, young people need to be taking into account future childcare needs when considering a career. Not something I considered at all!
Not a criticism, but the things pp teens on this thread do definitely cost a lot of money.
It's very difficult now, I think, although previous eras were difficult in their own ways too.

I think it’s probably helpful to look at the stats here. Most families in the UK do not have two full time working parents and although mothers of teenagers are more likely to work full time than mothers of younger children, it is still slightly less than 50% in full time employment.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/articles/familiesandthelabourmarketengland/2021#:~:text=In%20April%20to%20June%202021%2C%2050.4%25%20of%20working%20families%20had,and%20their%20partner%20part%2Dtime.

I would add that my DC's state secondary school has great club provisions, there's usually more than one club on offer after school every day, early morning in some cases so yoga at 8am is an example, script writing, design where they provide materials to make stuff, my DD has made three bags this term in that after school club with help using the sewing machine. Thes clubs are all free. Even the pastries and coffee/tea provision being laid on at 8am thoughtout the exam period is unusual I think as I am a consultant and work with schools and know that they don't offer this stuff across the board. It is luck of the draw in that regard.

That's actually really surprising as a statistic for mothers of teenagers.