To be annoyed that private school parents are demonised?

[Imsorryyoufeelthatway]

Starting this threat to vent and as an antidote to the Closing all private schools would benefit state schools thread. In short, I'm a bit fed up with private school parents being bashed for buying a better education for their children, while parents who 'don't believe in private education' and spend a fortune on homes/second homes/rental properties in catchment areas for 'good' state schools then another fortune on tutors seem to get off scot free.

I'm also fed up with private school parents all being lumped in the same category. We're not all selfish, mega-wealthy, Bullingdon Club (or female equivalent, if there was one...) alumni; many of us are ordinary people (I'm a working class lass from a council estate whose parents worked as cleaners and in warehouses) who've worked bloody hard to be able to afford a better start in life for our children than we had. We were the first people in our families to go to university (on full grants, when they existed), the first to have careers not just jobs, and the first to own our own homes. No-one has ever handed us a penny – my DH got the train to university with £4.50 in his pocket and had to get a job straight away to buy food. No bank account, no trust fund, no-one paying his rent. We've managed to achieve social mobility against the odds, yet we're not allowed to celebrate this because we've chosen to invest in our children's future rather than over-priced property in 'good' state school catchment areas.

Yes, we all know that private schools are a major cause of inequality. Parents like us have literally lived and breathed that inequality our whole lives and we'd do anything to prevent our children having to do the same. We think that all children should have access to high quality education in safe, inspirational environments where they can achieve their potential, not just ours. But most state schools in the UK just cannot meet this requirement. We also know that if catchment areas for state schools were mixed-up, and the schools in deprived areas had an influx of children from more affluent areas and vice versa, then this would likely make things more equal over time. But our children are not part of a social experiment. In short, if those of us who had difficult starts in life and went to terrible schools choose to work our arses off so our children don't have to, can't we be given some credit?

So please, the next time you're tempted to lump a private school parents into the same category and give them a bashing, take a moment to consider their reasons and background. Rant over.

The bit about saving the state money, obviously. The source of her annoyance seems to be that she doesn't think the state is spending her taxes very well, or providing good services. Not entirely unreasonable.

I saw an article years ago that argued that privately educated children are more likely to struggle at university as they have had so much help at private school.
I would be reporting that academic.

There is no equal playing field. Privately educated get the best teachers and resources.
My children came out with A* AA with no extra tuition.

I didn't say it was level, that's why top universities weight excellent results from schools that don't normally get students through at that level. But you can't buy the grade, any more than paying for music lessons can buy you a musical child.

This type of thread is very revaling. What it shows is the number of people who simply see education as a means of getting grades, which are a ticket to success. Anybody who pays for it is 'buyin an unfair advantage'. Not much idea of education being of any value more broadly, or desire to improve it for everybody. Says a lot about why Britain is so behind in education compared to other countries.

@Blondewithredlips
"There is no equal playing field. Privately educated get the best teachers and resources."

Resources, yes. Teachers? How are you concluding that? Surely if they were that good, they'd be in a comp on a run down estate working miracles?

Why would a good teacher work in a run down comp as a choice? Better pay and conditions at private school and cheaper fees for their children.

Resources, yes. Teachers? How are you concluding that? Surely if they were that good, they'd be in a comp on a run down estate working miracles

I don't think teachers are any better in private education. Their job is probably easier if they don't need to deal with classroom management. Which doesn't make them any better, but in some ways makes them less skilled, including being less able to teach a variety of children with very different learning needs.

Totally agree with this

@Blondewithredlips

"Why would a good teacher work in a run down comp as a choice? Better pay and conditions at private school and cheaper fees for their children"

Again, then how on earth are you concluding that they're better teachers?

Correct. Any research done with this in mind finds that teachers from 'ordinary' schools can teach comfortably in private whereas teachers in private find the classroom management, differentiation and pastoral requirements of state school overwhelming. They often don't have QTS so haven't even proved themselves in more than one school against the teacher standards.

Because private schools are results driven. No way would a bad maths teacher be tolerated as it would impact on results.

The data set you’re referring to, I think, actually says private school kids are more likely to go to university and get accepted at the top universities / top jobs than State kids (including State grammar kids) even with lower grades.

@Blondewithredlips

If you think state schools are not 'results driven', then you really have no knowledge of education in England. The point remains, you cannot have any reason to think the teachers in private are better, other than a need to justify the ridiculous fees. To fulfil their 'charitable' status they could easily go and demonstrate their superior skills in Friday afternoon double maths, in a local comp.

The best public and private schools keep an eye on results in other schools (including state schools) and head hunt teachers and support staff who are specialists in their area. The computer science teacher at DD’s school is an IT consultant with 20 years experience in finance - she works at the school for lowish pay (and 10% fee discounts) because they’re sponsoring her work permit and teaching qualification.

QTS is just a UK qualification for State schools and most State schools employ as few as they can get away with legally and most of them are managers rather than teachers. Private school teachers don’t need QTS which is how they attract specialist teachers and highly qualified teachers from abroad.

State schools don't stop pupils taking exams if there is a chance the student won't get top grades.
Of course state schools are results driven but not to the extent of private schools.

That's quite repulsive.

It was an article in a newspaper that also mentioned the growth of students at university requiring private tuition otherwise they would have to leave university as they had had so much help at school/tutors that they had done better than they would normally so found themselves struggling at university.

That’s private tuition. Not private school. It tends to be parents of kids in state and private selective schools who do that. Not all private schools are selective

All the private schools in my area are selective.

Yes they do. My DN’s State school has form for this - they have minimum grade and attendance thresholds for all subjects at GCSE and if you don’t meet them you won’t get to sit the exams. I think a lot of State schools have this rule.

Attendance yes but do not think grade.

If a state school gets permission to disapply a child for pupil examinations that child still counts towards percentages, so the only reason to do it is for the child's welfare.

I know of a child at private school who had to take an A level as a private candidate as they thought he would not get a grade that they would be happy with as would reflect badly on school.