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Original poster

Did the UK peak in 2012? Will Britain ever be great again?

92 replies

verdantverdure · 10/04/2023 13:25

In 2012 I had a baby, things seemed optimistic, and I was proud of my country. I'd never even heard of "food banks"

Now everything in this country seems shit, and on a downward trajectory to get worse.

And I haven't even watched Wild Isles episode 6 yet.

What do you think?

Can we pull it back in this country or are we in terminal decline?

YABU Whatchoo talking' about Willis?! Everything is FANTASTIC! Never better.

YANBU We've never had it so bad, and it's probably up to us to make it better.

Did the UK peak in 2012? Will Britain ever be great again?
OP posts:
Original poster
verdantverdure · 13/04/2023 11:07

RichardsGear · 13/04/2023 00:40

Don't know about 2012, but I don't think I'll ever experience the euphoria and optimism of May 1997 again.

Ooh I dunno.

The next one is shaping up to a corker.

OP posts:
Neededanewuserhandle · 13/04/2023 11:13

GudiBrallan · 11/04/2023 15:12

I agree with you, Mavis: "We Brits just can’t have nice things, we’re careless and don’t look after them."
Coming from the continent, so not technically a part of the 'we', but having lived here for 30 years, I feel as if there is something in this. It's as if the British have been dissuaded of the idea of the 'greater good'. The notion of collectivism in even its most watered down forms, and however beneficial to society at large, are treated with suspicion and ridicule. People seem to hate the idea that someone, somewhere might 'get one over' on them or get something 'for free'. So people would rather not support ideas which will benefit the many, if there is the slightest chance that a few, undeserving people will get a free ride. This only applies to the hoi polloi; the 'few' who get a free ride in the upper echelons of society are aspired to.
Lots of British working class people seem to have little affinity with their working class roots and do not percieve themselves as part of a greater class analysis; so many who are really struggling or live in disadvantaged communities vote Conservative, like it's somehow aspirational or like it says something about them not needing anything from anyone, snd as if 'fighting for something' is slightly embarrassing and cringeworthy. Political activism for the sake of preserving and supporting public services is not a given: there is so much online hate for current strike action among public servants.
Brits who take an interest in European politics often laugh at Scandi or northern European politicians, poking fun at their steadiness and 'wooden' delivery, making out they're dull and slow. I'm sure this is because Brits have been slowly conditioned to expect a more populist approach in the political arena, which is a pity.

^This is such a great summary of why we are fucked.

Neededanewuserhandle · 13/04/2023 11:15

beguilingeyes · 13/04/2023 10:29

We have never got over losing the Empire. We still think we're a Superpower and act like it when we're sliding down the ladder of importance and influence more and more.
Rose-tinted nostalgia for the past and our ridiculous feudal class system keep us stuck in our delusions, unable to move on. We're entitled and expect to be treated differently just because. I think Brexit was a direct result of this hankering for the good old days.
The US must laugh at us and the so-called 'Special Relationship '.when we're more like that annoying relative you can't get who keep asking for favours.

99.9% of people in the US have never heard of a "special relationship"

RichardsGear · 14/04/2023 08:22

verdantverdure · 13/04/2023 11:07

Ooh I dunno.

The next one is shaping up to a corker.

Show quote history

I feel like the Labour Party is fucked up though, but don't want to derail.

CampsieGlamper · 14/04/2023 08:28

Amantissima · 11/04/2023 13:45

That was 2011. Early August. I remember particularly well because I was sitting in our ground floor bay window, pregnant, alone (DH was in the US for work) and holding a large stick, watching them come up the road after they'd looted a small retail park a couple of hundred yards down.

Show quote history

Surely peaceful protests against nasty racist police daring to stop innocent drug dealers?

jibbe · 14/04/2023 08:33

Encourage everyone you know to make sure they are in a position to be able to vote particularly the younger generation which the Tory fuckwits are trying to freeze out.

Welcometothehumanrace · 14/04/2023 08:42

I mostly agree, but don't you think the rise of the internet and social media plays a huge part? The constant negative headlines, posts, stories. Kinda compounds the feelings of gloominess. It's unavoidable for the average person. Perhaps in "nicer" times we just weren't as aware of the issues - we only got a filtered version of the headlines, not constant negative sensationalist news stories designed as click bait; compounding the feelings of the nation. Now, fake media and sensationalism is rife. Not saying the issues don't exist; but perhaps ignorance was bliss.

GretaGood · 14/04/2023 08:43

Well we recovered allbeit slowly after 2 world wars. We recovred after the 1978 winter of discontent, we recovered after the miners strike in 1984/5 (or most areas did). We are imv stil recovering from the bank crash of 2008.

NO ONE predicted the Ukraine war.

Covid, austerity too - but we are a very entrepreneurial country and adaptable.

Some of the problems we have eg immigration, housing costs seem to be worldwide.

I do think there is a bit more discussion about the environment, wind technology etc use of cars, etc etc

So I am hopeful.

AintNobodyHateMeBetter · 14/04/2023 08:44

"I asked Google and it said the UK was not in recession in 2012.

2008-9 and 2020 were the last two according to Wikipedia.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ListoffrecessionsinntheUnitedd_Kingdom

The economy did shrink in the last quarter of 2012 and there were fears of a recession."

You do realise the UK was in economic shit for longer than a year right? Google is giving you the economic "definition" of a recession, it's not reflecting the wider macroeconomic factors of that time. You seem quite blinkered to think 2012 was perfect.

GretaGood · 14/04/2023 08:47

Our special relationship with the US meant they sold us arms and ships in the 2nd WW which meant we held out against a German invasion until they came to our aid once Japan attacked them.

The US citizens don't care but it is probaby a good idea from our point of view to keep it up.

Ifailed · 14/04/2023 09:17

The UK has been in decline for over 100 years. As far as our place in the world stands, we should look to other older 'great powers' like Spain to see where we are heading.
We could start by stop trying to be a global military power, or trying to look like one. We don't need aircraft carriers, nuclear weapons and submarines. We don't need to act like the US's poodle and follow them into pointless and ill-thought out wars around the world.
We have few natural resources now, can't feed ourselves without imports and apparently are unable to manufacture any consumer goods. Our economy is propped up by financial shenanigans whereby sleight of hand 'money' is magically produced, and the divide between the haves and have-nots is rapidly looking more like Victorian times.
We need a complete re-set, should move to a federal model (like Germany) whereby we can use the whole country in trade etc where size matters, but for internal affairs devolve power to local areas. We need to address the divide in power, wealth and health which sees the minority skimming off the cream to leave the majority seeing their standard of living (and live-expectancy) go down.
We should be investing in our people & their communities, investing in new and growing technologies and energy sources, the target should be as self-sufficient as possible and not beholden to other powers over which we have no influence.

Mimosa08 · 14/04/2023 09:22

The UK will be the Argentina of the 21st century.
Sadly.

Babyat43q · 14/04/2023 09:24

YANBU - although I don’t agree with “we’ve never had it so bad”. But yes, it has gotten worse since 2012.

crossstitchingnana · 14/04/2023 09:47

I remember the 70s. Power cuts, diminishing ozone layer, 3 day week, strikes runaway inflation. I was a kid but it was awful. Then the unemployment in the early 80s.

crossstitchingnana · 14/04/2023 09:49

Tarantellah · 11/04/2023 14:51

This is the worst economic time I’ve ever lived through. And I lived through the strikes in the 80s where the government dismantled heavy industry and mining etc, and left ex-industrial communities bereft and in poverty with no employment. But at least we weren’t at risk of nuclear war, we had freely available medical and dental care, and reliable benefits for those who couldn’t find work.

Well i remember the 80a and there was a definite threat of nuclear war.

Threads, When the Wind Blows, Two Tribes etc

Riverlee · 14/04/2023 14:06

@Welcometothehumanrace I agree with you regarding social media. In the past, the television, radio or newspapers was how you got news. It wasn’t constant or internet.

An anology I can give it naming babies. You used to get a baby name book from WH Smith, and read it from A to Z. You never really found out which names were the most popular until the top 100 were released at the end of the year. Now that information is at your fingertips, and you can get it instantly.

Crikeyalmighty · 14/04/2023 15:45

@GudiBrallan incredibly accurate. There is indeed a large part of the population with a huge chip on their shoulders, who don't like anything that is for the collective good and delight in the downfall of others. I remember when we explained to an elderly relative (early 80s at the time) that Brexit would be a disaster for our business and industry and his response was 'tough- so be it' this was a guy who got free university, bought his parents council house, and had a very nice non contributory pension. They seem to have a thing about anyone getting something for nothing but not when it's them or their family !!

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