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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that universities giving out unconditionals/nominal offers to everyone just devalues even going or having a degree

197 replies

Saygoodday · 05/04/2023 18:16

DS is applying this year. He’s applied to and got offers from a mixture: 2 RG’s, 2 that require BBC and one post 1992 university that has given him an unconditional offer. Obviously not everyone can be ultra academic and there is a place for vocational qualifications and courses with lower entry requirements within the university system, this is not a case of snobbery or advocating that all universities should require four As. However, Lincoln this year has seemingly given out unconditional offers to literally anyone who has applied, I recently saw another university that would make offers for LLB (hons) Law for 64 UCAS points, etc. Lincoln in particular, it’s about an hour from me, has become a favourite for kids who’ve done no work for their a levels who know they will still get into uni. It’s not just Lincoln there are a big number who will take students basically with any results. To me it doesn’t feel at all fair that those who’ve done no work should get the same qualifications as someone who gets A’s. It feels like it just devalues the whole idea of going to university and getting a degree if you can just get one despite being on for terrible grades in your a-levels. Aibu?

OP posts:
mast0650 · 05/04/2023 18:19

You don't get a degree just by enrolling. You still have to do some work when you get there! The problem is not that the degree is devalued, but that those students might struggle when they get there and not complete their degree, which is not great for anyone.

Piggywaspushed · 05/04/2023 18:22

Lincoln is a rising star ,now has a medical school, and is doing well in league tables . It has a good reputation for a range of subjects. Don't like it; don't choose it. No need to come on here slagging it off and, by extension, its students.

Kanaloa · 05/04/2023 18:26

But that’s not the case? Those who have done no work will not get the same qualifications as those who worked hard, unless they buckle down and work hard at uni. You need to then in assignments and pass exams at uni. Getting in is the easiest bit!

Easterfunbun · 05/04/2023 18:29

Well I never got an A-levels but I completed an OU degree. I mean it’s one thing getting a place on a degree and another thing seeing it through with a good grade.

Artios · 05/04/2023 18:30

I don’t think it devalues the degree itself because they will either work hard and get the qualification, or drop out.

I am guessing the Universities are doing it to get the places filled.

Makes it hard for the 6th forms / colleges though, as students seem to lose the motivation to work hard for their A Levels once they get an unconditional offer….

NewIdeasToday · 05/04/2023 18:41

Unconditional offers have been banned unless they are for a subject where decisions are based on things other than grades eg. an audition or portfolio.

So are you sure the offer is unconditional?

jetadore · 05/04/2023 18:43

Degrees were devalued when the ‘target’ of 50% of people having degrees was introduced on the backward logic that people with degrees have higher salaries. The whole systems money driven now we’re sleepwalking to American style higher education.

MargaretThursday · 05/04/2023 18:45

In the 90s Oxford gave EE offers. I don't think that devalued the degree.

What it is saying is that they have great faith in their ability to choose students of the right ability.

LlynTegid · 05/04/2023 18:52

Unconditional offers for those who have taken A levels or an equivalent , fair enough. Otherwise not, I agree with the OP.

LlynTegid · 05/04/2023 18:53

@jetadore I agree with you about the 50% target. It also seems to have replaced the divide that used to exist with the 11 plus with one at 18.

QuintanaRoo · 05/04/2023 18:57

Normally the unconditional offers are for students with predicted grades at or above the ucas points. So they’re trying to get the good students to firm them. It’s a marketing tool. They’re not giving unconditional offers to people predicted EEE. Seriously doubt it anyway and as others have said they still need to get the degree.

jetadore · 05/04/2023 18:58

LlynTegid · 05/04/2023 18:53

@jetadore I agree with you about the 50% target. It also seems to have replaced the divide that used to exist with the 11 plus with one at 18.

The irony is that although degree paying jobs pay more there aren’t that many of them to support 50% of the workforce, supply and demand. Further irony now that building trades are often even better paid these days.

Piggywaspushed · 05/04/2023 19:01

I take it your DS isn't taking up his unconditional then? So, asa marketing strategy, it hasn't worked.

JellyBabiesSaveLives · 05/04/2023 19:04

NewIdeasToday · 05/04/2023 18:41

Unconditional offers have been banned unless they are for a subject where decisions are based on things other than grades eg. an audition or portfolio.

So are you sure the offer is unconditional?

They haven't been banned. Universities are strongly discouraged from making an offer that is only unconditional if the student puts it as their firm choice - perhaps that's what you are thinking of.

Lincoln says it gives unconditionals if predicted grades are a long way above the grades they'd ask for; i.e. they know the student will cope with the degree course.

At open day, they seemed like a good, nurturing kind of place with a strong emphasis on good teaching - which perhaps places like Warwick and Imperial with their 4 A star students get away without?

2bazookas · 05/04/2023 19:08

You're confusing entering university with graduating from one.
If someone enters University with no interest in study, their subject, and does no work at all; they'll get thrown out long before finals exams. They will leave with a huge debt and no degree at all.

nicknamehelp · 05/04/2023 19:13

My ds got an unconditional offer but still studied hard and got great results. If they don't make grade on uni work they either fail and get kicked out or have to repeat the year so still need to work. Yes Lincoln gives out a lot of unconditional offers but they do have to work to get degree.

Poblano · 05/04/2023 19:13

One DS had an unconditional offer as he took a scholarship exam and did well. He took this up and is studying there now.

My other DS had an unconditional offer based on a programme he took part in in the sixth form aimed at fairly high achieving students. He had to submit a piece of work, if they received above a certain mark they had an unconditional offer. He didn't take this up as he wasn't keen on the university and the course wasn't quite right for him.

So lots of different reasons that universities, including ones ranked highly, make unconditional offers.

Goodread1 · 05/04/2023 20:02

Hi Op
I definitely think it's a reaction to effect of Pandemic Aftermath,
I hate to repeat it as its said so often
Nowadays mental health in regards of this so therefore they universities are giving leeway to this,

The thing is if they make it too easy , getting into any uni with this kind of mindset,
It will undermine, the university selwction system very idea somewhat, and people will think its like a Mickley mouse qualification

Makes total mockery of the university system

Newmumatlast · 05/04/2023 20:07

Easterfunbun · 05/04/2023 18:29

Well I never got an A-levels but I completed an OU degree. I mean it’s one thing getting a place on a degree and another thing seeing it through with a good grade.

Absolutely this. Getting in is only a part of it. And there can be many reasons someone didn't get the grades not just because they cannot be bothered. If those people want to take the risk and pay the extortionate fees for uni and do the hard graft, fair play to them. They'll perform badly if they don't bother applying themselves at uni and if they do and do well, then they deserve the degree.

I know people who had good A levels and tanked at uni by the way - some didnt put the work in and others did but it was beyond them. So if only those who did well at A level were allowed entry we would miss out in some very good people.

I should also say that you're wrong about people getting the same qualification whatever uni they go to. There are league tables for a reason and its undeniable that some institutions are preferred by some employers in some professions. You give law as an example degree and that is a profession where the university you go to can matter. Courses are also very different at different universities with different demands and optional units.

Yorkyyorkyork · 05/04/2023 20:07

I think degrees were devalued years ago. Places like University of Plymouth make it too simple to get a degree with their low entry points.

I know this because I'm one of them. I don't even have a GCSE in maths and yet I have a degree in engineering. Anywhere else, I wouldn't have been given a place with a Grade E. (I had to retake my GCSE maths as I was simply embarrassed about having a Grade E!)

I went to University in the 00s. I don't think I'm as well educated as those who went to better Universities.

Actually, University of Plymouth is a bit of a joke in the sector I work in 😳

Exasperatednow · 05/04/2023 20:12

Universities are really struggling for income streams. Since brexit and covid there are massively less overseas students. This is particularly affecting some Universities and those are the ones offering unconditional offers in the hope thar people commit and they can predict their income stream.

Eleganz · 05/04/2023 20:18

Money talks. Lincoln has plowed a lot of money into opening things like a medical school and so it is all about bums on seats and tuition fees in the bank.

fiftiesmum · 05/04/2023 20:34

There are quite a few universities who take students on with very low grades get one or two years of fees out of them and then fail them in the second year. Would have been better to not offer the unconditional place or to fail them in the first year

Paperbagsaremine · 05/04/2023 20:40

As someone said, Oxford used to give out EE offers - I had one! But they weren't afraid to chuck you out if you didn't do any work. I knew three people who were turfed out before Finals.

So I don't think the offer level devalues the degree at all. It's all about the course, the work, and the standards once people are there.

carriedout · 05/04/2023 20:46

No, they don't devalue degrees.