School fees have risen by 19% in the space of 12 months

[Findingfactsaboutfees]

AIBU to think this is outrageous ?! Fees are exorbitant anyhow and in the last 12 months we have had an increase of 19% by way of 2 increases in a 12 month period. Fees per year for the senior school are £16690 per year and do not include state of the art facilities as other local schools do. The junior school fees aren't much less either! This is a school in the north of England. If you are paying for education, where are you based and how much do you pay? I wonder whether it is comparable.

Private education will only be for the ultra-rich if fees continue to rise at the rate that they are. It is unsustainable for most working professionals who are comfortable but not ultra-wealthy! Parents locally have tried to take their children out but can't as there are no state school places to be had within a 12 mile radius. The only other option is home schooling which isn't possible when the parents are working full time. We're not yet at the point where we are thinking of taking our child out of school but hearing the plight of those who are in the process of trying to is worrying. I've always been a labour voter but if they do go ahead with the introduction of VAT, I fear it's going to get even worse.

Here’s the rest OP

Finally
I think so anyway
There are many blogs, accountants and lawyers offering advice.
This is from Money Matters

The rest of the article OP

You think they don’t pay VAT on just about everything they buy?

All those who claim benefits with no income pay £0 tax!
Isn't that obvious

Not really, since some benefits (like carers allowance, new style ESA and Jobseeker's Allowance for example) are taxable, isn't that obvious?

Sweetheart, she was specifically asked to "check the dictionary".

We have seen that on this thread you aren't comfortable with having your assertions challenged with evidence, and you resort to insults rather than presenting your one evidence. You attempt both logos and particularly ethos without presenting receipts.

It's quite fascinating.

Again, I think you need to do a little more investigation into your sources if you are hoping to have them accepted as authoritative.

I'm talking about a scenario where the options are between a bad state school vs private school.
Can I ask - do you have kids? If you had the money to send your kid to an excellent private school - and your two choices are a bad state school or a private school which would you go for?

That's my situation. Primary option is OFSTED inadequate- twice in a row. Why on earth would I pick that instead of sending my kid to a good private school when I can afford it.

Am I supposed to say oh I have these principles and think about other disadvantaged kids instead of my own?

I'd be glad to send my kids to a good state school but right now we don't have a government that's interested in improving the education in this country so if you feel so strongly about private schools then you need petition or protest.

Also the state education in the UK really isn't anything to shout about compared to many Asian countries, and I'm happy to spend my money giving my child the best education.

Taking you seriously for a moment:

Your argument relies on the assumption that not sending your child to a state school is an unarguable public good.

As this thread has demonstrated, that assertion is deeply contentious, so your argument cannot rest on it without first proving it.

As you know, I haven't advocated any particularly policy positions on private schools or the taxation of them on this thread. I was privately educated myself.

However, it is clear that the idea of private education as a public good simply on the basis that it saves the state some money is a very simplistic argument, that does bot take into account quite contentious debates on social inequality, the impact on state schools of a rapidly falling school age population, and other issues that have been raised on this thread at the very least need examining and, where possible quantifying, before choosing private education could reliably be deployed in an argument as a public good.

Another thought OP
is to mix it up
If you think your dc can manage that, some do.

How are they making it easier?

Though we are all of course enjoying the picspam, for those who are interested in some of the economic and policy arguments around the issue of the social detriments of our current educational model, this report from noted leftists the Institute for Fiscal Studies is well worth a read. Packed with fascinating evidence and interesting arguments.

I put it as a link; I'm pretty sure folks can handle that.

How are they making it easier?

Independent schools, despite being businesses, are treated as charities, thereby giving them a variety of tax advantages. The Labour Party has suggested removing the charitable status and imposing 20% VAT on fees. The charitable status and failure to apply the taxation rules for any other business make independent schools more affordable, ie easier for parents to afford the fees.

Ah I see. Did not know this, thank you.

Isn't it a good thing if more people can afford it so it's not only for the super rich Boris Johnson types?

Wouldn't such a big tax punish the aspirational middle income?

I think it depends on how you're defining 'middle income'. The IFS report I shared and evidence shared upthread demonstrates that the families who are currently accessing private education are at the very top end of the top income decile.

Sorry, I should have been more precise - the overwhelming majority are in that cohort; there are of course outliers.

I guess it also differs from county? Where I'm at the private school is mainly working professionals and second generation immigrants - not really the old money sort.

Independent schools, despite being businesses, are treated as charities

How many schools have shareholders who are expecting a share of profits at the end of every school year?

That data is on a national level, yes. I don't think I've seen any regional breakdowns.

Is old money worth more than new money?

That's quite a complex question, isn't it? Certainly there is a significant number of private schools that make significant profits on the operations abroad, which are predicated on the strength of their UK brands.

@JassyRadlett
By Old money I mean people who are very rich or have trust funds they'd be able to afford a high tax so the top schools would only be easily available to them.

I didn't mention new money, I'm talking about professionals who can comfortably afford or happy to cut back (such as myself) to afford a private school.

Yes, you mentioned old money and I wondered why you thought it was relevant in a discussion about household income levels?

It is very difficult to see how you could argue that any but a very few households who send their children to private schools could be considered as 'middle income', either on a national or regional basis, regardless of the source of their income.

The IFS figures are quite useful here - they certainly challenged some of my preconceptions.

Talking about taxes - why does the Royal Family get to go to private schools and top universities sponsored by tax payers.Even with lousy grades.

Maybe if we got rid of the monarchy and all this aristocracy nonsense that will pave the way to more equality in state education.

I'd like to see William's kids in a state school.

@JassyRadlett
English isn't my first language so maybe the way I'm expressing old money is different to what you understand it to be.

That's fair. I don't think it's particularly relevant when talking about middle incomes though?