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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To leave toddler screaming?

79 replies

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 19:55

I’m really struggling with DS (2 years 4 months) and bedtimes. He was an absolute star until recently and then started trying it on if you like but only very slightly - he’d ask for another book and then whimper / whinge a bit but be fine after some gentle talk about sleep being important and so on.

Just recently he’s been awful. His routine is watches Night Garden on CBeebies then bath, teeth, milk and stories. It’s been like this for months so he knows. But he runs away when Night Garden finishes and then has an absolute screaming tantrum, really wild and sobbing and frantic, when changed and put in bath. Eventually calms down and is fine in pyjamas and so on and we read five books. Then bed. Except the screaming tantrum has returned when I put him in bed

I hate leaving him screaming but I honestly am not sure how else to deal with it. He does calm down eventually - put him to bed at 1940 and he’s chatting to himself now so not asleep but not wild either. But I just need some reassurance I’m doing the right thing and also if not how I should be dealing with it?

OP posts:

Totallyanonymousplease · 28/03/2023 20:36

I’d leave him and say I will be back in 1 minute to check on him. then quick back in And then 2 minutes - then 3. He’s cross because he’s not getting his own way. It’s ok for him to manage those emotions by himself imo (in a controlled way where he knows you’re there and coming back - the exact opposite of being abandoned!)

IMO it really is ok for kids to be sad, cross etc - in fact it’s probably necessary. I don’t think it’s right that any unhappiness needs to be immediately cured. Having a full range of emotions and working through them is part of being human.

Hatscats · 28/03/2023 20:36

Tell nursery to stop the nap too - mine suggested it before I did!

MrNook · 28/03/2023 20:39

Certainly no lying down with him, sitting in the room or the like

Oh the horror!

TheBirdintheCave · 28/03/2023 20:39

Could it be the cot?

My son is the same age and we've recently put him in a toddler bed rather than a cot as he was starting to fuss at naptimes and bedtimes (to the point of climbing out of the cot!) which he had never done before. It really did the trick. He was generally a good sleeper anyway but he barely stirs at all in his big boy bed.

We had a similar thing with the buggy. He was starting to really act up on our walk home and I eventually worked out that it was the presence of the buggy that was bothering him as I think he thought I was going to put him in it (I was taking it in case of rain because he's too heavy to carry). One day last week I decided to ditch it and just walk with him without the security of it and he's now happy as a clam :)

NoKnit · 28/03/2023 20:40

I don't think he needs to drop the nap. If he goes to nursery he'll need it. A 2 year old on average sleeps 12 hours in a 24 hour period. So even if he goes to sleep at 9 and wakes at 7 that is 10 and a 2 hour nap then he gets the right amount?

It's fine if he naps put him to bed later? Like 8pm. Seems totally normal to me.

I'm not in UK with horrendously early bedtimes though and is normal for kids here to nap until gone 3

Original poster

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 20:42

In some ways it will be a relief to drop the nap. The problem is if we’re out and about and he nods off in the car or falls asleep at nursery. He’s horrendously grumpy if you wake him after 30 minutes or similar! I think if he was waking at 7 am he’d probably not need to nap and go to bed at 7 but nursery is a bit of a spanner in the works … Still, he’s home Thursday - Sunday so will try no nap then.

Finally stopped chatting / singing so hoping he’s gone to sleep!

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mynameiscalypso · 28/03/2023 20:42

DS has a similar phase about the same age or maybe a little older. In his case, dropping the nap helped hugely but we had several weeks of 10pm bedtimes. It did pass though. I'm afraid I just gave in and let him get out of bed and watch TV with us / steal our dinner / play quietly with toys until he was ready to sleep.

littlebird17 · 28/03/2023 20:44

My dd will be 2 next month and we've had something similar, I would just sit next to his cot and rub his back or hold his hand if I were you op. It won't last forever promise.

In Fairness we don't do screens before bed because I've noticed it affects her behaviour massively. I would personally not have any screen time after dinner time.
If I need 5 mins to get whatever done I will let her watch something after her midday nap!

It's not easy op, but nothing with kids lasts forever

Original poster

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 20:45

In some ways I don’t really mind tweaking things so that we have a long bedtime routine with him in bed at 8, especially if it prevents those horrendous early starts I had months off! I go to bed at around 9 myself though so it can’t be too late.

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Original poster

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 20:45

nothing with kids lasts forever

this is my mantra just now!

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Thinkbiglittleone · 28/03/2023 20:45

Night Garden on CBeebies then bath, teeth, milk and stories

I'm assuming this is just a list and not in order as they need their teeth brushed after milk.

It sounds like a long bedtime routine. I would take out any TV stimulation 2 hours before bed. They don't need a bath every night, every other is perfectly fine, try to keep the routine short and sweet.

We did PJs, supper while we read, teeth, bed, 2 books in bed, night night cuddles. (Pop a bath in before PJs on a bath night)

Some kids really don't like the bars on their cot, can you take the sides off as a test to see how it goes?
Do they have a night light, are they in the dark?

lordspikey · 28/03/2023 20:47

Sounds just like my 2 year old. She's only just turned 2 and some days she naps others she doesn't. The days she naps are when she's at nursery but when I'm home with her I don't offer one unless I think she'll need it.

When she naps she doesn't sleep anything before 8.30, even if it's a short one. It can take up to 40 mins for her to fall asleep, even if I take her up later it always takes sooooo long. Either hubby or myself lay with her and she talks to herself until she nods off. I'm looking forward to the warmer weather so she can spend more time outside to tire her out before bed.

When she doesn't nap she's out like a light at 6.30pm but is up earlier the next day which means she has to have a nap otherwise she won't last and will then have a danger nap and bedtime will be even later.

Ugh the struggles!!!

Original poster

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 20:48

He does roll around a lot - just worried about him falling out.

I know what people are saying re screens but honestly anything else and he just doesn’t want to leave it. Yesterday was horrendous because he was playing out in the garden and he went absolutely berserk when I brought him in, much worse than tonight. Night Garden is nice and quite ‘calming’ somehow.

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Original poster

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 20:48

That sounds VERY similar to the stage we’re at, @lordspikey .

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Thinkbiglittleone · 28/03/2023 20:50

He does roll around a lot - just worried about him falling out

Pop a spare duvet in the floor to cushion his fall if you are worried about that.

SaveMeFromMyBoobs · 28/03/2023 20:50

You know your baby, there will be some parents that will tell you that they still rock their precious 25yo to sleep every night and has never so much as whimpered without them present.

If you being present stimulates him and makes it worse, then it stimulates him and makes it worse and it is best to leave him. I know a friend who had similar, screamed for hours if she was there, content and drifting asleep in seconds if she left. If he isn't sleeping though it could be time to adjust his napping schedule as suggested.

LouLou198 · 28/03/2023 20:52

Sounds like it is time to move him into a bed. Use a bed guard if you are worried about him falling out. Stop the tv too, just stick with the bedtime story.

Zola1 · 28/03/2023 20:52

I think 2y4m is maybe a funny sleep age. Our 2y4m has always been an angel, but recently she's up and down, shouting to the other kids, not settling etc. Her door is opposite ours so weirdly if I get up in the night she's quite often opened her bedroom door and is sitting in bed staring at me. It's vaguely terrifying (especially at 3am when in the darkness she says 'Mummy, my ipad?').
We've been basically just rolling with it and putting her back to bed, sitting outside the door etc until she settles, but she very rarely gets properly upset at bedtime. Also no naps here for a few months, sometimes by 630 she is almost asleep sitting up so she gets in the bath at that point. If she's less tired she's a witch to put down.
I'd agree he needs help to calm down and maybe a little reset on his bedtime routine and naps somewhere.

BurbageBrook · 28/03/2023 20:53

No, it's cruel to leave him and will just increase his sense of fear and possibly cause trauma. He's still so tiny.

Chubbycheeks0203 · 28/03/2023 20:54

Oh wow some of these replies make me laugh (otherwise I would get angry). We have a 25m old and going through similar, assumed it's to do with the 2 year regression. Ours is in a cot (would also try just walk off it like a step otherwise) and does have teeth brushed before milk (when sleepy why would you then disturb them by brushing teeth).

We haven't found the answer yet other than once we've established that he's not in pain etc. We let him moan in intervals with trying to sit with him, cuddle and play peakaboo with teddies. He's had a lot more night wakings too. Basically seems like he doesn't want to be separated.

Good luck OP, you know your bubba best x

aSofaNearYou · 28/03/2023 20:55

There's no point asking on here because it's such a polarising issue. Some would never think this was ok.

But FWIW, at 2 and given that he calmed down in 10 minutes, I think it's ok.

Username24680 · 28/03/2023 20:56

@NoKnit there’s really no issue with a 2 year old being in a cot at all, that’s ridiculous! Obviously if they’re climbing out or whatever then it’s dangerous and it’s time for the sides to come off but until that point, what’s the issue?

Mine is nearly 2y5m and is still in his cot. Personally I would remove any tv stimulation before bed. We do 5/5.30pm dinner, playtime while I tidy and do the dishes etc. 6pm bath, teeth, pjs, read 2/3 books then bed for 7pm. We do bath every 2nd night so he just has a bit more playtime when it’s not a bath night. We sit in an armchair in his room and he falls asleep on me then I put him in his cot. I know that’s a but frowned upon at this age and people thing they should be getting themselves to sleep but it works for us 🤷🏻‍♀️

DutchCowgirl · 28/03/2023 20:57

Is it a problem when he still naps at nursery but skips the nap on the days he is at home? My sons also had this phase, where nursery-days were much more tiring.

I also did the laundry, in the next room, just out of sight but the kids knew i was there.

Original poster

Justinthemiddle · 28/03/2023 21:13

It’s not a problem no. The main issue is that he may fall asleep in the car if we go anywhere though!

It is a funny age, I think there’s probably quite a lot going on with him developmentally as well, he’s learning loads of new words and colours and numbers and that’s great but he’s also becoming extremely opinionated shall we say!

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Mama1209 · 28/03/2023 22:15

It’s important not to let milk stagnate on teeth overnight as it will cause decay. That being said, it’s sometimes the only way to get baby to sleep so if that’s the case it’s a good idea to wipe teeth one baby is asleep

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